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Author Topic: Rack Drawer Support?  (Read 1148 times)

Michael Hogeland

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Rack Drawer Support?
« on: October 30, 2018, 10:55:19 am »

Ok guys, probably a stupidly newb question coming your way, but the lounge is the place for it right?  (I did a search for my question, but couldn't find anyone talking about it)

I've been running sound for my band for a couple years now, nothing fancy, (2) 3,000w amps powering 4 monitors, 2 mains, 2 subs.  I'd been using the 2442x mixer by Behringer and have upgraded to the XR18.  Well, the rack I had everything in was a slant top to facilitate the 2442x mixer.

With the new XR18, I wanted to upgrade the amp rack as well.  I was gifted a 20U rolling rack (OVERKILL), but since I'm already hauling all the gear in a trailer these days, it really doesn't bother me to have the extra weight or size.  Figured I might be able to store some of my other gear in the rack. 

So, my rack consists of 2 inukes, my XR18, and a Furman for power.  But that's about it.... 

I want to add some drawers, maybe a shelf for the tablet, and maybe even a pull out shelf for a laptop.  Most of this is self explanatory stuff, though I wonder about where to place my router, does it need to find its way outside the rack during use? 

My main question though is, if I'm using the drawers to store cables, would I need to give it some support from the rear of the rack, or from below?  Or would the front mounting screws be enough?  We're probably talking 20-30 lbs of cables that would end up in one of the 4U drawers.  I've got the drawer on order, so maybe that would be answered in the pamphlet that comes with the drawer (20lb limit or something?) - but in the meantime I'm trying to plan the set-up. 

Another good discussion - what do you keep in YOUR racks?  Amps and mixers are obvious, but what else?  Do you use a shelf for something you find extremely convenient?  Drawers for microphones?  Give me some thoughts since I have around 12U of extra space. 
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Jay Marr

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2018, 11:04:53 am »

I have some rack cases in my basement, all full of rack drawers, and I fill them with cables.  I've only screwed in from the front and have not had an issue yet. 
Some 4u drawers are filled with speaker cable, so pretty heavy.

Putting a router on a rack shelf is obviously an easy win.

In times where I've had extra space in my PA rack, I've put some of my personal gear in there too.
My wireless Mic and IEM bases, and even my 2 space Fractal Axe FX for my guitar rig.

If weight is not an issue, then I would be trying to consolidate as much as I could in there.
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Michael Hogeland

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2018, 11:11:46 am »

Aye, consolidating a bunch of my extra "bags" is my first priority.  Power bag, speaker cables, mic cables, you get the picture.

I'm the trumpet player, so my own gear can't really camp out in there, well aside from my wireless receiver which I had already planned on trying to find a way to keep it mounted inside.  I didn't buy the rack kit for my Shure, but I'm sure I can either find a way, or find the rack-kit to purchase somewhere. 
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Chris Hindle

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2018, 12:26:56 pm »


My main question though is, if I'm using the drawers to store cables, would I need to give it some support from the rear of the rack, or from below?  Or would the front mounting screws be enough?  We're probably talking 20-30 lbs of cables that would end up in one of the 4U drawers.  I've got the drawer on order, so maybe that would be answered in the pamphlet that comes with the drawer (20lb limit or something?) - but in the meantime I'm trying to plan the set-up. 


I'd support the drawer rails from the back too.
20 or 30 lbs of gack bouncing around in the back of a truck can put some pretty serious leverage on those front rack screws, the frame of the drawer, and the rack rails themselves.
Chris.
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Michael Hogeland

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2018, 12:33:35 pm »

Ok Chris, then the question is....how?

I can likely install a second set of rails on the back side of the rack, but will the drawer have the ability to connect up to that?  Or am I missing something extremely simple?
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randy amos

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2018, 12:42:47 pm »

Something like these?

http://www.audiopile.net/ERD
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Erik Jerde

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2018, 12:47:34 pm »

Ok Chris, then the question is....how?

I can likely install a second set of rails on the back side of the rack, but will the drawer have the ability to connect up to that?  Or am I missing something extremely simple?

I suppose it would depend on what drawer you're using.  The Middle Atlantic heavy duty series looks to all be rated for a 50# static load.  Like Chris said, bouncing down the road changes things there.  The Middle Atlantic drawers do not have a rear support option so you'd have to roll your own.  The easiest way is if you can put a set of rails just before the drawer ends and then just put a lacing bar in under the drawer to support the rear.  If your thermal requirements for the amps allows everything to be stacked without any spacing then you just support the drawers on top of the drawers/equipment below.

You could also look for rear support for things like UPS's that are sold separately.  You'd have to do some work to figure out where to mount them and then do some drill and tap work all while making sure you don't interfere with the drawer operation. 

Buying quality drawers is going to be more important with a heavy load.  They're much less likely to have problems due to cheap slides and bad bearings.

Personally since it's complicated I'd probably just let it ride and keep an eye on things.  If I started to see indicators of torque issues from bouncing then I'd figure out a support system.
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Dave Garoutte

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2018, 12:52:04 pm »

Many rack cases have rails in the back also.
Extra support for heavy things like drawers and amps.
Also you can mount things facing the back too, if things are short enough.
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Michael Hogeland

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2018, 01:14:50 pm »

Thank you Randy!  Those look perfect.

Erik, great advice.  'Wait and see' works for me.  I'd have the drawers mounted all the way to the bottom if I could to facilitate less stress, but it's an inset rack - so there's a 4-6" lip around the bottom of the rack for the top to fit over and latch.  Big top box instead of front/back removal.  A drawer mounted on the very bottom wouldn't be accessible unless I took the main rack box OUT of the caster base.  And I'd like to keep from doing that at shows. 

Dave - this one does not.  Though there are indications that it might have at some point and they've just been removed.  (it's a used rack....very used in fact.  I'm replacing the front rails because they were tapped out to an odd size, I can just as easily replace the rear ones. 
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #9 on: October 30, 2018, 02:38:59 pm »

I have found that steel drawers themselves are quite heavy. For that reason I have always tried to use the SKB poly drawers where I can to keep the rack weight down. They have been great - nice and deep - 4u -and strong (unsure of weight capacity).
They stopped making them a few years ago (shame) but I see them used from time to time


« Last Edit: October 30, 2018, 02:46:50 pm by Debbie Dunkley »
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Dave Pluke

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #10 on: October 30, 2018, 06:11:31 pm »

I have found that steel drawers themselves are quite heavy.

Very true.  I always forget how heavy those things are until I order more of them or reconfigure a rack.

Good to know about the poly ones, but I haven't seen any posted on our local CL.

Dave
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #11 on: October 30, 2018, 06:47:45 pm »

Very true.  I always forget how heavy those things are until I order more of them or reconfigure a rack.

Good to know about the poly ones, but I haven't seen any posted on our local CL.

Dave

I think I probably got the last one locally off CL Dave - LOL. I see them on eBay, Reverb and Music go round once in a while.
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Michael Hogeland

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2018, 08:42:33 am »

Those poly ones are probably much lighter, but they look like ....well....  like poly.  I've never liked that look myself.  I'm actually thinking of trying to make the facing of the rack more "pretty" because it's almost always clearly visible at a show.  I'm thinking, if it's going to be visible, it might as well be flashy - since we're a dance/pop/show band. 

LeDs, strobe, idk, something fun to make the PA not just a big black ugly box, you know?
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2018, 10:11:34 am »

Those poly ones are probably much lighter, but they look like ....well....  like poly.  I've never liked that look myself.  I'm actually thinking of trying to make the facing of the rack more "pretty" because it's almost always clearly visible at a show.  I'm thinking, if it's going to be visible, it might as well be flashy - since we're a dance/pop/show band. 

LeDs, strobe, idk, something fun to make the PA not just a big black ugly box, you know?

I do - but there is no way anyone could tell these draws are poly - unless they walk up to the rack, bend down and start analyzing everything in it.
That's like saying all SKB cases are ugly - I use plenty of those too !
Racks are generally not a lightweight piece of equipment so my thinking is that if something helps with that - it's only good.

If you are happy adding 10 times the weight to get steel - be my guest.  ;)
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Michael Hogeland

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #14 on: October 31, 2018, 10:53:56 am »

I'm pretty new to the sound game, I've only been running for my band for a few years now, and it's been slow road of upgrades from my first set-up of a couple of powered speakers and a 6 channel mixer, to the current XR18 and a host of speakers, both FoH and Monitors.  This is just one more upgrade into the world of a more professional sound rig - my last rack was only a 6u front, slant top mixer.  So I have little to no experience hauling the big boys around.

That being said, I do realize what I have is overkill, heavy, and only getting heavier as I add components like steel drawers.  The casters on the bottom will help obviously, but traversing the basement stairs for storage will be interesting (likely flipped up on its head and carried down on a dolly).  I'm sure after a year or two lugging around this big heavy box, I'll be looking to upgrade again to SKB/roto and multiple boxes so each of them can be lighter.  But until then, this one was free, and they discontinued your poly drawers, so steel will have to do. 
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Jay Marr

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #15 on: October 31, 2018, 12:18:30 pm »

I do - but there is no way anyone could tell these draws are poly - unless they walk up to the rack, bend down and start analyzing everything in it.
That's like saying all SKB cases are ugly - I use plenty of those too !
Racks are generally not a lightweight piece of equipment so my thinking is that if something helps with that - it's only good.

If you are happy adding 10 times the weight to get steel - be my guest.  ;)

Has anyone ever seen a 2 space plastic drawer?
I've googled the heck out of that, but never found one.
I would kill for one of those.
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #16 on: October 31, 2018, 04:55:00 pm »

Has anyone ever seen a 2 space plastic drawer?
I've googled the heck out of that, but never found one.
I would kill for one of those.

No- one seems to make them anymore Jay. If I had the know how and means I'd start manufacturing them myself ..... there is a market there for sure.

The first one I got years ago when it came with an SKB rack I bought. I fell in love with it having struggled with heavy steel drawers all these years. Then when I went to find another one new, they had discontinued making them.
Then one came up locally on CL and I grabbed it before anyone else could. When I have seen them from time to time on eBay and alike, they haven't been there for long and they have sold for good money.
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Scott Olewiler

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #17 on: November 01, 2018, 12:38:40 pm »



Another good discussion - what do you keep in YOUR racks?  Amps and mixers are obvious, but what else?  Do you use a shelf for something you find extremely convenient?  Drawers for microphones?  Give me some thoughts since I have around 12U of extra space.

I keep my drop snakes in my racks permanently attached to my mixers or stage boxes depending which rack I am using.  I am finding that using two drop snakes one for back line and one for vocals and front DIs  and using shorter mic cords; 12 or 15 ft;  really speeds up set and tear down.  (Of course now I have about 50 25ft xlr cables that aren't being used.)






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Geert Friedhof

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #18 on: November 01, 2018, 09:25:20 pm »

No plastic drawers, but aluminium is about halve the weight of steel, and inverse in price. It will save 20-30 pounds on three drawers. BTW: if you start racking from the bottom, you don't need extra bracing in the back, because the drawers rest on each other.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2018, 06:07:34 am by Geert Friedhof »
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Terry Martin

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #19 on: November 08, 2018, 11:09:18 am »

I use the rear brackets from audiopile EWI.  You WILL fill the drawers to capacity + over time.   Brace them properly and forget about it. 


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Dave Garoutte

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #20 on: November 08, 2018, 12:38:04 pm »

No plastic drawers, but aluminium is about halve the weight of steel, and inverse in price. It will save 20-30 pounds on three drawers. BTW: if you start racking from the bottom, you don't need extra bracing in the back, because the drawers rest on each other.
So this put even more load on the lower drawers.
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Jay Barracato

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2018, 01:40:04 pm »

So this put even more load on the lower drawers.
One frame rested on the one below it is very different from the weight causing a torque on the front frame/rack screws.

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Dave Garoutte

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Re: Rack Drawer Support?
« Reply #22 on: November 08, 2018, 04:43:31 pm »

One frame rested on the one below it is very different from the weight causing a torque on the front frame/rack screws.

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But they are still only supported in the front, so some of the weight of the upper drawers is added to the lower ones.
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