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Author Topic: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare  (Read 1914 times)

Geert Friedhof

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'I want [insert high expectation], but i don't want to pay any reasonable amount of money for it.'

A kot of topics are about this.

If something like that would exist, it would be known.

My rant.

« Last Edit: November 05, 2018, 06:47:35 pm by Geert Friedhof »
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Caleb Dueck

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2018, 06:24:05 pm »

I want (insert high expectation), but i don't want to pay any reasonably amount of money for it.

A kot of topics are about this.

If something like that would exist, it would be known.

My rant.
Exactly!  Just nailed 80% of all topics

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Brian Jojade

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2018, 11:00:45 am »

That's the common mentality for a LOT of things.

And then people end up buying cheap look-alike products and wondering why they don't work anywhere near as well as the real stuff.
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Jeff Lelko

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2018, 08:42:05 pm »

I think this applies to our industry not only from a fixed good consumption standpoint, but also from a customer/service standpoint as well.  Oftentimes clients aren't willing to pay a professional price for professional service because there are plenty of people out there who work for very cheap or even free.  While I'm certainly not one to judge another's hobby, playing jobs for free hurts the industry as a whole, as if often discussed here.  While most of my clients understand why I and others charge what we do for dependable reliable service, I've lost many jobs to people offer to work for free.  Sometimes the client comes back a year later apologizing for making such a terrible mistake, but not always... 
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Jonathan Johnson

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2018, 12:11:50 am »

I think this applies to our industry not only from a fixed good consumption standpoint, but also from a customer/service standpoint as well.  Oftentimes clients aren't willing to pay a professional price for professional service because there are plenty of people out there who work for very cheap or even free.

My day job is IT. I decided a long time ago that I wasn't going to “moonlight” except for my closest family and friends. (I've basically prohibited my mother from asking anyone else for IT help, based on past scams.)

I don't want to take business away from my employer. Also, I don't want my job to be my hobby, too. If I go to a friend's house after work, I want to visit not work on their computer. If they want me to work on their computer, I'll do it during regular business hours and send them a bill from my company. It's good to keep business and friendship relationships separate.

That said, I do sound as a hobby. I don't advertise; I only do it for friends and casual acquaintances. But I don't do it for free; not only do I value my time and expertise; their use of the equipment represents tangible depreciation that must be recouped.
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Taylor Hall

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2018, 09:39:39 am »

That mindset is prevalent in almost any industry you look in. Everyone is always looking for the "best deal" and will go with Uncle Jim's House of Noisemakers and Flashing Lights™ just because they're a fraction of what you charge. 
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Steve M Smith

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2018, 11:24:01 am »

Uncle Jim's House of Noisemakers and Flashing Lights™

That deserves to be a real company!


Steve.
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2018, 01:42:05 pm »

That mindset is prevalent in almost any industry you look in. Everyone is always looking for the "best deal" and will go with Uncle Jim's House of Noisemakers and Flashing Lights™ just because they're a fraction of what you charge.

The amount a client is willing to pay is based on the corporate, social or political price of embarrassing failure, and the perceived likelihood of that happening.  That is why Uncle Jim gets the gig until someone looses their job, gets demoted or is severely thrashed about the head, neck and shoulders in social media postings.
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Stephen Beatty

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2018, 02:40:13 pm »

I have groups calling me to borrow mics and stuff because...hold for it...the student production services crews want to charge !!! $5 for a mic rental!!!

I say no we don't have those. Call the local sound guys and see what they want....
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frank kayser

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2018, 08:36:11 pm »

Well... I'm a pushover and take more low-pay/free jobs than I should in the community. :-[ Put it in the "giving back" can?


Be that as it may...


I got a note from someone in the community asking for me to do sound for one of those "spiritual seminar" type speakers who was charging the folks coming $70 or so a head and was expecting about 300 at someplace downtown.  Somehow she thought it would help my karma, spiritual health or such if I were to volunteer to take the job as a freebee.  And, I'd get the seminar to boot!  Wouldn't that have been payment enough, just to be in his presence?  Yes, those parts were actually verbalized. :o


This was so wrong on so many levels, I can't even speak to it.  This is one little boy that finally did say no.  One of those things one always remembers how it still grates on one's nerves. >:(






 
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Len Zenith Jr

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2018, 09:11:23 pm »

You want me to do it for exposure? Lady this is Canada, in winter time people die from exposure!

Or another one I get all the time is "We don't want to pay for a sound guy, can't they just "plug in"" (pointing to some random corner of the venue)
« Last Edit: November 07, 2018, 09:15:17 pm by Len Zenith Jr »
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Chris Hindle

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2018, 08:11:07 am »

"I presume you get paid to do your job? Well, This is my job."
Sometimes it works, sometimes not.
I will make concessions if it's a "cause" I believe in, but it is never "free".
Chris.
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Rick Earl

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2018, 11:33:03 am »

One of my favorites:
"But we're a non-profit organization (or church)"
To which I reply:
"I am not"
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Taylor Hall

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2018, 11:41:03 am »

One of my favorites:
"But we're a non-profit organization (or church)"
To which I reply:
"I am not"
If I had a dollar for every time I've done that I could afford the down payment on a Lyon rig.
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Caleb Dueck

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2018, 02:41:47 pm »



One of my favorites:
"But we're a non-profit organization (or church)"
To which I reply:
"I am not"

Even if you're a non-profit - does anyone involved not get a paycheck?  You all get paid?  So do I. 

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Bob Charest

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2018, 04:06:40 pm »

One of my favorites: A florist I know was asked to provide services for free for exposure or some such thing. His reply was that he was working on his 401(k) not his portfolio.


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Stephen Beatty

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2018, 04:24:47 pm »

That is a line I need to remember.
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Stephen Swaffer

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2018, 07:14:20 pm »


Even if you're a non-profit - does anyone involved not get a paycheck?  You all get paid?  So do I. 

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Sometimes and sometimes not-our church is working on our annual Christmas program.  Our budget is well above the median income for the county though small by many of your standards.  The only paid people are 3 church staff-who work many extra hours at no additional pay.  The time of 150 plus others is entirely volunteer-almost all the funding comes from our members.  We are the main sponsor for a local holiday shopping promotion-and our event will bring 3000-4000 out of county people (county population is 20,000) in on one weekend-many who will eat in local restaurants, etc.

We usually ask for discounts-but don't feel like anyone owes us one.  Yet, if we don't ask and tell what is happening? If they decline we may have to adjust our plans to fit what we can afford, but that is OK

If we charged admission I might feel different.  I realize this may be an unusual situation-but is asking in and of itself wrong?
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Bob Stone

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2018, 10:27:10 pm »

If there is any discounting of rates going on, believe me the invoice shows the full amount and a final line item for discount and why. So many times I've seen discounted invoices without any mention of them being discounted...and then the next person says but so and so paid this.
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Caleb Dueck

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2018, 11:08:07 pm »



I realize this may be an unusual situation-but is asking in and of itself wrong?

Asking if a price is negotiable is fine.  What I don't like is the mindset of, "We deserve for you to go home to your family without a paycheck, while my paycheck is untouched."  501c3 does not mean everyone involved is a volunteer. 

I have multiple relative who are pastors at rural churches with essentially zero tech budgets.  When I'm helping them get quotes for events or projects - I don't assume we deserve to pay less than other organizations. 


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Scott Olewiler

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2018, 02:47:42 pm »

One of my favorites:
"But we're a non-profit organization (or church)"
To which I reply:
"I am not"

I have a way of doing these that makes me happy. If a non profit calls me and asked for a discount out of the gate  they are quoted full price. They can take it or leave it. If a non-profit calls me to get a quote and they don't even mention they are non profit I usually quote them a  discounted price just because they respected that I need to be paid for my services. I find folks willing to pay full price are usually easier to work with.

Just did one of those last Sunday night. Felt really good when they handed me the check for the balance due knowing I had cut them a break of my own free will. 

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GenePink

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Re: Why ask for the moon, while only willing to pay for a 3 stop bus fare
« Reply #21 on: November 14, 2018, 12:57:55 am »

My answer to religious organizations fishing for freebies, is a simple paraphrased line from a show called "Drawn Together".

"Wow, if  I had a child every time I heard that line, and I don't, thank you Roe v. Wade...

That usually shuts them right up. :D

Gene
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