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Author Topic: rider question protocol  (Read 5239 times)

Dan Godwin

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rider question protocol
« on: April 23, 2019, 07:28:19 pm »

I received a rider for an upcoming performance I'm helping out with.  I have a few questions and asked the promoter if I should reach out directly to the musician or go through him with questions.  He answered other questions I had, but didn't give direction about the questions.  Should I reach out again to the promoter or go directly to the musician?  Thanks.
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Jamin Lynch

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2019, 07:58:08 pm »

I always go to the bands road manager whenever I have questions.
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Mike Monte

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2019, 10:02:48 pm »

I received a rider for an upcoming performance I'm helping out with.  I have a few questions and asked the promoter if I should reach out directly to the musician or go through him with questions.  He answered other questions I had, but didn't give direction about the questions.  Should I reach out again to the promoter or go directly to the musician?  Thanks.

If the promoter booked you (which is probably the case) and the rider was sent to you "via" the promoter ( band/musician emailed the rider to the promoter, the promoter [after reading it carefully...] in turn forwarded it to you) it would be best for you get answers from the promoter (the guy with the check book).

Going directly to the band would be ideal but in reality, if meeting a rider means that you will need to bring (or rent in) more gear (and charge extra for that gear) the promoter will have to agree to it - in writing.


 
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Matthias McCready

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2019, 10:39:05 pm »

Should I reach out again to the promoter or go directly to the musician?  Thanks.

Out of respect I would contact the promotor one more time, letting them know you will be contacting the band and to see if there is anything else you can do.

"I want to make sure everything goes smoothly for event X, and I have some questions which would be best answered by band x. I know you are busy so unless I hear otherwise from you I will be contacting them tomorrow. Looking forward to working with you, and let me know if there is anything else I can do for you or to prep for the event."

Do the best you can to contact the appropriate individuals. As suggested get a feel for what the promotor is willing to do and what the band needs. If there is a large discrepancy between expectations, certainly reach out, bands can be very accommodating when they know you are doing everything within your ability. Make the promotor aware of any discrepancies, especially before offering items to the band. In such case where expectations are clearly and reasonably laid out and the promotor is unwilling to abide by the rider (ie item x must be provided for the show to go on), this may not be a gig you want to be involved with.

 Sometimes a band doesn't get back to you, or a promotor can be cagey about details. As long as you have made your best efforts to communicate and to manage expectations, that is acceptable.

Last week I had solo artist for a small conference, the promotor and I could not get a hold of him for weeks ahead of the event. The night before at 11:00PM the guy finally calls back! Keep in mind I was going to be loading up at 3:00AM. I was able to scramble resources and to get him what he needed, although I would not have if it had not been easy. Due to the communication problems, the promotor will not be using the artist again. Unfortunately the artist lost any future work before he even played a note.

This goes both ways. Make every reasonable attempt to communicate and accommodate.
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William Schnake

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2019, 10:41:58 pm »

I always talk directly with the technical person from the band.  I have found that the Promoter only wants to be assured that everything has been worked out with the talent or that we will need to bring in additional equipment and it is going to cost x amount.   At that point, the Promoter can decide if they want to incur any additional cost or not.

Bill
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DavidTurner

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2019, 10:56:45 pm »

This:

I always talk directly with the technical person from the band.  I have found that the Promoter only wants to be assured that everything has been worked out with the talent or that we will need to bring in additional equipment and it is going to cost x amount.   At that point, the Promoter can decide if they want to incur any additional cost or not.

Bill
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Luke Geis

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2019, 02:30:23 am »

There is no breach of contract by contacting the band's technical team first. You can tell them exactly what you are bringing and what you were paid to provide. It gives you the opportunity to work out what you MUST provide and what you may NOT NEED to provide. Now if the band is not willing to bend on things that you were not initially instructed to provide, then you can go to the promoter and work out the issues of how things will be billed and paid for beyond what was initially spec'd out. If you talk to the band and they say you MUST have a Neuman U87 for a vocal mic and a full line array side fill setup, you can then go to the promoter and fill them in on what's up. The promoter will then be able to work out further contract deals with the band to either fit the budget or pay to comply with the demands.

Typically when a job goes to bid, the riders are included or at the very least the promoter will include all the differing needs on the request in order to get a good estimate. Technical details like desk swaps, sharing of backline and stage space will usually be the large parts of the demands. The headliner usually sets the pace for what the PA must have and the local and supporting acts get whatever is left in the budget. The only way to know what those parameters are is to have conversations between both the promoter and the band's technical team. 

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Bob Cap

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2019, 02:25:25 pm »

There is no breach of contract by contacting the band's technical team first. You can tell them exactly what you are bringing and what you were paid to provide. It gives you the opportunity to work out what you MUST provide and what you may NOT NEED to provide. Now if the band is not willing to bend on things that you were not initially instructed to provide, then you can go to the promoter and work out the issues of how things will be billed and paid for beyond what was initially spec'd out. If you talk to the band and they say you MUST have a Neuman U87 for a vocal mic and a full line array side fill setup, you can then go to the promoter and fill them in on what's up. The promoter will then be able to work out further contract deals with the band to either fit the budget or pay to comply with the demands.

Typically when a job goes to bid, the riders are included or at the very least the promoter will include all the differing needs on the request in order to get a good estimate. Technical details like desk swaps, sharing of backline and stage space will usually be the large parts of the demands. The headliner usually sets the pace for what the PA must have and the local and supporting acts get whatever is left in the budget. The only way to know what those parameters are is to have conversations between both the promoter and the band's technical team.

Remember this..."You got the old rider"  Go from there.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2019, 05:09:59 pm »


Last week I had solo artist for a small conference, the promotor and I could not get a hold of him for weeks ahead of the event. The night before at 11:00PM the guy finally calls back! Keep in mind I was going to be loading up at 3:00AM.
I had a case like that years ago (before the internet) and everything was sent via fax.

I could not get a stage layout or any information.

So the day of the gig I load up my normal setup.  The band showed up AFTER door were open, so we are scrambling.

The manager asked why I didn't have things setup via the stage plot.  I told him I never got it, when did he send it?

He said right before they left (it was a 5 hour drive).  At that time I was at the venue with my system setup waiting on the band to arrive-at their scheduled sound check time.

Sure enough, when I got back to the office, the stage plot was sitting in my fax machine-----------

And the gig went downhill from there-but I won't go there----  We've all had those types of shows where you just want to walk out on the stage and punch the artist in front of the crowd for being an idiot-but I didn't.
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Roland Clarke

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Re: rider question protocol
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2019, 03:34:18 am »

Almost all riders contain a contact number and email for those who have the final say.  In terms of sound that is almost certainly the band engineer.  He will know what they have specced, what they must have and what they can work with.  If at that point they require something you donít have, they may have it themselves or be able to bring it.  If they donít, then is the time to talk to whoever holds the purse strings and discuss potential additional costs. 

Often with riders, you will find that things are out of date.  Sometimes line-ups have changed, certain things listed they may be carrying themselves, I.e. ear systems, radios, specific mics and backline.  Most things are negotiable, for example, Iím doing cover for a local venue with a small stage, we had an ex chart topping act though a couple of months back wanting 8 mixes on 12 monitors.  The stage is very small, they ended up with 4 wedge mixes on 4 wedges and an ear mix.  They specced Digico, Midas pro 6, Avid venue or S6l, show went off on a QU 32.  Good show, sounded good and they were happy.  Even if you have exactly what they ask for on the rider, itís good practice to ring and check, then, confirm whatís agreed on an email to cover your arse!
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Re: rider question protocol
¬ę Reply #9 on: April 25, 2019, 03:34:18 am ¬Ľ


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