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Author Topic: PA speaker to cover 80-200hz, DXR-12 or K12  (Read 6610 times)

John Halliburton

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Re: PA speaker to cover 80-200hz, DXR-12 or K12
« Reply #30 on: January 19, 2018, 10:41:41 AM »

I think is's a safe bet the line array goes below 200 hz.  I"ll see if I can find out what it is.  It looks like a bunch of ~6" drivers to me.

I like the idea of tweaking the DSP's to eliminate the rear speakers and letting the array and the sub do the work.  Worth entering into a dialogue with the owners, they seem responsive to such things.

Since the sub vibrates the stage, the incentive is to bring the line array down as low as practical to reduce what is covered by the sub.

If this is possible, should I drive the array to its rated limits?  I can see some with 5" drivers rated at 67-20k hz for example.  If an array is rated that would it make sense to set the crossover at 70 hz?  Or maybe go a little higher like 80 or 90?

I guess that depends on the array to a point, I'll repost when I find out what it is.

Don't count on the 6" drivers going down to 200hz.

Seriously, just unplug the mid bass cabinets at the back of the room.  They're likely to be better mid bass traps anyway back there just sitting.

MAKE SURE THE SUBS AREN'T PHYSICALLY TOUCHING THE STAGE STRUCTURE!!!  That may be why they're rattling the stage so badly.

Re-adjust the crossover so the subs are low passed no higher than 100hz.  After these two things, if the stage is still rattling, dial in the high pass filter on the subs up in frequency from wherever it is currently.

Unless we see pictures to the contrary, I'm going to conclude that you actually have what are traditionally referred to as "column speakers", not a line array.  If the subs are low passed at 100hz, start with a high pass setting of 100hz on the column speakers.  From what's been discussed so far, it sounds like you'll want to set the low pass on the subs lower than 100hz. 

That's fine, and I'd actually consider moving the high pass on the columns up in frequency, as it sounds like there's a lot boominess in the room.

Best regards,

John

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Kurt Hutchison

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Re: PA speaker to cover 80-200hz, DXR-12 or K12
« Reply #31 on: January 21, 2018, 10:46:39 PM »

Did the POC today for using a single speaker to provide 200hz and down.  I didn't have a 12", so I used 2 10"s, a K10 and a DBR10, not quite matched but they played well together.  I put them next to each other front and center-stage.

Basically it worked better than I could have hoped.  The clarity on the low end was there (Yaayy!!!!), and they were more than powerful enough, had lots of headroom over the volumes we need, so a 1x12 should meet our needs, now I can justify the expense.

I ran a lot of stuff through them, tried them as 80-200hz only and then tried them as mains, and even when driven to volumes much louder than we would normally use, they performed like champs.

The most dramatic difference is bass lines pop out (like they should), instead of being buried in mud.  Kick drums are better too, more punch and less boom.  So that is complete success IMHO.

And lastly, here is a pic of the flying array.  Since option #2 is to try to use it to cover down to 100hz or slightly below, not sure that's enough to identify it.
I'll see if I can't get a definitive answer there.
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Chris Grimshaw

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Re: PA speaker to cover 80-200hz, DXR-12 or K12
« Reply #32 on: January 22, 2018, 03:47:52 AM »

If a couple of 10"s did 80-200Hz louder than you need, then I'd expect that array to be able to do it, too, unless those cabinets are really really tiny.

Give it a try, IMO, but listen out for distortion as you turn it up.

Chris
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: PA speaker to cover 80-200hz, DXR-12 or K12
« Reply #33 on: January 22, 2018, 11:43:46 AM »

Did the POC today for using a single speaker to provide 200hz and down.  I didn't have a 12", so I used 2 10"s, a K10 and a DBR10, not quite matched but they played well together.  I put them next to each other front and center-stage.

Basically it worked better than I could have hoped.  The clarity on the low end was there (Yaayy!!!!), and they were more than powerful enough, had lots of headroom over the volumes we need, so a 1x12 should meet our needs, now I can justify the expense.

I ran a lot of stuff through them, tried them as 80-200hz only and then tried them as mains, and even when driven to volumes much louder than we would normally use, they performed like champs.

The most dramatic difference is bass lines pop out (like they should), instead of being buried in mud.  Kick drums are better too, more punch and less boom.  So that is complete success IMHO.

And lastly, here is a pic of the flying array.  Since option #2 is to try to use it to cover down to 100hz or slightly below, not sure that's enough to identify it.
I'll see if I can't get a definitive answer there.

A picture of the back of a speaker would be most helpful (and difficult to obtain, it seems).

The rigging reminds me of Chinese knock-offs of a popular USA brand.
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Kurt Hutchison

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Re: PA speaker to cover 80-200hz, DXR-12 or K12
« Reply #34 on: January 22, 2018, 04:48:18 PM »

The latest wrinkle is the previously (sonically) transparant pulpit is now a solid piece of rock (petrified wood), so I can't use one speaker placed behind it like I planned, a pair of 10's on each side suddenly seems like a permanent colution.

The issue is they will have to be maybe 3' apart, center to center closer to 4'.  I am worried that is far enough apart I won't get the coupling benefits and may get some cancellation close to the speakers.
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Re: PA speaker to cover 80-200hz, DXR-12 or K12
« Reply #34 on: January 22, 2018, 04:48:18 PM »


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