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[Tim McCulloch]

Hey let's slow down there partner...we will have no 'Hating' on my Midas Pro Series...in this thread.  I have to say that I don't love the SC-48, but once I remember to push the encoder and then turn it's not a bad board to work on.

Midas Pro hating will go in another thread and I will just ignore that thread.

Bill

My problem with Midas is pretty much the same as the Avid VENUE haters - it's about the UI (and certain baked-in operability issues).  For me the VENUE software wasn't a huge leap from the Yamaha experience, at least as far as doing a basic mix to L/R with some EFX, maybe a couple of pre-everything fold back mixes, too.  I'm not a Pro Tools user so I didn't have any familiarity to bring to the live side.

Things change when you get beyond that and I suppose what we learned first has staying power.  If I'd started out mixing on a Pro series I'd probably not be happy on most other mixers, either.

Both platforms are sophisticated and highly configurable and ultimately that's both strength and downfall.  The sonic arguments are based in the ear of the beholder and as JR says, I'm not going to try and tell someone what they are (or think they are) hearing.  I do not doubt that they have a preference for certain self-perceived sonic characteristics.  My job is to turn that into a line item on the invoice  . If I'm the BE it's my job to pick the tools that best allow me to deliver on my commitment to my client.  

[Justice C. Bigler]

My problem with Midas is pretty much the same as the Avid VENUE haters - it's about the UI (and certain baked-in operability issues).  For me the VENUE software wasn't a huge leap from the Yamaha experience, at least as far as doing a basic mix to L/R with some EFX, maybe a couple of pre-everything fold back mixes, too.  I'm not a Pro Tools user so I didn't have any familiarity to bring to the live side.

I started out using Protools before I ever set my hands on any other digital console, and it was a few more years before I started working on Yamaha consoles almost elusively. Until then it was all Allen&Heath analog consoles, GLs and MLs and couple of Soundcrafts. That's probably one of the reasons I still detest A&H today; because they pissed me off when I was in college and I swore them off for eternity. Now I can't even remember what it was that I got mad at them about.


But I still feel out of place on a Venue/Profile console. I know the Profile was built to mimic the PM5D in pretty much every way, but it just doesn't have the same ease of use that the 5D had, and certainly not that the CL/QL/PM10 line does. To me, working on the Avid live consoles is like driving down a bumpy pothole filled road. Sure you can get there, but it's a PITA.


I guess alot of it is also just that I'm used to using different tools for different jobs. I'm fluent in Protools, and can't figure out alot of the other DAWs out there. But that doesn't seem to help or effect my live mixing (although I do tie the two systems together quite frequently).


Like you said, it probably comes down to what we learned first.

[Jay Barracato]

The best digital board is the one someone else buys and then pays me to run.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

[MikeHarris]

As a Avid dealer I had hopes for the S3L as a flyaway console....despite it's toy-like work surface, but they screwed up in the packaging of the stage boxes...why so much wasted space? 14 rackspaces for 4 stage boxes and DSP does not a flyaway console make.

[Thomas Le]

Sorry to derail but I'm always curious as to why A&H is or was frowned upon? I thought their consoles were alright, well given I only worked as far back as the GL2000.

[Roland Clarke]

Sorry to derail but I'm always curious as to why A&H is or was frowned upon? I thought their consoles were alright, well given I only worked as far back as the GL2000.

A&H, Soundcraft. Soundtracs, were all budget, midrange desks.  In the studio you could step it up with things like Amek, MCI, Harrison, live that was Midas.  Obviously in the studio things got a lot more serious with Neve, SSL, Cadac and later Euphonix.

Nothing wrong with A&H, but it's still budget, midrange.  The biggest differences with digital live desks are interfaces, configureability and effects

[Peter Morris]

Ha … I loved the old Allen & Heath’s – they were cost effective, reliable, always out on hire and made me $$$. For what they were, they were great.  Unfortunately I have seen so many installations with GL consoles that really needed something more like an XL3 considering the level of the acts that played in the venue. The engineer was often forced to use the in-house 40 channel GL when they really needed something better, so I’m not surprised with the comments, I often felt the same and I think this did a lot of damage to A&H reputation.

Quite seriously, everyone should check out the new DLive, amazing performance, sound quality and UI … 160 channels to mix, 800 channels on the network, dynamic and multiband compressors on every channel, 64 aux’s all with GEQs, 96kHz, 16 EFX, 0.58 ms latency, DCA pop / spill groups, dual surface control (due shortly) day light viewable touch screens … and …

I find people perception of the various desks on offer quite interesting; Midas is really just a high quality Behringer product with many of the original staff now working elsewhere … don’t get me wrong, for the price they make some great products, Digico is actually the old Soundtacs and Digico, Allen & Heath & Calrec are owned by Audiotonix.  Yamaha is still Yamaha and if what Justice says about Avid is true… it’s a worry for the future of their live mixing range.

With our old analogue consoles it was all about the quality of its construction and the components used. Now the main circuit boards for all of these consoles are made in very similar factories and assemble by robots. When I look inside any of these they look very much the same, it’s just the quality of the faders and the XLR sockets that a slightly different.
 
In essence what you are buying with a digital console is a computer, some software and some input and output connections.  The usability and reliability of the software is a big part of the desk now.  Yamaha traditionally have had very reliable software, and I have to say my dLive has been excellent in terms of reliability and it’s just a delight to use.

Like everything, the market is changing, Midas were once king of the big analogue live console market, but in digital console market they financially they weren’t  looking that good until Uli bought them, now it seems like Avid are not looking that good (?) … it will be interesting to see how this all plays out.

[Tim McCulloch]

Peter, the Death of Avid has been predicted on this very forum for close to a decade.  Justice is one of several folks who have one or more bones to pick with Avid; if you want an ear full just go to a Pro Tools forum and ask about licensing and support...

[Nikhil Mulay]

Peter, the Death of Avid has been predicted on this very forum for close to a decade.  Justice is one of several folks who have one or more bones to pick with Avid; if you want an ear full just go to a Pro Tools forum and ask about licensing and support...

Aah! That is one topic I can just about go on forever.

Even I don't get the hate for Avid consoles though. I find the Profile and SC48 pretty damn easy to use and if you don't like the available fx, just get your favourite plugins. Works great for me and for most engineers here in India. You don't have to use the mouse at all once you are done setting up.

One big plus point going for the Avid and soundcraft boards is that your showfile works on every desk they have in that range. Was damn kicked when my SC48 file just opened up on the S6L.. Just a few tweaks and I was up and running!

I do wish Yamaha had had priced the new boards sensibly though. Avid just priced them out of the market here.



Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

[Peter Morris]

Peter, the Death of Avid has been predicted on this very forum for close to a decade.  Justice is one of several folks who have one or more bones to pick with Avid; if you want an ear full just go to a Pro Tools forum and ask about licensing and support...

I must admit I have not be paying that much attention - last time I looked was 2015 and it looked like they may be turning things around, but not from what the share price is doing now!

[ProSoundWeb Community]