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Author Topic: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?  (Read 1232 times)

Miguel Dahl

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Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« on: June 02, 2019, 03:40:48 pm »

I used to work for another rental company and their «fat» antenna-cables were listed as RG-213 in the rental software. At my current job we have cables that look and feel the same. AFAIK these cables were bought from Sennheiser. When i look at Senns antenna booster AB3 they list «GZL5000». Out of curiosity, is the GZL5000 the «same» as RG-213? Is GZL5000 maybe just Sennheisers product name for RG-213?
« Last Edit: June 02, 2019, 06:34:57 pm by Miguel Dahl »
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Mac Kerr

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Re: GZL 5000 «same as» RG-213?
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2019, 05:01:02 pm »

I used to work for another rental company and their «fat» antenna-cables were listed as RG-213 in the rental software. At my current job we have cables that look and feel the same. AFAIK these cables were bought from Sennheiser. When i look at Senns antenna booster AB3 they list «GZL5000». Out of curiosity, is the GZL5000 the «same» as RG-213? Is GZL5000 maybe just Sennheisers product name for RG-213?

I can't find any information at all on a cable GLZ 5000. You can check the performance of pretty much any coax with the Times Microwave Calculator. In the extensive list on this calculator there is nothing that could be interpreted as GLZ5000. For an RG213 type cable Times Microwave LMR400 has slightly better performance.

Mac
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Miguel Dahl

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Re: GZL 5000 «same as» RG-213?
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2019, 06:16:02 pm »

I can't find any information at all on a cable GLZ 5000. You can check the performance of pretty much any coax with the Times Microwave Calculator. In the extensive list on this calculator there is nothing that could be interpreted as GLZ5000. For an RG213 type cable Times Microwave LMR400 has slightly better performance.

Mac

That's the reason I ask. I can't find any performance data on "GZL 5000". So I'm wondering if this is just a Sennheiser name for RG-213. Are they interchangeable/same?

My rule of thumb is at the frequencies we operate at (550-ish MHz, Band A Sennheiser) is that RG 213 is 21dB Attenuation @100m, and RG58 is 58dB@100m. Sort of ballpark.

I've been using this:

http://rfelektronik.se/manuals/Datasheets/Coaxial_Cable_Attenuation_Chart.pdf (This is a hobby-radio guy or something, so I guess his numbers are copy/paste from an unknown source)

*Edit: Edited header of the thread.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2019, 06:43:44 pm by Miguel Dahl »
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Mac Kerr

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Re: GZL 5000 «same as» RG-213?
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2019, 07:54:25 pm »

That's the reason I ask. I can't find any performance data on "GZL 5000". So I'm wondering if this is just a Sennheiser name for RG-213. Are they interchangeable/same?

Part of my point was that I don't see that number on Sennheiser's site either. Where are you getting that number? Recently I think Sennheiser has been recommending 9913 which has slightly better specs than RG213, but not quite as good as LMR400.

Using online calculators I get the following loss numbers at 550MHz through 100' of cable:
RG58   -   11.1 dB
RG8U  -    5.0 dB
RG8x  -     9.2 dB
RG213 -   5.0 dB
9913   -    3.2 dB
LMR400  3.0 dB

Of course these low loss cables (RG8, RG213, 9913, LMR400) are all about 1/2" in diameter, and if your kink them or crush them these numbers go out the window.

Mac
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Russell Ault

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2019, 11:53:28 pm »

I used to work for another rental company and their «fat» antenna-cables were listed as RG-213 in the rental software. At my current job we have cables that look and feel the same. AFAIK these cables were bought from Sennheiser. When i look at Senns antenna booster AB3 they list «GZL5000». Out of curiosity, is the GZL5000 the «same» as RG-213? Is GZL5000 maybe just Sennheisers product name for RG-213?

Judging by this product info sheet, GZL 5000 is an old (nearly discontinued, by the looks of it) line of Sennheiser coax. Specs look similar to LMR-240.

-Russ
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Miguel Dahl

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2019, 06:33:23 am »

I found out the cables we have are called Ecoflex 10, made by "ssb.de". It says 9,6 db loss @500MHz/100m.
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Miguel Dahl

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2019, 08:25:03 am »

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Miguel Dahl

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2019, 09:51:47 am »

So if the GZL cable is LMR-240-ish then I'd be good with one booster for 60 meters of the Ecoflex cable. I guess if I join two cables to get the 60 meters with a BNC male-male the drop would be negligible?

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Mac Kerr

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2019, 10:31:02 am »

So if the GZL cable is LMR-240-ish then I'd be good with one booster for 60 meters of the Ecoflex cable. I guess if I join two cables to get the 60 meters with a BNC male-male the drop would be negligible?

From those specs it looks like ballpark 6-8dB of loss over 60m. If you use a coupler there will be a slight additional loss, and you need to make sure to use a 50Ω barrel to mate with the 50Ω connectors on the cable. Do not use a barrel intended for video.

Mac
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Miguel Dahl

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2019, 06:51:48 am »

From those specs it looks like ballpark 6-8dB of loss over 60m. If you use a coupler there will be a slight additional loss, and you need to make sure to use a 50Ω barrel to mate with the 50Ω connectors on the cable. Do not use a barrel intended for video.

Mac

Thanks on the heads up on the barrels 50 ohm. May I ask what happens if I'd use a 75 Ohm? My thinking it's just sort of a very short stretch of the entire length.
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Miguel Dahl

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2020, 12:46:30 pm »

Can I bump this? What happens if I'd use a 75Ohm barrel instead of a 50?

« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 12:58:11 pm by Miguel Dahl »
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Henry Cohen

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2020, 01:41:18 pm »

Can I bump this? What happens if I'd use a 75Ohm barrel instead of a 50?

Presuming this is for a receive application and you use the current spec 75 ohm adapters (where the pins/jacks are the same size as 50 ohm connectors), all will be good; there'll be no losses of any significance.
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Miguel Dahl

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2020, 02:14:24 pm »

Presuming this is for a receive application and you use the current spec 75 ohm adapters (where the pins/jacks are the same size as 50 ohm connectors), all will be good; there'll be no losses of any significance.

It's indeed for receive. Thanks. I was under the impression that it's a close to very bad thing to use, even though I've used them on many occasions without hiccups.
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Ike Zimbel

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2020, 03:12:20 pm »

So if the GZL cable is LMR-240-ish then I'd be good with one booster for 60 meters of the Ecoflex cable. I guess if I join two cables to get the 60 meters with a BNC male-male the drop would be negligible?
Hey Miguel, I'm late to the party on this thread, but I'm curious about what actual cable lengths you are using. I noticed that you gave all specs in meters, but most of the replies from this side of the pond were in feet. Are you really running 60-100 meter antenna runs? 60m is 196', 100m is 328'. Both are really, really long cable runs.
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Miguel Dahl

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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2020, 04:07:17 pm »

Hey Miguel, I'm late to the party on this thread, but I'm curious about what actual cable lengths you are using. I noticed that you gave all specs in meters, but most of the replies from this side of the pond were in feet. Are you really running 60-100 meter antenna runs? 60m is 196', 100m is 328'. Both are really, really long cable runs.

This is an "old" thread regarding what I was trying to accomplish at the time I started it. But I'm currently up to 40m runs, because I didn't get the extra 20 from my boss, haha. So at the current state 40m. What I want is 60m due do cable paths and not getting physical structural shadows from 40m runs, LOS in other words. Even though 40m worked good last time with obstructions.

I don't think I've ever stated 60-100M in cable runs. 60M would be max. My only mention of 100m in this thread would be the specs of a cable.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 04:11:57 pm by Miguel Dahl »
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Re: Sennheisers "GZL 5000" "same as" RG-213?
Ā« Reply #14 on: February 03, 2020, 04:07:17 pm Ā»


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