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Author Topic: My beloved DSR112 not well  (Read 38342 times)

Bill Hornibrook

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #140 on: March 03, 2018, 08:56:55 pm »

Many things become less expensive when the amp lives with the speaker:

I think the question for many of us (myself included) is whether or not things become less reliable when the amp lives with the speaker. Crown, Yamaha... I've never had a problem with their rack mounted power amps. But put a Crown in a JBL cab, or a Yamaha in a DSR, and things seem to be different.

I've been laughed at before for suggesting that the vibrations of a speaker cab could be detrimental to the health of the amp modules inside, but I still think there's something to it.

Don't get me wrong - I'd love to go active. But with the exception of my monitors, I'm staying passive for awhile longer.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #141 on: March 03, 2018, 09:34:55 pm »

I think the question for many of us (myself included) is whether or not things become less reliable when the amp lives with the speaker. Crown, Yamaha... I've never had a problem with their rack mounted power amps. But put a Crown in a JBL cab, or a Yamaha in a DSR, and things seem to be different.

I've been laughed at before for suggesting that the vibrations of a speaker cab could be detrimental to the health of the amp modules inside, but I still think there's something to it.

Don't get me wrong - I'd love to go active. But with the exception of my monitors, I'm staying passive for awhile longer.
I think that many race for more features at a lower price in powered speakers.

That does come at a price, something has to be cut somewhere.  I think some designs are "running on the edge" to keep costs down.
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Ivan Beaver
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Bradford "BJ" James

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #142 on: March 03, 2018, 11:02:35 pm »

I think the question for many of us (myself included) is whether or not things become less reliable when the amp lives with the speaker. Crown, Yamaha... I've never had a problem with their rack mounted power amps. But put a Crown in a JBL cab, or a Yamaha in a DSR, and things seem to be different.

I've been laughed at before for suggesting that the vibrations of a speaker cab could be detrimental to the health of the amp modules inside, but I still think there's something to it.

Don't get me wrong - I'd love to go active. But with the exception of my monitors, I'm staying passive for awhile longer.
Failure rates are low. Think of how many powered speakers are out in the wild getting the shit kicked out of them weekend after weekend.
Personally, my failure rate for powered boxes vs passive plus an amp are pretty even. Recent past Iíve had to replace an amp module in a QSC HPR, and had to replace a driver in a KW181. Oh, and more recently a DSR went in for service for the bacon frying sound. All remedied quickly by the manufacturers. In the distant past I blew through several drivers in passive subwoofers due to inexperience and no (or improper) limiting.
Active boxes would have probably saved me from blowing those up, though there werenít a lot of options 25 years ago. I also had a few amp failures back in those days, but the amps I could afford back then were already pretty long in the tooth.
Another thing to think about is that weíre not married to the gear. I realize that most of us are looking for a long term ROI in our purchases, but really...how many boxes that you owned 10 years ago, do you still own today? I like to turn over our production gear fairly regularly so that the goods can be sold with some warranty still left (in most cases) and since I also do retail sales, Iím in a position to be able to bring in new lines to try out for a season or 2. I donít like it? I sell it.
I agree that active boxes are a compromise to some degree, but the perfomance/versatility vs price makes them a winner for a lot of our uses. Iím talking about the better boxes ala DSR, KW, etc. We went through a pile of cheaper, crappier, plastic boxes that DJís were happy to buy).

Long story, long. DSRís are a great sounding, versatile box that we put to use in several ways. They are not likely the last powered box we will ever own.
Our passive Danley gear is some of the finest sounding, versatile speakers Iíve had the pleasure of using. Who knows how long Iíll own this stuff though.
As long as the gear is reliable, sounds good, and I make money with it -then Iím happy.
Based on my experience. YMMV.
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James Paul

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #143 on: March 04, 2018, 08:44:20 am »

but really...how many boxes that you owned 10 years ago, do you still own today?
As long as the gear is reliable, sounds good, and I make money with it -then Iím happy.

Dozen each circa 15 year old Yamaha SM15IV, and Yamaha F15 boxes.
A gaggle of EV SX200/300 boxes dating back to `98.
Worth mentioning 20 year old QSC PLs, and 30+ year old Canare Starquad. All aforementioned currently deployed or in rotation.

Reliable, sounds good, making money, check, check, and check. Silly ROI. Not to even get into any of the Peavey gear, like that Drummin`Bunny on Crack, that just keeps going and going. And then there are the mics, but going off topic enough....

My approach, passive or powered speakers, are simply tools, to learn to adapt, adopt, and incorporate if and as needed, mindful of the rewards and risks, benefits and burdens.
 
How much different is an amp/DSP module bolted to a speaker box than most any type electronic device/ module stuffed into most any part of a modern car, truck, or bus that could/would be subjected to similar perils of physical vibrations, temperature extremes, moisture, and contaminants? A powered cabinet should see less abuse by comparison, even though recognizing the potential heat generated from an amp module.

Debbie, glad you are on the path to resolution with Yamaha. There is so much love for those DSR112s, if only for the fact of some of the more than 2 dozen owner/users of DSR112s by my count, who peruse and post in these forums, that I too hear what you described of your experience between the DSR & SRX cabs, and share your sentiments.
IMHO and experience, Yamaha is a stand-up company. Keep the faith, and continue to enjoy.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #144 on: March 04, 2018, 09:27:06 am »

I realize that most of us are looking for a long term ROI in our purchases, but really...how many boxes that you owned 10 years ago, do you still own today?
A few years ago I was talking to one of my "mentors" from the early 80s.

He said he was still running the same cabinets as back then, (new consoles and such).

He said "those cabinets have paid for themselves MANY times over, and I have these young kids working for me that want to be in rock and roll and don't mind moving those cabinets"

He saw no reason to update something that was a solid money maker.

It wasn't about getting more gear, it was about making money on what you already had.

Of course others feel differently.

Buy good tools and use them a long time.
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Ivan Beaver
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Bradford "BJ" James

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #145 on: March 04, 2018, 09:44:02 am »

Canít fault anyone able to make money on gear thatís already paid for itself. I could have done similar, but then I would have needed more or larger vehicles to transport, more hired hands etc. Different strokes and all that.
I will admit to being the poster boy for changing out gear more often than I really need to, though I do own cables, mics, stands etc that are 10+ years old.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2018, 03:32:47 pm by Bradford "BJ" James »
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Keith Broughton

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #146 on: March 04, 2018, 09:59:44 am »


Buy good tools and use them a long time.
Amen, Brother Ivan  ;D
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Scott Bolt

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #147 on: March 04, 2018, 03:16:25 pm »

For me, passive equated to large, heavy, and complex.  I would also add that the entire setup was likely more expensive as well (as compared to my current powered FOH).

Really, the driving factor was size and weight.  I was pleasantly surprised that the powered FOH was better sounding.

With passive systems, it is just easy to screw up and blow a driver.  I also had my DRPA settings get scrambled (took me a while to figure that one out), cables get crossed up (sounds like crap after that), etc, etc.

Powered system .... just plug it in, turn it on, and play.  Pretty darned hard to mess that up.

I believe that the DSR112's are pretty reliable.  Of the many many people that I know, and know of, who own them, I have only heard of a very few problems.  I have never heard of a single problem (so far) that was not covered by warranty.

All that aside, I am pretty sure that most of us love the DSR112 because it simply sounds great.
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #148 on: March 04, 2018, 04:43:45 pm »


All that aside, I am pretty sure that most of us love the DSR112 because it simply sounds great.

Agreed without hesitation!
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Bob Leonard

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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
« Reply #149 on: March 04, 2018, 06:08:19 pm »

Can’t fault anyone able to make money on gear that’s already paid for itself. I could have done similar, but then I would have needed more or larger vehicles to transport, more hired hands etc. Different strokes and all that.
I will admit to being the poster boy for changing out gear more often than I really need to, though I do own cables, mics, stands etc that are 10+ years old.

I've been through five (5) consoles in the past 10 years, but have continued to use, and will still continue to use my SRX-7xx rig and older analog big iron amps. Like Ivan said, buy good tools and be done with it. I've lived my life adhering to that mentality. I have Craftsman, Porter cable, Milwaukee, and other quality tools dating back to the 50's, still as good and productive as the day they were purchased, including the sabre saw that was my fathers and bought in 1952.

Most people on this forum know about my rig, good for about 1500 people, dual system for vocals and backline, SRX725's, 718's, QSC amplifiers, DBX 4800 DSP, and now a Soundcraft Performer with stage box replacing my last board, the only part of the system upgraded in 10-12 years.

None of these components were budget components, but the system has paid for itself many, many times over. I don't mind pushing a heavy rack vs. pushing a light one, so maybe that's the real difference here.
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Re: My beloved DSR112 not well
¬ę Reply #149 on: March 04, 2018, 06:08:19 pm ¬Ľ


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