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Author Topic: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please  (Read 1854 times)

Danny Reid

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First in all of the pro audio forums it's the same , 100+ views and VERY little help , C'mon if you can help a bit by shedding some light for someone please don't pass us by . Now my ? I know most of the 600mhz is gonna be prohibited in 2020. OK , my ? is what do you do with the units that you have on that band? are they paperweights ? What happens if we just continue to use them ? Will the imperial storm troopers come and haul us away with our IEM's hanging from our ears ? I have heard that if you live in bigger cities interference may be much more that in smaller cities .Also it seems that there is a SMALL portion of the 600mhz that will remain open , what if your device can use those Freq. ? Will that work ? . Please , If you know anything on this subject , share the knowledge ,,Thanks
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Riley Casey

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2019, 11:19:00 am »

Sell them to users in countries that permit 600 Mhz operation for wireless mics is a popular course of action.  The storm troopers are unlikely to come for you but it's actually worse than that.  The lawyers will come for you if you show up in some scan as interfering with bandwidth that some mega-corp paid millions for.

Geert Friedhof

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2019, 11:20:05 am »

Forgive me my ignorance.

I am probably one of those 100+ First readers not helping you. And that is because i don't have a good answer for you. But i can only know that because i read your opening post. Now, if the topic title had made any sense i might not have read it...

So now i am giving you an answer which doesn't help you very much, but at least it is something.

Real world enough?
« Last Edit: May 22, 2019, 11:25:51 am by Geert Friedhof »
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Dave Pluke

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2019, 11:30:24 am »

Also it seems that there is a SMALL portion of the 600mhz that will remain open , what if your device can use those Freq. ? Will that work ?

Provided that device does NOT have the capability of also performing in the "illegal" 600Mhz frequencies, yes.  Not that is ISN'T operating - that it CAN'T operate.  I don't make the rules - I just 'splain 'em.

Otherwise, what Riley said.

Manufacturers had been offering attractive trade-in deals toward U.S. compliant gear.  If one has missed that boat, sell it offshore.

Dave


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Don T. Williams

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2019, 11:39:34 am »

Danny, one of the reasons that I, and probably others that read the forum, don't answer every post is that I don't know all the answers.  We are all trying to learn more about live audio.  For you, I think the answers fully cover your technical question.  I hope this helps for the rest of your question.
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Russell Ault

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #5 on: May 22, 2019, 12:44:35 pm »

[..] what do you do with the units that you have on that band? are they paperweights ? What happens if we just continue to use them ? Will the imperial storm troopers come and haul us away with our IEM's hanging from our ears ? [...] Also it seems that there is a SMALL portion of the 600mhz that will remain open , what if your device can use those Freq. ? [...]

For what it's worth, this is a topic that comes up every so often in the Wireless section of this forum; the most recently posted thread there is "Disposing of Audio Technica D band (650-680) gear", which addresses part of your question directly.

The Internet is also full of articles from reputable sources that answer all of these questions in detail. The summarized version of them is:
  • Using wireless equipment on illegal frequencies will be highly unreliable and can expose you to significant fines or even criminal prosecution.
  • A very small amount of spectrum will be available in the middle of the 600 MHz band called the "duplex gap", but half of this will be reserved for licensed users only, and the maximum power output you can legally use in the duplex gap is much lower than what we've been accustomed to using, so only wireless microphones specifically designed (or modified by the manufacturer, as Shure has done for some UHF-R equipment) for duplex gap use can be operated there legally.
-Russ
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drew gandy

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2019, 04:25:25 pm »

Riley gave you a good answer.  I'll sum it up in a little different way:

A) Paperweight.  Let it remind you of the good times you used to have.

B) Utilize a trade-in program by the manufacturer to buy something new that operates in a band that is less likely to be illegal/problematic.  I find the trade-in idea to be more attractive if you have a large inventory than just one or two systems but it might be better than nothing.

C) Sell it into another part of the world. 

D) Leave it somewhere such that your enemies will find it and perform illegal actions. 

E) Continue to use it and face the consequences.  Many choose to drive over the speed limit despite the consequences (higher risk of injury or death, vehicle loss, financial penalties and/or license revocation).  You too can play this game.  Our storm troopers are busy doing other things so you're not likely to be hauled off.  But you may find that you:  1) will be fined or face a lawsuit, 2) will interrupt someone else's services (phone calls, pokemon Go, emergency services), 3) will get so much interference that your device is unusable. 
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Scott Helmke

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #7 on: May 22, 2019, 04:56:30 pm »

  • A very small amount of spectrum will be available in the middle of the 600 MHz band called the "duplex gap", but half of this will be reserved for licensed users only, and the maximum power output you can legally use in the duplex gap is much lower than what we've been accustomed to using, so only wireless microphones specifically designed (or modified by the manufacturer, as Shure has done for some UHF-R equipment) for duplex gap use can be operated there legally.

More to the point, a whole lot of people clinging to their 600MHz gear are going to try to fit into that gap. Results are likely to be poor as a result.
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Kevin Maxwell

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #8 on: May 22, 2019, 06:17:30 pm »

More to the point, a whole lot of people clinging to their 600MHz gear are going to try to fit into that gap. Results are likely to be poor as a result.

How many times are you in an environment where other wireless mics and IEM systems are competing with you for the same bandwidth?

Years ago I was working a big convention at a large hotel at Disney World. I discovered that some how 2 wireless systems were tuned to the exact same frequencies. I don't remember how I found this out because they weren't interfering with each other because they were far enough apart in that facility. 
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Scott Holtzman

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2019, 06:21:07 pm »

More to the point, a whole lot of people clinging to their 600MHz gear are going to try to fit into that gap. Results are likely to be poor as a result.

If you search the wireless forum you will find a link to a map of the US and turn up dates for the 600Mhz cellular license.  My market (Cleveland OH) just started coming up and it is already busy and essentially unusable. 

Do you really want to be doing a wedding gig and in the middle of the groom's drunkalog the mic cuts out?

The reason you are getting a combination of BS and snark (and a few tidbits of wisdom) is the following:

1 - This forum especially has very high expectations of users, that certainly includes and intelligent subject, you failed out of the gate on that one.

2 - If you hang out in the wireless forum you will see some of the top RF engineers in the country on the highest earining arena tours actually take the time to answer questions.  To be able to tap that resource, to me, is frankly humbling.  It's the same in the audio forum but the RF forum in here is truly a special place.

3 - Your question was not one seeking knowledge.  You outright asked for emotional validation if you can get away with breaking the law. 

4 - The way you are approaching this makes my guess you are probably a musician in the band or a sound guy for a cover band or other type of local production that plays in bars and other makeshift venues.

RF is one area you just can't cheap out with and get any results. 

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Scott AKA "Skyking" Holtzman

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Re: Can I get a real world answer to a real world question please
« Reply #9 on: May 22, 2019, 06:21:07 pm »


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