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[John Mcleod]

As always gentlemen. ..
Some excellent advice here

[Brian Hancock]

Would probably add that an 88 rig with the correct amp would allow you an easy path to the newer vtx line in the future perhaps when they start hitting the used market in 3 to 5 years ... vertex with v5 is an easy cross rent too and cheaply done and readily avaliable not air about your area but i3 may may not be?

88s and v5 will also be one of those... may not be first on the rider list but any touring act not carrying has probably played on it and it is a known entity in that way ... so you may not have to meet that specifically with your work but it will make your day easier on a 1 off ... I've heard 88s sound great and like crap all based on the foh / system tech.

[John Penkala]

Hello gentleman
Were looking at getting a little array setup and locally we can get some 4888 but we thought Clair i3 may be also up our alley..

IMO, 4888's are the new KF850.

[Chris Hindle]

IMO, 4888's are the new KF850.

Nice one.
You see them everywhere, everyone knows how to use them, not the best, but get the job done.
Just like ye old 58.
Chris.

[Jim McKeveny]

IMO, 4888's are the new KF850.

Ouch!.....and likely true.

[brian maddox]

IMO, 4888's are the new KF850.

a lot of truth there actually.  Much like the 88s, the 850s were a box that sounded really good when processed correctly and deployed correctly and not nearly so good when corners were cut or people decided they could "make them sound better" with their own presets/processing.

[Tim McCulloch]

a lot of truth there actually.  Much like the 88s, the 850s were a box that sounded really good when processed correctly and deployed correctly and not nearly so good when corners were cut or people decided they could "make them sound better" with their own presets/processing.

Yepper, and system owners messing with factory processing is *part* of what made VerTec a gambling decision the first 14 years of it's life.  The other part was that the factory processing, up to V3.x wasn't particularly well done, and until V4, was unlocked and open to owner/end user changes that mostly made the systems sound worse.

Back when Christian Heil and the vDosc waveguild started the vertical array era of live sound, l'Acoustic was wise to black-box all processing; and in the USA the unenviable job of convincing American system owners that sending $1m to France didn't give the owners the right mess with the rig fell to Jeff Cox and Paul Baumann.

When Paul went to JBL, one of the first things he did was convince them that all future processing needed locks.  When V4 was released - with major sonic improvements - I'm sure there was great wailing and gnashing of teeth when some owners found out they couldn't alter every parameter in the crossover.

Coming back full circle to the 4888/KF850 comparison, my bet is the 4888 rigs that remain will be exactly like most of the 850 out there: on old processing and power, as firms with significant ITech HD investments are likely to move up to VTX or VTX-A rather than power a legacy product that's not in significant demand.

[Jim McKeveny]

There is a reason why the first question every BE asks is....Vertec Huh?  Are you running V5?

Despite their enhanced self-regard, the BE is not a big influencer regarding these decisions.

The requirement for Crown branded amps was a major pushback on the V5 protocol and VTX.  L' Acoustics and D&B seem to better balance amp cost & service life vs. features. In a networked system a color display on every amp is an unnecessary cost and distraction and point of failure. At a system demo, racks of high heat, high fan noise, high backstage light pollution, idling I-Tech HDs are a non-starter. Sound gear needs to work perfectly and be unseen.

[TJ (Tom) Cornish]

Despite their enhanced self-regard, the BE is not a big influencer regarding these decisions.

The requirement for Crown branded amps was a major pushback on the V5 protocol and VTX.  L' Acoustics and D&B seem to better balance amp cost & service life vs. features. In a networked system a color display on every amp is an unnecessary cost and distraction and point of failure. At a system demo, racks of high heat, high fan noise, high backstage light pollution, idling I-Tech HDs are a non-starter. Sound gear needs to work perfectly and be unseen.

While not disagreeing with the main points of your assessment, I suspect the BOM cost of a $6500 ITHD4x3500 is around $1200, with the color screen maybe being $100 of that.  The vast majority of the cost is R&D and support amortized over a very small number of units.  I doubt pulling the screen out would change the price of the amp.

I haven't personally had trouble with fan noise - for me it's the movers that raise the noise floor in the room, not the amps, but I can see your point in certain situations.

[David Sturzenbecher]

Despite their enhanced self-regard, the BE is not a big influencer regarding these decisions.

The requirement for Crown branded amps was a major pushback on the V5 protocol and VTX.  L' Acoustics and D&B seem to better balance amp cost & service life vs. features. In a networked system a color display on every amp is an unnecessary cost and distraction and point of failure. At a system demo, racks of high heat, high fan noise, high backstage light pollution, idling I-Tech HDs are a non-starter. Sound gear needs to work perfectly and be unseen.

High Backstage light pollution?  You can turn those screens off.  Or allow them to turn off after a minute of not using them.

If you want to find ways to discredit the iTechHD line, the idea of spending $500 a unit for an obsolete Cobranet chipset would be at the top of the list.

[ProSoundWeb Community]