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Author Topic: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB  (Read 9597 times)

Jon Brunskill

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #10 on: September 18, 2018, 05:49:44 pm »

In the end, it's all personal - I just wish I'd known about the lightweight cardboard edition...

That was a limited edition, but I'm more than happy to sell it to you!!!

It's kind of a shame that the ui24 doesn't have any kind of expansion slot for AES/Dante/MADI/etc like other rackmounts, it would really make this the device to beat, even if it added a couple hundred bucks to the price.

I've heard that this is a highly requested feature, but no idea if they are going to do anything about it. It is possible to use Dante Via with the Ui24 over USB, but you would need a seperate laptop to do that.

At the end of the day it's not a high end product, and advanced features at this level are unlikely.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2018, 06:42:37 pm by Jon Brunskill »
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Alec Spence

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #11 on: September 18, 2018, 08:41:45 pm »

At the end of the day it's not a high end product, and advanced features at this level are unlikely.
Which is the crux of why it's hard to make a decision at this end of the market.  Expandability is great, but it's unrealistic to expect too much for this price.

Though, as I said before, the ability to join two UI24s together would be quite brilliant.

Currently, the X32 rack with an S16 or S32 box is currently king of the capability pile, with 32 in, 16 out for just over UKP 1,000.  While it has many other tricks going for it, it would be trumped by 2 x UI24 giving 40 in, 20 (I think) out, but for ~40% more cost.

Likewise, in the cheaper direction, the XR18 sacrifices I/O over the UI24R, along with a few other neat features, but is half the price.

I still have reservations on the web interface on the UI mixers - not least my general experience that web interfaces never feel as responsive as client server interfaces.  One question, though - how is it on a phone?  The XR's Mixing Station is obviously better on a bigger screen, but I've mixed happily on my phone - not least on a long show where my tablet went low on battery after 5 hours, where I was relieved to be able to carry on with my phone while the tablet recharged.

I've never really got my head round the QU stuff - there are just a few too many limitations there for me.

It does feel like the game is between Soundcraft & Behringer in this corner of the market, though...
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Jeff Lelko

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2018, 09:11:46 pm »

It does feel like the game is between Soundcraft & Behringer in this corner of the market, though...

Not if you consider the dLive to be a rack mixer, and as of now the ultimate rack mixer at that!  But thatís on the opposite end of the spectrum and far from an apples-to-apples comparison. 

But on topic...

All of these products have a place, limitations, and price points.  Coming from a current Qu-PAC owner/user, I could never see myself using anything without a direct interface (wired or otherwise) for professional applications.  The extra couple hundred of dollars will more than pay for itself if the consequences of losing control of the mix are severe.
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2018, 09:35:22 pm »

I really like the idea of an HTML5 based product.  I think other manufacturers should consider this route in the future.  I currently own a Q-Pac and really like it, but was forced to mix a festival type event featuring 5 bands on it this past weekend.  I brought one of our GLD consoles planning to use it, but when we arrived there was no place in to set it up, and it was an area with lots of sand.  For this reason I opted to use the Q-Pac instead, and it worked fine, but I had to use several tablets since the event was so long.  Charging 2 while using one.   I only have 3 iPads and 2 are older models.  For this reason, I have not updated the firmware on the Q-Pac in the past year.  I want to know that it's going to work when I use it, and I have a feeling that if I go to the newest iOS and firmware, that my 2 older tablets will become obsolete.

I just ordered a Ui24R which will give me more devices to be able to work on without having to worry about them becoming obsolete as quickly.  I also like the idea that it can (supposedly) multi-track record directly to a USB stick, and can play break music from a stick using mp3 format.

-Scott

I still have an ipad2 that I no longer take to shows - I use an IPAD PRO with an iPad mini as back up ... but it  runs the current software OK....for now....
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David Winners

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2018, 10:20:32 pm »

Which is the crux of why it's hard to make a decision at this end of the market.  Expandability is great, but it's unrealistic to expect too much for this price.

Though, as I said before, the ability to join two UI24s together would be quite brilliant.

Currently, the X32 rack with an S16 or S32 box is currently king of the capability pile, with 32 in, 16 out for just over UKP 1,000.  While it has many other tricks going for it, it would be trumped by 2 x UI24 giving 40 in, 20 (I think) out, but for ~40% more cost.

Likewise, in the cheaper direction, the XR18 sacrifices I/O over the UI24R, along with a few other neat features, but is half the price.

I still have reservations on the web interface on the UI mixers - not least my general experience that web interfaces never feel as responsive as client server interfaces.  One question, though - how is it on a phone?  The XR's Mixing Station is obviously better on a bigger screen, but I've mixed happily on my phone - not least on a long show where my tablet went low on battery after 5 hours, where I was relieved to be able to carry on with my phone while the tablet recharged.

I've never really got my head round the QU stuff - there are just a few too many limitations there for me.

It does feel like the game is between Soundcraft & Behringer in this corner of the market, though...

Imo, the king of the capability pile is (2) X32 Racks. Less than $2000, 42 inputs, 28 outputs, 16 effects rack slots. With some creative routing it's an incredibly versatile mixing solution, particularly for bands using in ears. Add in an X-Live and X-WSG card and you have a lot of mixer for not a lot of money.
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Alec Spence

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2018, 04:37:55 am »

Imo, the king of the capability pile is (2) X32 Racks. Less than $2000, 42 inputs, 28 outputs, 16 effects rack slots. With some creative routing it's an incredibly versatile mixing solution, particularly for bands using in ears. Add in an X-Live and X-WSG card and you have a lot of mixer for not a lot of money.
Good point that you can exploit features across both X32 Racks if you have this configuration.  But not for the faint hearted, as it'd be two devices separately controlled for mix purposes if you want to use all the FX & IO options.  Otherwise, one X32 Rack is just a (slightly more expensive) S16.

I think the two linked UI24s would offer a neater large channel count option, appearing as a single mixer with 40 mic pres, as I understand it.

I'm still firmly in the X32/XR18 camp for many reasons, though there's plenty in the UI24 to look apealing.

Not if you consider the dLive to be a rack mixer, and as of now the ultimate rack mixer at that!  But thatís on the opposite end of the spectrum and far from an apples-to-apples comparison. 

Coming from a current Qu-PAC owner/user, I could never see myself using anything without a direct interface (wired or otherwise) for professional applications.  The extra couple hundred of dollars will more than pay for itself if the consequences of losing control of the mix are severe.
The dLive is nowhere near the budget end that we're talking about here.  Vendors like Studer offer arguably better still rack-only options, but all big money pro stuff.

Are on-board controls any better than a wired laptop/tablet?  If the mixer is in stagebox location, the latter at least allows for a more helpful mix point - and is unlikely to have a cost burden, assuming you already have the device.

But, ultimately, the decisions people make on mixers like this are probably influenced much more heavily by price, channel count & workflow than by sound quality alone...
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Jeff Lelko

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2018, 06:45:44 am »

The dLive is nowhere near the budget end that we're talking about here.

Of course not, but the reason I mention this is that if high input/output options, networking cards, etc., are needed - the options ARE already out there, and honestly I feel that if this sort of system is truly needed then the price of a CDM32 is justified (and isn't really all that much more if compared to cascading numerous lower-cost products).

Are on-board controls any better than a wired laptop/tablet? 

I personally think so, and this is the one thing I'm going to miss when trading out my Qu-PAC for a dLive.  Reliability aside, I see it as a factor of convenience - not having to pull out a computer/tablet/networking equipment just to tweak a setting before sending the gear on the road.  The Qu-PAC's onboard interface has also saved me more than once in the field when either WIFI gets iffy or my tablet needs to recharge or be tasked with something else.
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Dave Guilford

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #17 on: September 19, 2018, 08:45:57 am »

The last part.  How do you get the other browsers to follow ????

From an software standpoint, to me the UI-24 is a superior product.  See, the ui-24 is a web server.  That means Browser... no app.  Why is that important ?  Every time the board manufacturer drops a firmware update for the A&H, Mackie, B-Box, Presonus, etc... there will be a new app.  Will the app run on your OS ?  Maybe, maybe not...  I got stung a few times with Presonus and Mackie...  with the UI-24, update the firmware and connect.  As long as your Browser supports html 5, you are good to go.  Brilliant!

The ui-24 also sounds great.  It hangs tough with my SI Expression rigs.  I actually prefer mixing on a Dell 21.5Ē all in one pc with win 10 hard cabled to a wireless router, with the UI-24 hard cabled as well.  We wander with iPads for some of the show but... the big screen is fun to mix on.

Hint.... on the big screen p. Open and size multiple browsers.  There is a setting that forces them to follow each other for channel selection...  I set one small one to EQ, another to Aux Contributions.  The main mix is on the bottom with 22 channels exposed.  Elect the kick on the bottom and the other windows follow the kick.  So kick Eq and Kick monitor contributions... pretty darn cool!
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Dave Garoutte

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #18 on: September 19, 2018, 01:49:49 pm »

The last part.  How do you get the other browsers to follow ????

Because all the control is happening IN the UI.  The browsers are letting you twiddle and see the program in the UI. 
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Mal Brown

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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2018, 04:37:57 pm »

It is under settings local as I recall.  Iíll hook up and look up tonight.
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Re: My shootout: behringer XR18 vs soundcraft Ui24R vs Allen & Heath QU-SB
¬ę Reply #19 on: September 19, 2018, 04:37:57 pm ¬Ľ


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