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Author Topic: Kick bins and tops for labs.  (Read 5933 times)

Mark Wilkinson

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #30 on: March 01, 2019, 09:33:46 am »

What??!! No!!!

That would short all 4 amps together. And let the magic smoke out very quickly.

If the amplifiers for each passband are the same just use one sense line.


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Haha,  Danger Will Robinson...

The output from the processor goes to all amps' parallel inputs (subject to same passband and maintaining a 600 ohm load.)
The sense line should go on the amp with the highest voltage gain. Otherwise there will be no protection on amps with more gain than the amp the sense line is hooked to.
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John L Nobile

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #31 on: March 01, 2019, 12:21:31 pm »

What??!! No!!!

That would short all 4 amps together. And let the magic smoke out very quickly.

If the amplifiers for each passband are the same just use one sense line.


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Probably didn't explain that very well. Easier to picture with banana plugs and transfer that method to your speakons.

I'm still using older amps with banana terminals for my MSL3's and 650's. Amps are big and heavy but they stay in one room so I never have to lift them.
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Daniel Martini

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #32 on: March 01, 2019, 04:00:57 pm »

Haha,  Danger Will Robinson...

The output from the processor goes to all amps' parallel inputs (subject to same passband and maintaining a 600 ohm load.)
The sense line should go on the amp with the highest voltage gain. Otherwise there will be no protection on amps with more gain than the amp the sense line is hooked to.


Ok this makes sense and I will do this. For the record the mackies have banana outs and I will be using those instead of speakons. I understand now that you only need one amp sensing (and all the amps are the same so thats not an issue). The speakers and processor are still on there way (From Florida Ugh) so will experiment when they get here and keep you guys updated. HOWEVER I still don't understand why I need to connect one side of an amp to "Lo Sense" and one side to "Hi Sense". Why can't I just use one side and run a full range signal??  Isn't the "LO" for subwoofers or is the MSL3 bi amped??  Ive never worked with EP-4 connectors sooo. If anyone is in the the Seattle area who is familiar with vintage Meyer rigs I would love a hand setting this up and will compensate handsomely! Pm Me.
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Steven Eudaly

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #33 on: March 01, 2019, 04:32:20 pm »

Yes, the MSL3 must be bi-amped. Use amp channel 1 to run the LF section and channel 2 for the HF section. Connect the sense lines to their corresponding channels.  There are two different sense channels because each passband requires different limiting.

EDIT: You could, presumably, swap the EP4 connectors for NL4 pretty easily. If your M1400s have NL4 connectors that are set up to drive both channels down one cable (I cannot seem to find any info online about whether or not they do) you could really really simplify and standardize your cabling. Use the banana jacks for the sense leads and a single speakon output to drive both channels of the cabinet.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2019, 04:48:52 pm by Steven Eudaly »
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Art Welter

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #34 on: March 01, 2019, 04:42:59 pm »


 Why can't I just use one side and run a full range signal??  Isn't the "LO" for subwoofers or is the MSL3 bi amped??  Ive never worked with EP-4 connectors sooo.
The MSL3 is bi-amped, a pair of the EP-4 connectors drive the pair of 12" ("LO"), the other pair drive the high frequency driver ("HI").
Early MSL3 also had piezo tweeters passively crossed in with the HF driver.
Each cabinet has an in and out EP-4, so a single four conductor cord from the amp rack and jumper cords can be used to drive multiple cabinets.

Having separate sense voltage lines allow the low and high drivers to be protected for their individual voltage vs frequency parameters.

PS. Same as Steven E wrote at the same time, about 40 years after the cabinets were made :^)

Art
« Last Edit: March 01, 2019, 04:47:26 pm by Art Welter »
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Daniel Martini

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #35 on: March 01, 2019, 07:45:46 pm »

OHH! Ok now I understand!! Thanks Steven and Art! (Btw love your designs Art). I'm still gonna have a professional come and wire this up for me when they arrive. I hate to say It but this is over my head as I've only been doing this for about 5 years. Would rather have it done correctly. So like I said anyone in the PNW who is up for a challenge or any recommendations for meyer pros in the northwest please contact/let me know! Will definitely keep you guys updated with pics and info.
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Daniel Martini

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #36 on: March 16, 2019, 06:33:47 pm »

Hi guys! Meyers came in!!!! You guys were right they are MASSIVE. I have no idea how im gonna get them on labs except to buy a hoist or something :/

Anyway Art, Steven I know you said these were bi-amped but i only see one input and still don't understand the amp channel 1 to lows and channel 2 to highs thing. Like I literally don't understand how to wire channel 1 & 2 and combine them together to one output (presumably putting out 850 watts if my math is correct) if that is what everyone is suggesting. Was going to run 8 meyers off 4 mackie amps with two running per amp but if they need to be biamped then i don't see this happening. Very much a novice at this level of pro sound btw. Here are some picture! ...

https://i.imgur.com/SaNcYBW.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/eKCxpY2.jpg
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Dave Garoutte

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #37 on: March 16, 2019, 08:09:27 pm »

Note that there are four pins on the connector.
Two for lows and two for highs.
Which is which I can't say.
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Scott Holtzman

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #38 on: March 16, 2019, 08:09:31 pm »

Hi guys! Meyers came in!!!! You guys were right they are MASSIVE. I have no idea how im gonna get them on labs except to buy a hoist or something :/

Anyway Art, Steven I know you said these were bi-amped but i only see one input and still don't understand the amp channel 1 to lows and channel 2 to highs thing. Like I literally don't understand how to wire channel 1 & 2 and combine them together to one output (presumably putting out 850 watts if my math is correct) if that is what everyone is suggesting. Was going to run 8 meyers off 4 mackie amps with two running per amp but if they need to be biamped then i don't see this happening. Very much a novice at this level of pro sound btw. Here are some picture! ...

https://i.imgur.com/SaNcYBW.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/eKCxpY2.jpg
The one input has 4 pins 2 are +/- for highs and two are for +/- on lows

The Meyer processor splits the highs and lows.  Let's just take one amp and one speaker.  L/R from board to processor input,. LF output from processor to channel 2 input on amp,. HF from processor to channel 1 input on amp.  Channel 1 output of amp to HF input on speaker,. Channel 2 output of amp to LF input on speaker.


Not sure about the 850 watt thing, just leave that alone for now. Once you get them playing we can talk about voltage limiter settings for protection.

As far as moving them, to say you have a task ahead of you with the logistics on those things is an understatement.  You can't get too big a caster for your wheel boards.  If I had to move those I would be looking at some 18" wheels so I could push it with one finger.   (I am only partially kidding).  Maybe you can get one of those forklifts with the sulkie on the back.  Just tell the clubs you need a 30" aisle for your material handling stuff.  ROFL.

Have fun

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Daniel Martini

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Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #39 on: March 18, 2019, 02:20:30 am »

Hahaha. Did a little research on here... looks like this might suffice! https://www.amazon.com/Wesco-260002-Hydraulic-Pedalift-Capacity/dp/B000KL38W6?source=ps-sl-shoppingads-lpcontext&psc=1

Thoughts?

Also Scott thanks for the walk through of the wiring! However according to your instructions, If i wire both left and right outputs from my amp into one ep-4 input connection into the msl then that means I'm only able to run one speaker off one amp? I was told I would be able to run all 8 msl's off 4 mackies??
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Kick bins and tops for labs.
« Reply #39 on: March 18, 2019, 02:20:30 am »


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