ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: 1 2 3 [4]   Go Down

Author Topic: Need emergency Dante help  (Read 20049 times)

Justice C. Bigler

  • SR Forums
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2799
  • Tulsa, Oklahoma
    • My homepage
Re: Posting Rules
« Reply #30 on: September 17, 2016, 02:39:11 PM »

Sorry for that. My real Name is now displayed.
I also have to correct myself: It's not an IOS issue, it was an issue with the dvs.
You are not using the latest version.
You can disable igmp snooping (like i told) or update to the latest dvs.

Greets Oli


I have long ago disabled IGMP snooping on this switch (A Cisco SG300-10), per the Yamaha set up guidelines. Maybe I should turn it back on and see what happens...
Logged
Justice C. Bigler
Business Rep, IATSE Local 354
www.justicebigler.com

Oliver Ettlin "Gemini"

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4
Re: Posting Rules
« Reply #31 on: September 22, 2016, 02:41:51 PM »


I have long ago disabled IGMP snooping on this switch (A Cisco SG300-10), per the Yamaha set up guidelines. Maybe I should turn it back on and see what happens...

In the Yamaha Set up Guide is mentioned that you turn it on. It usually also makes sens to have it on, but this special case you can solve the problem by turning it off. Or you upgrade your mac to the latest Dante Virtual Soundcard.

Greets
Logged

Leland Green

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 33
Re: Posting Rules
« Reply #32 on: September 22, 2016, 04:07:06 PM »

In the Yamaha Set up Guide is mentioned that you turn it on. It usually also makes sens to have it on, but this special case you can solve the problem by turning it off. Or you upgrade your mac to the latest Dante Virtual Soundcard.

Greets

Couple of things should be address before trying to help...  When using the SG300 with Dante, you do not need to configure QOS or IGMP snooping if you are only placing Dante devices on the network.  The only setting that needs to be configured is "Energy Efficient Ethernet" or "EEE".  This should be turned off.

When should you use QOS?  If you plan to have control data (i.e. CL Editor, StageMix, etc) on the network, as well as Dante audio, then the QOS settings in the guide should be used.  This will make sure the Dante traffic is given priority over all other traffic.  If you only have Dante traffic, you do not need to configure QOS.

When should you use IGMP Snooping? If you have a lot of multicast traffic on the network, IGMP will make sure that the multicast packets are only sent to devices that request it.  Without IGMP, the multicast traffic would be sent to every port, regardless of whether or not the device is subscribed to receive those packets.  Think of it as junk mail versus a magazine subscription.

Do I need to use multicast? It depends... Basically, Dante uses two methods for distributing audio.  Unicast Flows and Multicast Flows.  Unicast flows go to one device, multicast flows are sent everywhere on the network (unless IGMP is setup as described above).  The default method for audio distribution is unicast, and each unicast flow can contain up to 4-channels of audio. The alternate method, multicast flows, can have up to 8-channels per flow.  The number of flows, both unicast and multicast, available per device varies by device and can be viewed in Dante Controller ('Device View' -> 'Transmit' tab).  Understanding the number of available flows and how many channels can be placed in each flow will help you decide if you need to use multicast or unicast.

For example, our Rio3224-D has 32 flows.  Doing the math (32-channels / 4-channels per flow), we see that it takes 8 unicast flows to send all 32-channels to a single device.  Routing all 32-channels to 2 devices will use 16 flows.  Routing to 3 devices will use 24-flows and routing to 4-devices uses all 32 flows.  Therefore, if we need to send all 32-channels to 5 devices or more, this cannot be done using unicast.  We have to switch to multicast instead (wishbone looking icon on the 'device view' window).

Another example, DVS has 16 input flows and 16 output flows.  If I have DVS set to 64x64 and want to route all 64 channels to one device, this can be done using unicast (64-channels / 4-channels per flow = 16 flows). If I need to route audio to more than one device, this must be done using multicast flows. 

Same rules will apply to the input flows of DVS.  However, at this time, Dante Controller does not let you know how many input flows are being used.  So, if you are sending channels to DVS from multiple devices, you'll need to do the math and figure out if you have enough input flows available.

As for the problem you are having Justice, I have seen the red circle when there is just Dante traffic on the network in the cases listed below.  Some of them have already been mentioned, but I've included them anyway as this is how I typically troubleshoot the problem.

1)  Sample Rate mismatch
2)  Receiver and transmitter are in different IP subnets (i.e. 192.168.X.X vs 169.254.X.X.)
3)  Transmitting device is out of output flows
4)  Receiving device is out of input flows
5)  Dante Firmware incompatibility
6)  Hardware issues


Hardware issues popped up for us in one case involving a Mac.  The end user was able to use one Mac just fine, but his other Mac would not playback or record. Turned out that the chipset for the ethernet adapters was not the same between the two generations of Mac's.  They were both Macbook Pro's but did not perform equally with the built-in ethernet adapter.  Once we switched him over to a thunderbolt-to-ethernet adapter, he could record and playback without problems.  Same computer, different adapters, different results...
Logged
Leland Green
Training Manager, Technical Marketing Group
Yamaha Commercial Audio Systems, Inc.

Justice C. Bigler

  • SR Forums
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2799
  • Tulsa, Oklahoma
    • My homepage
Re: Need emergency Dante help
« Reply #33 on: September 23, 2016, 02:09:01 AM »

Leland, thanks for the information. You have laid out a better and more concise outline of how Dante handles unicast and multicast flows, and when to use each. I wish this info was presented as well in Yamaha's technical documents.

Also the infor about the SG300 switches should be in your set up guide.

Quick question, does Dante retain information about which computers have connected to the network? Even if they are no longer connected to it?

Say I have a CL5 and a pair of RIO3242s and I connect to a PM5D with 3 of the Dante MY cars, and then I have 3 different computers that have all connected to the Dante network at one time or another, but not at the same time...would that cause Dante to run out of unicast flows?

I'm still trying to work through this issue and so far have had no luck. I will try the few extra steps that you mentioned and report back.
Logged
Justice C. Bigler
Business Rep, IATSE Local 354
www.justicebigler.com

Scott Helmke

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2259
Re: Need emergency Dante help
« Reply #34 on: September 23, 2016, 11:36:20 AM »

Quick question, does Dante retain information about which computers have connected to the network? Even if they are no longer connected to it?

Say I have a CL5 and a pair of RIO3242s and I connect to a PM5D with 3 of the Dante MY cars, and then I have 3 different computers that have all connected to the Dante network at one time or another, but not at the same time...would that cause Dante to run out of unicast flows?

You raise an interesting question, bordering on the metaphysical - where exactly does "Dante" reside on a network?

I would guess that the individual devices remember which Dante names they connect to, and that's the extent of the memory. So it's the individual devices that are configured to send their unicast flows to specific other devices, and when you run out of configuration slots you're out of unicast flows.

My understanding is that Yamaha head amp control depends on those unicast flows, too.
Logged

Leland Green

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 33
Re: Need emergency Dante help
« Reply #35 on: September 26, 2016, 08:07:53 PM »

Quick question, does Dante retain information about which computers have connected to the network? Even if they are no longer connected to it?

Say I have a CL5 and a pair of RIO3242s and I connect to a PM5D with 3 of the Dante MY cars, and then I have 3 different computers that have all connected to the Dante network at one time or another, but not at the same time...would that cause Dante to run out of unicast flows?

I'm still trying to work through this issue and so far have had no luck. I will try the few extra steps that you mentioned and report back.

Definitely an interesting question!  I knew that the receiving device remembered it's subscription, but had to do a little testing to figure if the transmitting device remembered the receivers.  Short answer is no.

Here's the test:
1) Patched 32 channels of DVS to Device A (used 8 flows), then patched the same 32-channels to Device B (also used 8 flows, making the total DVS output flows 16. No more flows for DVS).

2) Removed Device B from the network (DVS dropped back to 8 flows), then patched DVS channel 33 to Device A (increased DVS flows to 9).   

3) Added Device B back to the network.

When Device B was added back to the network, it attempted to reestablish the original subscriptions for all 32 channels.  The last 4 channels of the 32 were unable to patch because DVS was out of flows (if you hover your mouse above the red circle, a text box will appear noting the reason).  Once I removed channel 33 from Device A, another flow became available and the last 4 channels of Device B reestablished their subscription.

So, the transmitting device will not remember which device was receiving the flows, only the number of flows currently used and currently available.  The receiving device will remember the subscriptions and attempt to subscribe to each channel until the transmitting device runs out of flows. Once the transmitter runs out of flows, the receiving device will show a red circle on any channel that was not restored.
Logged
Leland Green
Training Manager, Technical Marketing Group
Yamaha Commercial Audio Systems, Inc.

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Need emergency Dante help
« Reply #35 on: September 26, 2016, 08:07:53 PM »


Pages: 1 2 3 [4]   Go Up
 



Site Hosted By Ashdown Technologies, Inc.

Page created in 0.022 seconds with 24 queries.