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Author Topic: New to passive PA  (Read 24357 times)

Luke Geis

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #80 on: February 15, 2017, 11:59:45 pm »

There is a little error in your math.

You are quoting PEAK outputs, NOT what people would actually MEASURE or perceive.

You need to subtract at least 10dB (generally closer to 15dB) from your numbers to get "perceived" level.

So it gets even worse.

Well the math was correct, but the real number that could actually be expected would be wrong. I did say at best though :)

I didn't go into my normal scheme of math where I deduct 10db for crest factor and another 6db to arrive at the true real world probable outcome that has any sort of safety net. I didn't really have to though as by the time you take another 16db off those numbers you could just as well have used a megaphone as a PA. The good news is the OP seems to have returned the stuff and gotten a real set of speakers!!!!!!

Justin,

    While it may seem that we were bagging on you, the truth is we are looking out for you. The easiest way to make someone reconsider their decision is to make fun of and in essence bash away at them about it. Rude perhaps, ineffective, also perhaps? 7 out of 10 times though, we get a guy such as yourself that comes in here with the exact same scenario and blows our recommendations off as if we are being posh, or bougie. Many of us actually deal with a great number of different PA systems every year ranging from the stuff you looked at getting, to as good as money can buy. There is a difference and the reason we suggest otherwise despite budget is because the purchase of such gear drags us all down a little. Another thing to consider is that the purchase of that stuff further allows companies like them to continue to sell crap to those that don't know better.

The music equipment industry is very much like the guitar and music instrument industry. There are some really cheap crap out there that is not worth even the sum of all its parts. There are a few hidden gems, but they are far and few between. You get what you pay for. This is not the PA you are looking for........ Good on your for changing paths and getting something of value. It was a wise decision.
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Justin Addison

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #81 on: February 16, 2017, 04:49:49 am »


Done, as Deb said you saw the light.  Enjoy a pint on me in celebration and best luck on your new journey.

Many many thanks - such a kind gesture - I'll buy that pint in sumer when I can enjoy it more in the sunshine lol.

I had to buy the RCF's on 12 months interest free credit with a 200 deposit. I can't get a refund on the hifi tower stuff until it is back in their warehouse. I asked for delivery on 27th - I will refuse it at the door and return to sender (there's a song in there lol) - they asked me to do that, when I get the money back, I will pay off the RCF's (or buy some more gear - I have one SM58 and mic stand but may need a few more bits and bobs (SM57, low stand).

Just FYI - I have bought a flight case for my new Soundcraft EFX12 - cost just over 100 and looks pretty tough.

As for the British currency - yes we went decimal in 1971 - the year I was born :)


[Edit] - I do have a slight confession to make - I came across hifi-tower by running a google search fo "cheap pa system"

In hindsight - I should have guessed - cheap and nasty!
« Last Edit: February 16, 2017, 04:55:47 am by Justin Addison »
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Justin Addison

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #82 on: February 16, 2017, 08:01:11 am »

OK, another question now I have my tops.

What Active Sub would you recommend - looking at possibly an 18" sub - depending on price maybe just one.

Budget is around 600-800 so looks like RCF is a no go.

Please bear in mind I am in UK so no links to USA - Thomann could be an option before Brexit hits lol
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Chris Grimshaw

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #83 on: February 16, 2017, 09:09:45 am »

OK, another question now I have my tops.

What Active Sub would you recommend - looking at possibly an 18" sub - depending on price maybe just one.

Budget is around 600-800 so looks like RCF is a no go.

Please bear in mind I am in UK so no links to USA - Thomann could be an option before Brexit hits lol

If you're willing to go used, you might get a bargain. I haven't tried any of these models myself, but they're all known brand and will likely be solid. I'll let the other users that have heard these models weigh in on the specifics. I've come across the KSub in passing, but not hammered one myself.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Jbl-518s-eon-active-subs-subwoofer-bass-bins-with-covers-pair-2x-/172528448373?hash=item282b7f3375:g:rPQAAOSwA3dYj1Ip
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yamaha-DSR118W-18-Active-PA-Subwoofer-/272551652870?hash=item3f75582e06:g:HXQAAOSw32lYnLW2
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/QSC-K-Sub-1000-watt-active-bass-speaker-/112304608794?hash=item1a25e0561a:g:IiQAAOSwTglYk39j

Chris
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David Allred

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #84 on: February 16, 2017, 10:04:43 am »


Justin,

    While it may seem that we were bagging on you, the truth is we are looking out for you. The easiest way to make someone reconsider their decision is to make fun of and in essence bash away at them about it.
The truth can be given without the implied "uppitiness" that sometimes happens, leading into the personal.

Southern hospitality protocol should be followed if it would likely offend the recipient. 
"That is the worse PA system I have ever heard.... Bless your heart."
"You are an idiot for buying that speaker... Bless your heart."
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #85 on: February 16, 2017, 10:21:52 am »

The truth can be given without the implied "uppitiness" that sometimes happens, leading into the personal.

Southern hospitality protocol should be followed if it would likely offend the recipient. 
"That is the worse PA system I have ever heard.... Bless your heart."
"You are an idiot for buying that speaker... Bless your heart."

Or ..the inimitable "LOL"
"That is the worse PA system I have ever heard  - LOL"
" You are an idiot for buying that speaker - LOL"
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Debbie Dunkley

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #86 on: February 16, 2017, 10:35:34 am »

If you're willing to go used, you might get a bargain. I haven't tried any of these models myself, but they're all known brand and will likely be solid. I'll let the other users that have heard these models weigh in on the specifics. I've come across the KSub in passing, but not hammered one myself.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Jbl-518s-eon-active-subs-subwoofer-bass-bins-with-covers-pair-2x-/172528448373?hash=item282b7f3375:g:rPQAAOSwA3dYj1Ip
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yamaha-DSR118W-18-Active-PA-Subwoofer-/272551652870?hash=item3f75582e06:g:HXQAAOSw32lYnLW2
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/QSC-K-Sub-1000-watt-active-bass-speaker-/112304608794?hash=item1a25e0561a:g:IiQAAOSwTglYk39j

Chris

The K sub is a very disappointing box. I owned one for 5 minutes and was completely underwhelmed. Over priced and underperforming -IMHO.
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Lance Hallmark

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #87 on: February 16, 2017, 11:12:16 am »

The K sub is a very disappointing box. I owned one for 5 minutes and was completely underwhelmed. Over priced and underperforming -IMHO.

+1
No on the K-Sub!

The EV ZXa1 subs are small and light. Don't go really low but for small gigs they should do fine. Bigger is the EKX 15" sub, a good compromise between value/performance. I would also look at used, as long as you can test it out before exchanging money.
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Chamsys, Crown, Danley, EV, JTR, Powersoft, Yamaha

Nathan Riddle

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #88 on: February 16, 2017, 11:47:02 am »

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/QSC-K-Sub-1000-watt-active-bass-speaker-/112304608794?hash=item1a25e0561a:g:IiQAAOSwTglYk39j
Chris

DO NOT GET THE KSUB!!!!! Get the KW sub :)

I'm sure you could find RCF subs used. Check buy-n sell on facebook, or gearsource, etc. You just gotta be patient.
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #89 on: February 16, 2017, 01:17:41 pm »

If you're willing to go used, you might get a bargain. I haven't tried any of these models myself, but they're all known brand and will likely be solid. I'll let the other users that have heard these models weigh in on the specifics. I've come across the KSub in passing, but not hammered one myself.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Jbl-518s-eon-active-subs-subwoofer-bass-bins-with-covers-pair-2x-/172528448373?hash=item282b7f3375:g:rPQAAOSwA3dYj1Ip
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yamaha-DSR118W-18-Active-PA-Subwoofer-/272551652870?hash=item3f75582e06:g:HXQAAOSw32lYnLW2
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/QSC-K-Sub-1000-watt-active-bass-speaker-/112304608794?hash=item1a25e0561a:g:IiQAAOSwTglYk39j

Chris

Of those 3 choices I think the Yamaha would have the most satisfying output level.  I've not heard the K-Sub but it got enough negative reviews when compared to other subs that I'll take the testimony of those reviewers.  I never liked the EON subs.  I think it's the cabinet resonances that make it sound really, really 'funny' to me.
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Re: New to passive PA
« Reply #89 on: February 16, 2017, 01:17:41 pm »


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