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Author Topic: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112  (Read 17341 times)

Paul Miller

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2017, 03:58:25 pm »

Btw, make sure all the polarity switches are in the same position.

I run them all normal polarity, normal mode, gains at 3:00 so about +5. K12s are in external sub mode, with gains at 12:00. To my senses this provides a good balance for our bass heavy hip hop. With these gain settings the tops will hit the limiters before the subs will, so I've got a bit of headroom left in the subs if/when I start using the SRX tops. I'm hoping to get several more dB out of the system with what I can offer, compared to what the venue supplies.
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Lyle Williams

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #21 on: January 09, 2017, 04:12:03 am »

Looking at the photo, with tops at close to head height, you'll be killing the bar staff while the people near the camera still want you to turn it up.  :-)
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Paul Miller

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #22 on: January 09, 2017, 04:50:29 am »

Looking at the photo, with tops at close to head height, you'll be killing the bar staff while the people near the camera still want you to turn it up.  :-)

Yeah that second picture actually isn't so good, you can't tell the position of the speaker relative to the bar.  It's actually a good 6 to 8 feet out from the bar front, plenty enough for servicing the customers. Let's never forget how we are getting paid.  :)

It actually works out quite well, with the near and far speakers basically pointed inwards at opposite ends of the long narrow space. The bar doesn't get blasted from that speaker so they can hear the drink orders and each other. The near speakers are almost directly under the DJ setup on the balcony, so the DJs can feel the bass along with the monitor right beside them.  And the levels are reasonably consistent from end to end, falling off the most at the bar.
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Jim McKeveny

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #23 on: January 09, 2017, 08:06:12 am »


Roughly speaking, +3db of output = +3db of co$t. Has promoter factored in that calculus?
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #24 on: January 09, 2017, 11:17:51 am »

Roughly speaking, +3db of output = +3db of co$t. Has promoter factored in that calculus?

^^^ THIS ^^^

Particularly since this is likely to end up requiring new equipment purchases in order to make the promoter happy.

After looking at the pics, though, I wonder if more SPL is really appropriate, rather than a redistribution of the SPL.  This looks like a meat market hookup gig.  The people there will need to be able to communicate verbally ("Your place or mine" doesn't translate well to texting).  The promoter may desire *more* but the customers may not.  That's not Paul's problem (in theory) but you can be sure that when attendance falls off he will get the blame if there is even a single SPL complaint.
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Rob Spence

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #25 on: January 09, 2017, 11:22:07 am »

I run them all normal polarity, normal mode, gains at 3:00 so about +5. K12s are in external sub mode, with gains at 12:00. To my senses this provides a good balance for our bass heavy hip hop. With these gain settings the tops will hit the limiters before the subs will, so I've got a bit of headroom left in the subs if/when I start using the SRX tops. I'm hoping to get several more dB out of the system with what I can offer, compared to what the venue supplies.

I mentioned it because in moving and placing the subs, one switch got moved.

Several dB needs to be more than 3 to even notice. More than 6 should have an effect. Look at the spec sheets to see if what you propose will achieve your goal.
K12s are ok but not great. At high levels they don't sound so good.
Much of what people feel in dance music is in the low mids (above subs and below the hf driver). A 15" or dual 12" cab may bring more happiness.



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Jim McKeveny

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #26 on: January 09, 2017, 12:19:09 pm »

There are always substantial conflicts:

"What is needed?" = "How cheap can we get away with?" Zero reputation-building here, and lots of gear abuse potential. Promoter pushes all responsibility back on vendor. Use prophylactics.

"Work with me" = "Share all of my (?) risk", "Cash Flow Problem", or both.

"Do what is ideal" = "Open Checkbook". Unicorn client.

I know I sound cynical, but I am above ground, cash-positive, and have a coterie of satisfied cohorts.





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Lance Hallmark

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #27 on: January 09, 2017, 01:29:59 pm »

I agree to what most have written:
Get speakers higher.
DSR112s will sound better, especially at high volume, than the QSCs but will not make a noticeable increase in overall SPL, that would take bigger cabinets like EV QRX212 or higher output boxes like Danley SM80s or JTR Noesis.
I would say 4 subs minimum for the type of party and number of patrons. Higher output subs would be optimal but the QSCs should suffice. More is always better for DJ music  :P
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Paul Miller

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #28 on: January 09, 2017, 01:35:56 pm »

Roughly speaking, +3db of output = +3db of co$t. Has promoter factored in that calculus?

That's why I'm trying to prepare them for. If I can bring 2 more subs, and a pair of tops that, while not the best for the job, will get them another clean 4 to 6 dB over the K12s, I think that would justify them paying enough to make it worth my extra time and effort. I guess I'll just have to try it and see how it goes. At least it won't require any purchases.

Particularly since this is likely to end up requiring new equipment purchases in order to make the promoter happy.

A 15" or dual 12" cab may bring more happiness.

Tim and Rob that's exactly what I'm thinking. So if they're still not happy with the system with what I can provide at minimal cost to them, then I will have to suggest an upgrade more along these lines.
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Bill Hornibrook

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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #29 on: January 09, 2017, 06:40:20 pm »

As a general rule as a DJ I prefer tops with 15"s over 12"s. But I don't know if I'd go out and buy a pair just for this gig. Try going with what you've got first Paul... like your 712s.

Between 2010 and 2015 I had a gig very similar to this - though not nearly as upscale. It was for a young adult club that made their back lot into an outside venue during the summer.

The setup was different though. The owner only hired DJs with sound systems,  and left it up to the DJs as to what to bring for a set price. There were a couple who thought they could get by with no subs. They lasted one night.

Ultimately the gig fell to three of us, with me doing most nights. I'd bring pretty much everything, but it was super easy to set up. I'd just back the van into the space, and up it would go.

Here's an old video from 2011. I was using four custom B&C 18" subs at the time. Looks like I hadn't starting tilting the tops downward yet. Once I started doing that, it helped intensify the sound in the dance space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zz3q4GozhnQ

Warning: It the sight of women rubbing their privates on subs, or a woman lying on her back on subs spreading her legs while a man jumps her repulses you as professionals, please don't watch.

It's what the gig was, and I miss it. The old owner sold the club, and the new owner just didn't want to go through the legal hurdles required to run an outside venue after 10pm.




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Re: QSC K12 VS. JBL SRX712 OR Yamaha DSR112
« Reply #29 on: January 09, 2017, 06:40:20 pm »


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