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[matt wiegand]

We have a cat Cat6 a snake that goes from the stage to the FOH

They had to mixer setup to take our XLR send and convert it into a quarter inch which then they sent into a transceiver box to send to the radio station the feed from the radio station came in through 3.5 mm to 2 quarter inch Jacks which then went to a d i with a ground lift enabled

[Josh Hana]

I had a very frustrating bug similar to this (full scale digital noise out of the main L/R bus) that I tried to diagnose with Midas over the course of several weeks. We did multiple firmware upgrades/downgrades, started new show files from scratch, emptied the FX rack, everything. It was completely random and impossible to recreate in a controlled setting. In the end we ended up shipping back to vegas to get looked at, they added a small metal bar that connects the two power supplies to the chassis, but I suspect that they did something under the hood as well. If you're missing the metal bar on the power supplies, I'd start there, seeing as that was the "official" diagnosis from Midas. Since getting the console back (about a year ago?) we have not touched the firmware, and I probably won't upgrade because it's not worth the risk.

Having had this issue before, I know how much it can shake your confidence in the system. It occurred probably 6-8 times over the course of a few weeks, and it took getting the noise on video and posted to several groups/forums to really get the ball rolling as we were out of warranty (just past the 3 year mark)

I would suggest a full factory reset, starting a show from scratch, and trying to recreate the problem if you can. There was a known issue with certain FX units in certain slots, and using unsupported cat5 cables can cause issues as well. If you can't recreate it, I'd blame a corrupt file/USB and just keep an eye on things

[Kevin Maxwell]

We have a cat Cat6 a snake that goes from the stage to the FOH

They had to mixer setup to take our XLR send and convert it into a quarter inch which then they sent into a transceiver box to send to the radio station the feed from the radio station came in through 3.5 mm to 2 quarter inch Jacks which then went to a d i with a ground lift enabled

Do you know what this transceiver box was. If it is an RF (radio) transmitter receiver that is hitting a studio up-link those things (Marti like device) can be very powerful. Years ago we had a problem with one of those just killing our system. It even changed the speed of a crystal synced payback device.

[Stan Fordsen]

Let me back up this idea of NOT using shielded cat cables with the Pro series. I don't have the email in front of me right now, but it's been burned into my mind that it was James Elizando from, then, Music Group Support, emphatically saying not to use shielded cat cable. In this email he went on to say that the difference between cat5 and cat6 was great enough so as not to use cat 6.
I had problems with intermittent loss of sync between stage boxes and console. Loud fscking pops coming through and meters simultaneously flashing red. It was a nightmare at the time. Midas only guarantees their console with one model of Belden cable, (James Elizando's words, not mine). It was expensive, we bit bullet and bought it. Knock on wood--no problems since.
http://info.belden.com/hubfs/resources/technical/product-brochures-bulletins/catsnake-cables-product-bulletin.pdf
Belden 1305A

[Ryan McLeod]

Music Group sells this cable on a spool (one of which came with my Pro2’s) - if I recall, it’s fairly priced there’s no cable issues to worry about:

https://m.musictribe.com/Categories/Midas/Mixers/Accessories/CAT5E-100M/p/P0AN8

[Dan Mortensen]

From the Facebook thread.


Mike Freeland Just had a conversation with Brian Kyle Chirnside, the U.S. Midas trainer, who verified non shielded for Pro Series, and shielded from M32...

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Lee Grider X&M require shielded Cat5e this is very well documented. This trainer is mistaken about non-shielded for M32.
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Mike Freeland Lee Grider You're wrong. Kyle is the trainer for Music Group in the U.S.
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Lee Grider Let me put it another way...if you stick with your statement it will get you admonished by the admins...I'm not wrong, and Kyle is wrong or you heard him wrong.
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Mike Freeland So the guy who is paid by Midas (Music Group) to teach Midas in the U.S. is wrong? If I'm wrong, I apologize. We were texting, and I asked him if I could use Cat 6 on my Pro2C. His response was yes as long as it was unshielded. I went further and asked…See More

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Samuel Brook we had some strange button buzz /earth type noises when using shielded cat6 , replaced with unshielded and problem went away, we only use unshielded cable on or pro 1 and 2 now

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Mike Freeland Lee Grider I mis typed on my original post when i said non shielded for M32. I meant to type shielded for M32. My apologies...

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Douglas R. Allen Mike Freeland If you get a chance sometime could you ask him which cable to use if you have a M32 and use DL153 as stage box? The M32 to a DL32/DL16 need a shielded cable but the Pro Series DL153 doesn't want it. Which would be the way to go?

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Mike Freeland Good question.....

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David Gaumé Douglas R. Allen with the M32 the shield is for ground continuity, eliminating potential for static buildup (I'm told), I don't think it matters what's on the other end, if it's M32 it's shielded.
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Douglas R. Allen David Gaumé Right but the Pro Series Boxes don't want to see a cable with a shield. If I use my shielded cable with my M32 will it damage a DL153?
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David Gaumé Douglas R. Allen that’s one for the Midas folks, I don’t want to add disinformation to an already murky topic. I know if you use an unshielded cable with M32 you can fry the AES50 port.
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Graham Tobias Worst case you can always stick on an ethercon coupler and an unshielded patch cable to lift the ground. I'm curious how it goes when using M/X series with Pro series boxes too.
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David Gaumé Graham Tobias worst case you blow up your M32 port doing that, more likely case you experience sync/audio drops.
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Lee Grider Mike Freehand no worries...been a crazy day working. The whole shieled/unshielded has been hotly debated and the mods clamp down tight on anything not officially Midas listed spec...We're all cool...and I understand getting the best info from the test source.
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Graham Tobias David Gaumé I’m talking about when you have a shielded cable and need an unshielded one. It’s possible to lift the ground for the pro series.

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Douglas R. Allen Hopefully Midas will chime in with the correct answer.

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Lee Grider Graham Tobias Hey, I think that's an interesting question cause I've gone the M/DL153 route...I'm using shielded due to the M wanting it...didn't really consider the mismatch to the Pro box connection. I'd love to hear what they say too.

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Mike Freeland Kyle Bryan Chirnside Can you answer this question?

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Kyle Bryan Chirnside

Hi, Kyle with Midas.
Pro series unshielded 100m
M and X shielded under 80m

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Mike Freeland How about M32 console and a Pro series stage box?

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Kyle Bryan Chirnside Shielded

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Kyle Bryan Chirnside Under 80m
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Kyle Bryan Chirnside The difference is the termination in the aes50 ports

That is interesting and I can't argue that it isn't what they recommend. I have not spoken with Midas directly although other people have about this issue.

I can confirm, though, that I have personally zapped a Midas Pro 3 with a spark generator and repeatedly disrupted the signal with unshielded cable and not been able to disrupt it with shielded cable with Ethercons.

[Jonathan Betts]

I have been told you can use shielded cat 5 with pro consoles and stage boxes if both console and stage box are on the same grounded circuit.

[Douglas R. Allen]

That is interesting and I can't argue that it isn't what they recommend. I have not spoken with Midas directly although other people have about this issue.

I can confirm, though, that I have personally zapped a Midas Pro 3 with a spark generator and repeatedly disrupted the signal with unshielded cable and not been able to disrupt it with shielded cable with Ethercons.

     I've seen the videos too with the M/X32 series with and without Bonded Ethercon's and shielded cable with the same results using a spark generator.  I wonder if with the Pro Series shielded will solve one issue but cause another? Cat5 type cable is great between stage boxes and console so long as all the boxes are checked. Correct cable and terminated with the proper ends as well as properly maintained , installed or laid out in mobile shows.
    I remember seeing a video of the X32 and a person setting it up with 2 stage boxes maybe 4-5 years ago using standard cat4 or cat5 cable. Low cost and easy to find. Now the cable alone is close to the cost of a (inexpensive/low quality) copper snake. When the video came out I remember thinking I'd install and leave a basic cat5 cable in every local venue I work. Now that is not possible.
   Perhaps someone will develope some sort of low latency box of some sort that will be installed in between the stage box and console to solve some of these issues like static discharge. Again a great system as long as the required steps are followed and are right for the sytem used.

Douglas R. Allen

Found the video.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=x32+and+stage+boxes&&view=detail&mid=96EDF2964AA87018B0E296EDF2964AA87018B0E2&&FORM=VRDGAR

[Jonathan Betts]

This has happened to me on several occasions with my Pro 1/DL 153. Usually in rooms that have carpeted floors. Does anyone know if they have found a fix for it?

https://youtu.be/woCvQ3ECNgM

[Lyle Williams]

Reliability is oxygen.  Ignored until you don't have it.  Then nothing else matters while your show/client/desk/business/etc dies of asphyxiation.  Should have stayed with the mixwiz....   :-)

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