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Author Topic: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues  (Read 2488 times)

Dave Rogue

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EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« on: September 26, 2018, 10:25:47 pm »

I have a pair of EV Eliminator ii dual 15 inch with horn PA speakers, and had a blown diaphragm in one of the horns. I ordered a replacement, and after putting it in there was some sound, but very little. To isolate the problem I put the horn with the new diaphragm into the known working cab and it worked perfectly. This led me to believe the crossover is bad in the originally bad speaker cab.

I have searched and searched for info, and can't find anything on this particular crossover. There is no part number, and I cannot find any wiring diagram, schematic, or layout. I can send it somewhere for repair, but being pretty handy with a soldering iron, having done lots of pot, switch, and pickup changes on electric guitars, I figured I'd see if I could fix this myself. It looks pretty straight forward, with a PCB, caps, and inductor coils, but I have no idea how to troubleshoot it without taking each component off the PCB and checking it with a DMM. If I knew what component(s) was in the circuit for the tweeter (the yellow and brown wires in pics in below link) I think I could just replace that/those components.

I am admittedly a total newb at speaker/crossover repair, but know how to read a schematic, have a great Fluke DMM, and yield a mean soldering iron. Can any of you please point me in the right direction? Thanks in advance!

Here is a link to some pictures (hopefully I followed the link posting instructions properly):
Linky to Pics
« Last Edit: September 26, 2018, 10:51:03 pm by Dave Rogue »
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Scott Holtzman

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2018, 10:32:57 pm »

I have a pair of EV Eliminator ii dual 15 inch with horn PA speakers, and had a blown diaphragm in one of the horns. I ordered a replacement, and after putting it in there was some sound, but very little. To isolate the problem I put the horn with the new diaphragm into the known working cab and it worked perfectly. This led me to believe the crossover is bad in the originally bad speaker cab.

I have searched and searched for info, and can't find anything on this particular crossover. There is no part number, and I cannot find any wiring diagram, schematic, or layout. I can send it somewhere for repair, but being pretty handy with a soldering iron, having done lots of pot, switch, and pickup changes on electric guitars, I figured I'd see if I could fix this myself. It looks pretty straight forward, with a PCB, caps, and inductor coils, but I have no idea how to troubleshoot it without taking each component off the PCB and checking it with a DMM. If I knew what component(s) was in the circuit for the tweeter (the yellow and brown wires in pics in below link) I think I could just replace that/those components.

I am admittedly a total newb at speaker/crossover repair, but know how to read a schematic, have a great Fluke DMM, and yield a mean soldering iron. Can any of you please point me in the right direction? Thanks in advance!

Here is a link to some pictures (hopefully I followed the link posting instructions properly):
Linky to Pics

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Dave Rogue

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2018, 10:52:02 pm »

Please update your display name to your real name.  This requirement was listed when you joined.  Mods will lock the post until fulfilled.

Thank you! I thought I followed the instructions, but missed that one. Thanks again!
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Paul G. OBrien

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2018, 11:37:00 pm »

Here is a link to some pictures (hopefully I followed the link posting instructions properly):
Linky to Pics

Wow that's not much of a crossover.. 5 parts, and some muppet before you installed the components on the wrong side of the PCB. Is the crossover in the other speaker the same, if it is has it been assembled the same way? I'm looking for a view of the traces on the PCB, without that I'm guessing and that guess would be that the cap and one of the coils forms a 12dB highpass for the CD and the other coil makes a 6dB lowpass for the woofer. The big power resistor is maybe in parallel with the CD to drop it's level some, it could be in series though too. The little yellow device is a polyswitch, that is a self resetting circuit breaker of sorts. The cap and polyswitch would be the first things I'd remove to test, that is pretty much the only thing you can do if there is nothing obvious broken or blown up.

P.S. I just found a pdf that seems to indicate this was a quazi 3-way with the lower 15 lowpassed at 700hz and the upper 15 and CD are crossed at 1.6khz, that means that only the capacitor and power resistor are tied directly to the CD.
« Last Edit: September 26, 2018, 11:49:05 pm by Paul G. OBrien »
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Dave Rogue

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2018, 11:53:43 pm »

Wow that's not much of a crossover.. 5 parts, and some muppet before you installed the components on the wrong side of the PCB. Is the crossover in the other speaker the same, if it is has it been assembled the same way? I'm looking for a view of the traces on the PCB, without that I'm guessing and that guess would be that the cap and one of the coils forms a 12dB highpass for the CD and the other coil makes a 6dB lowpass for the woofer. The big power resistor is maybe in parallel with the CD to drop it's level some, it could be in series though too. The little yellow device is a polyswitch, that is a self resetting circuit breaker of sorts. The cap and polyswitch would be the first things I'd remove to test, that is pretty much the only thing you can do if there is nothing obvious broken or blown up.
Thanks for the reply, Paul! I have not even looked at the other crossover, but I will for comparison sake. Yeah, my original hope was to follow the traces on the PCB from the yellow and brown wires to see where they went, but I couldn't find the traces to trace. I had really hoped it would lead me to that white 20w cap, as that looks real easy to replace. The resettable fuse looks like I'd have to remove other stuff to get to, which may be beyond my newb ability... without ruining the PCB. I'll look at the other crossover when I get home. Thanks again! I do appreciate the help!
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Paul G. OBrien

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2018, 12:38:27 am »

I had really hoped it would lead me to that white 20w cap, as that looks real easy to replace.

That is a 20w 10ohm power resistor.
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Dave Rogue

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2018, 01:30:48 am »

P.S. I just found a pdf that seems to indicate this was a quazi 3-way with the lower 15 lowpassed at 700hz and the upper 15 and CD are crossed at 1.6khz, that means that only the capacitor and power resistor are tied directly to the CD.

Man, I searched the internet for several hours over a few days, using every search words I could think of, and the only thing I could find was the EDS for the speakers (which is actually how I figured out what diaphragm I needed for the CD). What did you use for search words?

Regarding the "quazi 3-way" thing, that's funny, as I had wondered what it would be like to try something like that... not that I would have tried it, but wondered if you could cross it over like that for kind of a fake tri-amp setup, but with only one amp. Again, being totally new at this stuff, and a pretty basic sound reinforcement engineer, I thought the 1600 hz crossover, as indicated in the EDS, was pretty high. Granted, I know it's different than running a sub, but I always kind of went with 100 hz crossover for the sub. So with that said, wouldn't it give you more of the fake sub and quazi 3-way if you dropped the frequency on the bottom woofer, say to 200 hz, have the upper woofer be between 200 hz and 1.6 khz with the CD crossed at 1.6 khz? Like a broken record to repeat myself I have no idea about any of this stuff, which is why I'm so intrigued in learning.

And yes, 20w 10ohm resistor. my mistake. I may be confusing a couple of the components. When you say capacitor and power resistor you mean the white 20w 10 ohm resistor and the yellow polyswitch at R1, under the 20w resistor? I thought the polyswitch/resettable fuse was the little wafer thing at S1? So when you wrote the "little yellow device is a polyswitch" it makes me think I'm confusing the polyswitch and that yellow Chiclet  looking capacitor, or it's a polyswitch too, not a capacitor.

If that's it, and I understand what you're saying, in my layman's terms I'd replace the long white resistor (the 20w 10ohm power resistor), and the yellow Chiclet looking thing at R1 on the PCB. Is that right?

Again, you have no idea how much I appreciate your help, and understanding of my newbness and very little knowledge of what I'm doing. Thank you very much!

Oh, to add, the other crossover is identical.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2018, 01:33:45 am by Dave Rogue »
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Chris Grimshaw

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2018, 04:02:07 am »

With regards to the 2.5-way crossover, here's how it works:

You've got the HF horn running 1.6kHz and upwards (though with that crossover, it could be seeing significant energy below 1.6kHz), and then the top 15" comes in to cover 1.6kHz and all the way down.

The second woofer comes in at 700Hz, and also plays all the way down. Here's why:

When a speaker is mounted on a baffle (that's the front of the speaker), it will typically show a frequency response that has a rise through the midrange, which is related to the dimensions of the baffle (among other things). One way to fix that is using EQ, and just throw more power at it.
Another way to fix it is to bring another driver into play, which is operating in such a way as to level out that rising frequency response. It involves a lower frequency crossover, as seen here, and is known as a 2.5-way crossover, since it's effectively a 2-way design (HF and first 15"), with the 0.5-way being the second 15" covering a narrower bandwidth.

The idea is that both 15"s will work together to produce bass (ie, maximise LF output and power handling) while keeping the midrange source close to the HF unit at the crossover point.

IME, 2x15" cabs are much much better when used with a chunky 1.4" or 2" compression driver, and a horn that would support a crossover at 1kHz or lower.

Chris
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Mike Caldwell

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2018, 08:56:35 am »

Being that it's a quazi 3-way design and from the components on the crossover the top 15 must just be running all the way out with no low pass.

JBL did the same thing in their gray carpet series SRX double 12 and 15 boxes when operated in the passive crossover mode. Maybe they carried that on it to some of the later ones as well.

David Morison

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Re: EV Eliminator ii Crossover Issues
« Reply #9 on: September 27, 2018, 09:55:15 am »

I may be confusing a couple of the components. When you say capacitor and power resistor you mean the white 20w 10 ohm resistor and the yellow polyswitch at R1, under the 20w resistor? I thought the polyswitch/resettable fuse was the little wafer thing at S1? So when you wrote the "little yellow device is a polyswitch" it makes me think I'm confusing the polyswitch and that yellow Chiclet  looking capacitor, or it's a polyswitch too, not a capacitor.

If that's it, and I understand what you're saying, in my layman's terms I'd replace the long white resistor (the 20w 10ohm power resistor), and the yellow Chiclet looking thing at R1 on the PCB. Is that right?


The component with S1 on the circuit board underneath it is the polySwitch. I don't know if this is an exact equivalent but there's a good chance it's close: https://uk.farnell.com/raychem-te-connectivity/rxef075/polyswitch-radial-0-75a/dp/1175868

The capacitor for the high-pass part of the circuit is the larger yellow component with "1.2J 150V" printed on it. It's probably a 1.2μF in value, from the printing, but I haven't checked to see if that's a credible value for this type of crossover.
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