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Author Topic: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?  (Read 3519 times)

David Allred

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Re: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?
« Reply #10 on: October 20, 2016, 12:59:53 pm »

Actually if you play with the PAG-NAG equation, it should be realized that the item that makes the biggest difference is the distance between the mic and the sound source (mouth).



The MC is 6'2".  The following speaker is Molly McOompaLoompa.  Then followed by "the low talker" from Seinfeld, pitching her puffy pirate shirts.  I am trying to remove all variable except distance and angel off axis.
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David Allred

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Re: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?
« Reply #11 on: October 20, 2016, 01:14:20 pm »

The speaker in question is the Yorkville E12.  I have used this general set-up for 6+ years.  Always been able to have sufficient GBF, but would like to squeeze 3-6db out.
Most of the rooms have 13' ceilings.  I use  Global ST-132 stands and 15 deg tilt adapters (with COG compensation), so I can run the cabs against the ceiling if I need.
Moving the stands in interferes with sight lines, and get in the way when the stage layout is changed (widened and extended forward) and banquet tables replace theater seating.
Even with the dual coverage from both speakers to every seat, delay causing intelligibility problems is not an issue.
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Keith Broughton

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Re: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2016, 06:48:28 am »

Get the speakers up high, away from the stage (as Ivan said) and cut lows (as Reily said) and put a note on the lectern to "please speak close to the mc"
With voice, intellegibility does not require the FM DJ voice  sound so don't be afraid to use that high pass filter. Even if it sounds a bit "thin" it will be clear.
Then...hope for the best  :D
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Stephen Kirby

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Re: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2016, 01:29:55 am »

In such situations I've actually moved the speakers out into the room a bit.  As has been said, the biggest factor (in terms of set up) is the distance from the mic to the speakers.  But the other reason is that quiet speakers get scared when they hear their voice amplified and back off even more.  The closer the speaker cabinets are to the presenter, the more aware of them they are.  In order to get them up on the mic, you want the system to be as quiet on stage as possible.

As was also said, people in the front rows will hear some sound from the presenter.  And if the SOS are a couple of rows back up high and pointing to the rear of the room, some sound from them will still reach the front rows.  Maybe not the ultimate in clarity and HF but usually intelligible.  And the extra gain and bit of proximity will really help the rows further back.
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Roland Clarke

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Re: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2016, 09:17:15 am »

Give or take that speakers will be as close (or not) to the microphone as they can or feel comfortable being although this is technically the difference this is not going to factor.  Distance from microphone to speaker and volume are going to be the main factors.  Choose your microphone sensibly for the application and work accordingly.  Also consider height as this will effect your front to back level and hence intelligibility for the audience.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?
« Reply #15 on: October 23, 2016, 09:36:26 am »

And to put "another twist" into it.

Having the speakers  so that they put less sound onto the microphone actually accomplishes TWO things.

The obvious is more GBF, that is measurable.

The second is psychological.

Some people don't like to hear themselves through a PA system.

So when they hear themselves-they talk QUIETER, and if you turn them up, they talk even quieter.

So by having the speakers put less energy around the mic area, those people will not think they are as loud, so they will speak up a bit.  Or at least not speak quieter
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brian maddox

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Re: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?
« Reply #16 on: October 23, 2016, 11:07:13 am »

Okay, i'll attempt to answer the question.  :)

In truth, i think there are too many variables to know for sure.  Ordinarily i would vote for the position farther up stage as that puts more of the pattern away from the mic.  However, seeing as the speakers are now 5 feet farther away from the audience, they'll have to be slightly louder in order to achieve identical volume at the seats.  They're also a tiny bit closer to the mic which will tend to cause low end feedback to occur sooner.  And it's low end feedback that you're liable to fight the most.

My suggestion since this is a real world scenario would be to put one speaker in one position and one in the other and see which one you can make louder.  My prediction is that they will end up being very close to the same.
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Re: Speaker position for best GBF. Which parameter is more important?
« Reply #16 on: October 23, 2016, 11:07:13 am »


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