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Author Topic: Should I rent my extra gear or not?  (Read 5704 times)

Steve Crump

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Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« on: April 04, 2017, 08:05:23 PM »

Over the past few years I keep adding gear and selling gear and for some reason what I have keeps growing. I don't rent gear for other people to use, but I have on occasion let some people, a wedding band with a blown amp on a active speaker (waiting on a new amp), a church with a fund raiser when the rental place in the next town over was rented out, the local community theatre (wife was on the board), the local chamber for an annual meeting, use pieces of my gear. At points when I tried to sell gear on Craigslist all I received calls from was "low ballers". Well now I am once again buying some new gear for my use and I am contemplating selling my old gear, but I hate dealing with "low ballers".
I could rent???
I just want opinions on why or why not. I am buying some new gear from JTR and I currently run a Yorkville Unity setup with (4) tops and (4) subs, I also have a QSC pair of 15s with (4) 18" subs, then (2) RCF Evox 8s (which I think I may sell). Do you think I would regret renting? How do you keep from getting screwed...
A year or two ago I was ask to run sound for a group of out Nashville "Friends of Lola" (nice group of people) at a outdoors farmers market in the next town over. The venue provided the gear, which was rental. Not to look a gift horse in the mouth, but the gear was low end and when the guy dropped it off part of it was not working properly. He said that they mostly rent to DJs. He made a trip back to the store and brought some gear they use when they are hired out to provide gear and staff.
Long story short is I am not sure what to do. I am not sure I want a DJ or some guy who doesn't care because it is not his gear tearing my stuff up, but on the other hand if I can't get a fair price for it, wouldn't it be a way to make some money off it?
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2017, 08:27:53 PM »

Over the past few years I keep adding gear and selling gear and for some reason what I have keeps growing. I don't rent gear for other people to use, but I have on occasion let some people, a wedding band with a blown amp on a active speaker (waiting on a new amp), a church with a fund raiser when the rental place in the next town over was rented out, the local community theatre (wife was on the board), the local chamber for an annual meeting, use pieces of my gear. At points when I tried to sell gear on Craigslist all I received calls from was "low ballers". Well now I am once again buying some new gear for my use and I am contemplating selling my old gear, but I hate dealing with "low ballers".
I could rent???
I just want opinions on why or why not. I am buying some new gear from JTR and I currently run a Yorkville Unity setup with (4) tops and (4) subs, I also have a QSC pair of 15s with (4) 18" subs, then (2) RCF Evox 8s (which I think I may sell). Do you think I would regret renting? How do you keep from getting screwed...
A year or two ago I was ask to run sound for a group of out Nashville "Friends of Lola" (nice group of people) at a outdoors farmers market in the next town over. The venue provided the gear, which was rental. Not to look a gift horse in the mouth, but the gear was low end and when the guy dropped it off part of it was not working properly. He said that they mostly rent to DJs. He made a trip back to the store and brought some gear they use when they are hired out to provide gear and staff.
Long story short is I am not sure what to do. I am not sure I want a DJ or some guy who doesn't care because it is not his gear tearing my stuff up, but on the other hand if I can't get a fair price for it, wouldn't it be a way to make some money off it?


I am the worst at keeping gear after purchasing new gear and it keeps growing - but having witnessed round here how equipment is abused by folks who own their stuff, I dread to think how it would get treated by those who don't. Not to mention how drunks and idiots treat gear.......
I would think the guys who rent must have a pretty airtight contract on rental... I personally couldn't do it - I just keep advertising on CL and waiting on the genuine buyers to call me.

Just something to consider..... if I advertise something and it doesn't sell after I renew the ad the maximum number of times with small reductions in price, I take the ad down and try again in a month. Sometimes I even try a higher price ( surprisingly it sometimes works) and sometimes lower but I just keep trying ignoring the obvious low ballers along the way. I have hardly ever had to let something go lower than I wanted to... just a thought.
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Steve Crump

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2017, 08:44:40 PM »


I am the worst at keeping gear after purchasing new gear and it keeps growing - but having witnessed round here how equipment is abused by folks who own their stuff, I dread to think how it would get treated by those who don't. Not to mention how drunks and idiots treat gear.......
I would think the guys who rent must have a pretty airtight contract on rental... I personally couldn't do it - I just keep advertising on CL and waiting on the genuine buyers to call me.


Just something to consider..... if I advertise something and it doesn't sell after I renew the ad the maximum number of times with small reductions in price, I take the ad down and try again in a month. Sometimes I even try a higher price ( surprisingly it sometimes works) and sometimes lower but I just keep trying ignoring the obvious low ballers along the way. I have hardly ever had to let something go lower than I wanted to... just a thought.


You are echoing the way I truly feel. I think I was just hoping for some magic wisdom just because I hate trying to sell stuff. I really don't think I have the right personality to rent anyway. It would really piss me off to have some damaged gear and have a renter arguing with me that "he didn't do anything wrong, it must have been my gear".
Thanks for your input...
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Paul G. OBrien

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2017, 10:06:34 PM »

I rent gear but I do not and will not dry hire because there is simply no way to police the gear. Even people who aren't malicious can be careless, a pair of 3yr old powered speakers got their first scratches last weekend when a customer I was setting up for tried to be helpful and placed them on the stage as monitors but didn't notice they were upside down.. and then proceeded to slide them across the stage into position. The scratches aren't terrible but that just goes to show.. the first time I allow somebody that isn't me to handle some gear it suffers damage.

So the only way to do this and keep gear in good shape involves a big time investment, I deliver, setup, and strike all of my rentals which means some late nights but I routinely get compliments on the appearance of the gear, all the other rental gear in town that I have seen looks like it was dragged down the street behind a truck. I'm not the cheapest in town and I still have all the work I can handle and therefore have no problem making gear pay for itself so it can work but you have to be prepared to make the commitment.
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Robert Piascik

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2017, 10:07:01 PM »

My opinion is that most people have an inflated idea of what their old gear is worth. If you advertise it at a price and nobody wants it then the price is too high. You may not like it and you may not agree but it's a fact. If it was worth what you're asking somebody would buy it. You may be selling it because you have something newer, well, other people want new gear as well. As an example, we saw it time and time again when the market was flooded with cheap digital boards. Person after person advertised their old analog board as "perfect for an install".  Well guess what, for the most part the people supplying for those installs wanted the latest greatest stuff not outdated analogue technology. Get more realistic with your asking price or keep the gear if you can make money with (as long as it doesn't cost you more insurance or storage or other expenses).
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2017, 10:39:57 PM »

Two different topics:  dry hire rentals and used gear sales.

Rentals:  Bah, humbug!  I know there are folks here at PSW who make good ROI from rentals but we never figured out how to do that with the clientele we seemed to attract.  Lots of technical hand-holding because the user wasn't as sophisticated as he/she claimed and too many demands for fee reductions when the renter couldn't make the equipment work in spite of a demonstration when the gear was picked up.  Toss in technical damage from improper operation and cosmetic wear-and-tear and it just wasn't worth it to us.

Sales:  put it on CL until somebody buys it.  Debbie is spot on about pricing - sometimes too low is just as bad as too high.  Realistically you can expect about 50% of what you paid for it unless it's still sealed in the original box, then you get 65%.  If you're not sure about a price do a "completed auctions" search on eBay.  Remember to factor in the commission & fees to eBay when determining the actual proceeds to the seller.

Because of eBay's ridiculously buyer-centric policies we no long sell with them.
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Steve Crump

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2017, 10:45:10 PM »

My opinion is that most people have an inflated idea of what their old gear is worth. If you advertise it at a price and nobody wants it then the price is too high. You may not like it and you may not agree but it's a fact. If it was worth what you're asking somebody would buy it. You may be selling it because you have something newer, well, other people want new gear as well. As an example, we saw it time and time again when the market was flooded with cheap digital boards. Person after person advertised their old analog board as "perfect for an install".  Well guess what, for the most part the people supplying for those installs wanted the latest greatest stuff not outdated analogue technology. Get more realistic with your asking price or keep the gear if you can make money with (as long as it doesn't cost you more insurance or storage or other expenses).

I don't disagree with you, but last time when I was going to sell my Yorkville Unity setup I was asking $350.00 each for the U15 tops and $250.00 for the UCS1 subs, or $2,000.00 for all thinking it would be a quick sale. I thought that was a fair price and I have to admit some "tire kickers" wanted 18" subs and a lot of callers were put off by it being a passive system, active being the favored in our area for bands and small sound companies. If I decide to sell and it doesn't work out I may just keep it for backup.
Where do you draw the line on value? I can't go out and buy a passive box the same quality as the U15 for $350.00. Especially in the shape my cabs are in. Of course I may have to cut my loses and move on in regards to my gear. These are the dilemmas....
I am open to opinions on the value of used gear also...
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Steve Crump

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2017, 11:03:05 PM »

Two different topics:  dry hire rentals and used gear sales.

Rentals:  Bah, humbug!  I know there are folks here at PSW who make good ROI from rentals but we never figured out how to do that with the clientele we seemed to attract.  Lots of technical hand-holding because the user wasn't as sophisticated as he/she claimed and too many demands for fee reductions when the renter couldn't make the equipment work in spite of a demonstration when the gear was picked up.  Toss in technical damage from improper operation and cosmetic wear-and-tear and it just wasn't worth it to us.

Sales:  put it on CL until somebody buys it.  Debbie is spot on about pricing - sometimes too low is just as bad as too high.  Realistically you can expect about 50% of what you paid for it unless it's still sealed in the original box, then you get 65%.  If you're not sure about a price do a "completed auctions" search on eBay.  Remember to factor in the commission & fees to eBay when determining the actual proceeds to the seller.

Because of eBay's ridiculously buyer-centric policies we no long sell with them.

I may try CL again after I receive the new gear. I bought the gear five years ago and only used it once in the past 2 years because of a house gig I have been doing for two years, so do you think 50% of what I paid is a good starting point? I know you can't see the gear to establish a real opinion, but assuming it is in good shape.
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Rob Spence

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2017, 12:26:04 AM »

I only cross rent to other sound folk. All others buy production to some extent even if it is deliver, set up, come back later to get it (travel time charged for ).

I too have pretty much given up in eBay.


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Scott Holtzman

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2017, 01:54:53 AM »

I only cross rent to other sound folk. All others buy production to some extent even if it is deliver, set up, come back later to get it (travel time charged for ).

I too have pretty much given up in eBay.


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We have a tight network locally and have started to actually plan purchases to gap fill for each other.  It's a cool symbiosis and it allows us to join forces and do more than we could do without any formal partnership.  All the guys I cross rent with are honest and we try real hard not to steal each others customers.  We also all know we are out going for the same business but never discuss opportunities unless they are too large for us to handle.


Dry renting to strangers would be tough.  The guy at Qwipped is always trying to get me to dig in deeper but I have never won a deal off his platform. 



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Jonathan Goodall

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2017, 03:45:58 AM »

I rent gear but I do not and will not dry hire because there is simply no way to police the gear. Even people who aren't malicious can be careless, a pair of 3yr old powered speakers got their first scratches last weekend when a customer I was setting up for tried to be helpful and placed them on the stage as monitors but didn't notice they were upside down.. and then proceeded to slide them across the stage into position. The scratches aren't terrible but that just goes to show.. the first time I allow somebody that isn't me to handle some gear it suffers damage.

So the only way to do this and keep gear in good shape involves a big time investment, I deliver, setup, and strike all of my rentals

Totally agree with this.  I have had more cosmetic damage done to my gear from people that "wanted to help out" than by anything else.  The last lot was by a couple of people who decided to help bring out gear to the van after a show (without being asked).  I turned around and they were stacking up some EAW monitors on the road (chunky gravel type road) without any covers  >:(   Inspection later showed various chips and garks out of the paint work.  Yes it could be more or less repaired with a sharpie but that's not the point.
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Scott Olewiler

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2017, 06:57:02 AM »

Steve

I rent out DIY DJ systems (just add laptop or ipod, etc) for weddings almost every weekend during the busy season, May thru September. I have been doing this for 3 years and have never had a piece of equipment come back damaged due to anything that happened at the event.

Here is the key: myself (or a helper) always delivers, sets it up and then retrieves it after the event.   I charge a flat fee for the equipment and also mileage.

Takes about 45 minutes to set them up and less than 30 minutes to tear it down.  I average about $80/hr for my time including driving back and forth twice.  We often have two or more systems out a weekend. When I need a helper to take system out, he makes about $55/hr. The main system I use  for this paid for itself in the first 10 rentals.   You cannot be personally attached to the gear. It is a tool to make you money. 

If you are going to sell it any way, why not rent the piss out of it and wring every last dollars you can get out of it? You've already have the makings of two DJ rigs that can each rent out for what you were asking for one speaker sold.  If you were asking $2000 to sell, that's only about 7 rentals. And after 7 rentals you'd still have the gear to continue to rent out.
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Geert Friedhof

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2017, 07:06:15 AM »

Only crossrent here, to and from people I know. We have a nice deal in place for that. Everything else is babysitting.

Selling stuff: I am willing to sell stuff after 3 years, or 100 uses. 100 uses for most of my stuff is now about 16-18 months. I calculate my rent cost price at 40-50 uses. So after 100 uses it has made at least double its cost in revenue, but I can still get a good price for it, because it is in good shape, and current.
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Steve Crump

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #13 on: April 05, 2017, 07:21:13 AM »

Steve

I rent out DIY DJ systems (just add laptop or ipod, etc) for weddings almost every weekend during the busy season, May thru September. I have been doing this for 3 years and have never had a piece of equipment come back damaged due to anything that happened at the event.

Here is the key: myself (or a helper) always delivers, sets it up and then retrieves it after the event.   I charge a flat fee for the equipment and also mileage.

Takes about 45 minutes to set them up and less than 30 minutes to tear it down.  I average about $80/hr for my time including driving back and forth twice.  We often have two or more systems out a weekend. When I need a helper to take system out, he makes about $55/hr. The main system I use  for this paid for itself in the first 10 rentals.   You cannot be personally attached to the gear. It is a tool to make you money. 

If you are going to sell it any way, why not rent the piss out of it and wring every last dollars you can get out of it? You've already have the makings of two DJ rigs that can each rent out for what you were asking for one speaker sold.  If you were asking $2000 to sell, that's only about 7 rentals. And after 7 rentals you'd still have the gear to continue to rent out.


You definitely offer a great argument to the topic. I am not sure what I was looking for when I posted this topic, I think maybe someone to make my mind up for me? All the info that has been offered is valid and appreciated. I definitely have some thinking to do.
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Steve Eudaly

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #14 on: April 05, 2017, 09:23:10 AM »

Two different topics:  dry hire rentals and used gear sales.

Rentals:  Bah, humbug!  I know there are folks here at PSW who make good ROI from rentals but we never figured out how to do that with the clientele we seemed to attract.  Lots of technical hand-holding because the user wasn't as sophisticated as he/she claimed and too many demands for fee reductions when the renter couldn't make the equipment work in spite of a demonstration when the gear was picked up.  Toss in technical damage from improper operation and cosmetic wear-and-tear and it just wasn't worth it to us.

Sales:  put it on CL until somebody buys it.  Debbie is spot on about pricing - sometimes too low is just as bad as too high.  Realistically you can expect about 50% of what you paid for it unless it's still sealed in the original box, then you get 65%.  If you're not sure about a price do a "completed auctions" search on eBay.  Remember to factor in the commission & fees to eBay when determining the actual proceeds to the seller.

We've had very similar experiences to Tim. The dry rentals end up being more trouble than its worth and I've found our customers are usually happy to pay for one of our techs to deliver, setup and strike the gear to ensure everything is in good order.

Regarding CL sales, I've had items on there for weeks that finally sold after I raised the price 5-20%. Sometimes if it's "too cheap" people assume something must be wrong.

Tim McCulloch

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #15 on: April 05, 2017, 10:20:31 AM »

We've had very similar experiences to Tim. The dry rentals end up being more trouble than its worth and I've found our customers are usually happy to pay for one of our techs to deliver, setup and strike the gear to ensure everything is in good order.

Regarding CL sales, I've had items on there for weeks that finally sold after I raised the price 5-20%. Sometimes if it's "too cheap" people assume something must be wrong.

Hey Steve, how was your REO gig?
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #16 on: April 05, 2017, 10:21:44 AM »

Even when I am there and no-one else is supposed to be touching the equipment, things can go wrong.
Last year, I had been running sound for a local band and at the end of the night we had brought the gear outside ready for load. The van was the other side of the parking lot and someone decided to help out by pushing one of my subs across the lot to the van without releasing the brakes - can't have been easy....
One whole side of each wheel was worn away and I had to replace them. 
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #17 on: April 05, 2017, 10:26:38 AM »

Even when I am there and no-one else is supposed to be touching the equipment, things can go wrong.
Last year, I had been running sound for a local band and at the end of the night we had brought the gear outside ready for load. The van was the other side of the parking lot and someone decided to help out by pushing one of my subs across the lot to the van without releasing the brakes - can't have been easy....
One whole side of each wheel was worn away and I had to replace them.

Drunks.  You think they'd notice the extra effort.

Our local Kroger-owned grocery stores have a locking wheel on their shopping carts; if you don't exit through a check out lane the wheels lock at the store exit; ditto if you try to take a cart out of the parking lot.  I almost always get a cart that has a big flat spot on that wheel.  Ya think they'd notice it doesn't turn...
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Steve Eudaly

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2017, 11:25:10 AM »

Hey Steve, how was your REO gig?

Unfortunately I missed this go around as I was out of state tending to other shows. But from what my guys told me once the tour was shoehorned in the venue all was well in world. Easy day on the audio side.

I'm a little surprised you know of our involvement, but guess I probably shouldn't be. The longer I'm in this industry, the smaller it seems to get.

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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2017, 03:43:36 PM »

Expecting a 50% return on your investment after 5 years is fairly reasonable for most gear.  Some stuff may be worth more, some less. It all depends on what's changed in that timeframe.

Getting into the rental business is a different thing.  There are 4 kinds of rentals:

1. Full production. You set up, you operate, you strike. - This is what most are comfortable with.
2. Rental with setup and strike.  Similar to a full production, but you are not there to operate the gear.
3. Cross Rental.  Here, you rent to a company that you trust.  You can be fairly sure that the gear won't come back damaged.  Typically, this would be 1-3% of the value of the gear.
4. Dry rental. Here you rent out the gear to someone, they take it away and use it, and then return it.  For dry rentals, I charge 10-15% of retail cost of the gear.  Sometimes it's LESS expensive for the customer to pay for a full production than the gear rental alone would cost as a dry rental.
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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2017, 06:16:16 PM »

I cross rent certain gear to people I know in the business or a referral from same. I rent out only gear that is fairly bulletproof. I've had a couple of my small systems pay for themselves with just those rentals alone. I take good care of my gear, have quality equipment and am very selective on who I will rent out to.
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Re: Should I rent my extra gear or not?
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2017, 06:16:16 PM »


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