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Author Topic: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?  (Read 2707 times)

Jeremy Young

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2019, 01:10:21 pm »

I haven't had a chance to listen to them yet, but the specs on the Yamaha DXS15XLF (89 lbs) and passive CXS15XLF (79 lbs) might make them worth considering.


Hi Mike, you pointed something out here that I seem to have completely missed on my first post.  Which is to consider the 15" versions of some of the subs.  I don't know why I immediately looked at the 18" ones but I could trim some weight for sure with a 15" BR box.  Those Yamaha cabs look very nice but I am concerned about that fabric-on-the-outside grille holding up long term.  I guess time will tell.  The powered version with Dante would allow me to use it as a Dante break-out for my current powered tops too, which would save a little cabling.  My powered monitors and Rig B mains all use powercon, I wish more of the powered subs I've been considering had that option to standardize my cables and provide a little more ruggedness to one particular vibration-related point of failure.  Thanks for the tip!
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Brown Bear Sound
Victoria BC Canada

Jeremy Young

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2019, 01:17:44 pm »

Just a quick FWIW, there are a lot of people (including DJs) that are happy with a 12" tapped horn which gets to around 55Hz. Obviously it won't drop low, but you can get a lot of "kick" from a fairly small box. For live rock, it might be just what you need.

Chris


Hi Chris, that's the kind of feedback I'm looking for on these wee-little subs. 

My concern with lack of extension is that it will sound one-notey with walking bass lines etc.  I know I'm happy with 40hz extension (Both rig A and B can deliver that easily now) but I don't know how much bass and kick FUNdamental I'd lose with a 50-55hz cutoff point.  I've tried high-passing my current subs as a listening test, but it's not really a fair comparison since the cutoff slope won't match the box I'm trying to imitate.  I used to have some 15" W-bins loaded with JBL drivers that didn't go very low and I really didn't enjoy mixing on them, but it was a pretty old design and likely not optimized anywhere near what a current production product can deliver so probably not a fair comparison.

Is your experience with the Danley THmini or a DIY type tapped horn?  Most of the reviews I read on the THmini talk about how great it sounds for it's size.  My question is, if I close my eyes will I still think it's impressive?
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Brown Bear Sound
Victoria BC Canada

Nathan Riddle

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2019, 02:00:44 pm »

Is your experience with the Danley THmini or a DIY type tapped horn?  Most of the reviews I read on the THmini talk about how great it sounds for it's size.  My question is, if I close my eyes will I still think it's impressive?

Same output as 118 above 50hz I've been told.

For kick/bass music I think it will be more than adequate.
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Rob Spence

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2019, 02:47:12 pm »


Hi Lou,


I don't get off "the rock" (Vancouver Island) often but in the grand scheme of things you're very close-by.  I very much appreciate your insight.  I've heard from several folks that the TH118 is easy up stairs which is hard for me to imagine because my Orbit Shifter is NOT, haha.  There is a definite difference in height, depth and weight, as well as the fact that the OS-Pro is a bit top-heavy with the driver in the top part of the cabinet versus the TH118 design. 


That's a very generous offer and if I find the time to do so I will send you a PM and take you up on that.  I'd love to hear a TH118 first-hand and maybe wheel it around.  It would offer the output/extension/brand matching I'm looking for across both rigs since I will likely upgrade the ZXA5 to some kind of SM60F/SM96/SH95 when I've gotten a little more return on it.

What were you hauling prior to the Danley rig that you found tougher to move around? 


Appreciate the thoughts, and good luck with the new location!  Welcome to the PNW

I now have TH118s as well as KW181s. The pair of Danleys replaced 4 JTR Growlers.

The Growlers did fine for me for a long time. They were first gen models bought new. I powered the 4 with a QSC PL6.0.

My problem was moving and transporting them. I added caster boards but 4 used up too much space. To get around that I stacked and strapped them. However, the handles were not in a useful configuration for me and even two of us struggled to stack & unstuck.

The 2 TH118s use about the same trailer space but they go lower and louder than the 4 Growlers.

I (69yo) can move them myself. Surprised the heck out of me.

I use them generally under a pair of EV QRX212s per side, mostly outdoors.

My B rig is ZXa5s over KW181s. Sometimes one sub per side and sometimes with a pair. Usually indoors.
I like the form factor of the KW181. Not too heavy and it rolls nice. I wish there were another pair of handles for lifting when on the wheels though.



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Helge A Bentsen

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2019, 04:01:42 pm »

What's your budget for this?

My favorite compact "I can carry it everywhere myself"-rig is d&b Y7P/YSub.
It's pricey and the SQ is probably higher than your "A" rig, but it fits nicely into "Buy once, cry once".

The whole system breaks down to 5 items,
2U amp rack
Dual flight case for Y7P+stand adapters and cables.
2x Ysub
A bag for the loudspeaker stands.

I've done both talking heads and regular concerts with this system, very happy with it.

On the budget side I would look for a deal on a Presonus SL328/SL18s-system.
Dave Gunness did some work on that, it sound absolutely fantastic for the price.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2019, 04:09:21 pm by Helge A Bentsen »
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Jeremy Young

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2019, 04:19:27 pm »

I now have TH118s as well as KW181s. The pair of Danleys replaced 4 JTR Growlers.

The Growlers did fine for me for a long time. They were first gen models bought new. I powered the 4 with a QSC PL6.0.

My problem was moving and transporting them. I added caster boards but 4 used up too much space. To get around that I stacked and strapped them. However, the handles were not in a useful configuration for me and even two of us struggled to stack & unstuck.

The 2 TH118s use about the same trailer space but they go lower and louder than the 4 Growlers.

I (69yo) can move them myself. Surprised the heck out of me.

I use them generally under a pair of EV QRX212s per side, mostly outdoors.

My B rig is ZXa5s over KW181s. Sometimes one sub per side and sometimes with a pair. Usually indoors.
I like the form factor of the KW181. Not too heavy and it rolls nice. I wish there were another pair of handles for lifting when on the wheels though.




Thanks Rob that's great intel, especially regarding the Growlers.  The Orbit Shifters I own are quite easy for me to move across solid ground and/or tilt into a van or onto a dock, but up 23 stairs... no thanks! 


Have you tried hauling those TH118's up any stairs by yourself?  How are the KW181's to lift and walk with?  This body has half the years on it that yours does, so if you can do it, I *should* be fine, or else I need to more closely examine other parts of my life.
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Brown Bear Sound
Victoria BC Canada

Jeremy Young

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2019, 04:20:39 pm »

Same output as 118 above 50hz I've been told.

For kick/bass music I think it will be more than adequate.


Well that's very interesting... thanks Nathan.  Any experience personally or just what you've heard?
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Brown Bear Sound
Victoria BC Canada

Jeremy Young

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2019, 04:26:57 pm »

What's your budget for this?

My favorite compact "I can carry it everywhere myself"-rig is d&b Y7P/YSub.
It's pricey and the SQ is probably higher than your "A" rig, but it fits nicely into "Buy once, cry once".

The whole system breaks down to 5 items,
2U amp rack
Dual flight case for Y7P+stand adapters and cables.
2x Ysub
A bag for the loudspeaker stands.

I've done both talking heads and regular concerts with this system, very happy with it.

On the budget side I would look for a deal on a Presonus SL328/SL18s-system.
Dave Gunness did some work on that, it sound absolutely fantastic for the price.


Hi Helge,


Thanks for chiming in.  I thought someone might ask that budget question.  Really depends on what it gets me, and how many of "it" I need and how long it will last me.  Just had a quick look at that dream system and yes it looks fanstastic but I fear what that system would set me back.  However, you're right it would be a solid investment for many years and very flexible.  I see the Y-sub is 115lbs, is it relatively ergonomic though to facilitate some one-person lifting? 


I have lots of respect for Dave Gunness but very little left for Presonus unfortunately.  Still, that's a great suggestion that I'll also look into, thank you for the tip.
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Brown Bear Sound
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Nathan Riddle

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2019, 04:52:33 pm »


Well that's very interesting... thanks Nathan.  Any experience personally or just what you've heard?

Ara Ayrassian is who told me, but don't hold either of us to our word without talking to Ara directly ;)

I own TH118's and have demoed the TH-Mini. I love my TH118's. Wasn't able to run the mini full-tilt, they obviously sound good...

A QSC PLD 4.5 in a 2U rack with all processing internal next to your snake and 3x/4x speakon make a small killer passive system.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2019, 10:09:03 am by Nathan Riddle »
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Helge A Bentsen

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Re: Lightweight Rock & Roll subwoofer, what have I overlooked?
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2019, 05:02:02 pm »


Hi Helge,


Thanks for chiming in.  I thought someone might ask that budget question.  Really depends on what it gets me, and how many of "it" I need and how long it will last me.  Just had a quick look at that dream system and yes it looks fanstastic but I fear what that system would set me back.  However, you're right it would be a solid investment for many years and very flexible.  I see the Y-sub is 115lbs, is it relatively ergonomic though to facilitate some one-person lifting? 


I have lots of respect for Dave Gunness but very little left for Presonus unfortunately.  Still, that's a great suggestion that I'll also look into, thank you for the tip.

In my opinion the YSub is well balanced an easy to handle. I can stack them 3 high by myself or load them into a van easely.
Itís a ęone manĽ-sub when you handle it, putting it down on the floor and back up again on itís wheels is pretty easy for one person.

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