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Author Topic: Time for an upgrade  (Read 12603 times)

Ray Aberle

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2016, 10:28:23 pm »

I just don't ever want to be in a situation where I don't have enough.
No one ever does. But sometimes it happens- client won't pay for it is a common cause. :(

-Ray
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Robert Piascik

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #11 on: September 03, 2016, 09:38:46 am »


4 KF650z's over 4 Dual 18" eaw subs


If you don't mind over 20 yr old technology and have a strong back, you can go with old, heavy stuff like this, there's a bunch of it available for reasonably cheap. If you want nicer, newer, lighter, better, then it will cost more. Asking 100 guys for opinions here is going to yield approx 100 different answers.

I moved from the above rig to some newer passive Danley stuff (SM80/TH118) not because I "already had the amps" but because it was better for ME, none of us can gauge what is better for YOU.

How do you deploy it (size and scope of your events), how do you move it, how do you store it, how often do you need it are all factors in the equation.
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Josh Carkner

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2016, 02:22:54 pm »

If you don't mind over 20 yr old technology and have a strong back, you can go with old, heavy stuff like this, there's a bunch of it available for reasonably cheap. If you want nicer, newer, lighter, better, then it will cost more. Asking 100 guys for opinions here is going to yield approx 100 different answers.

I moved from the above rig to some newer passive Danley stuff (SM80/TH118) not because I "already had the amps" but because it was better for ME, none of us can gauge what is better for YOU.

How do you deploy it (size and scope of your events), how do you move it, how do you store it, how often do you need it are all factors in the equation.

Gotcha. Well you pretty much stated the whole point of this thread. I want to know what others are doing do cover an outdoor rock gig for 300 people. I'm okay with 100 different answers.
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Don T. Williams

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #13 on: September 03, 2016, 02:45:50 pm »

Joshua and Scott, I apologize for remembering the MTH-1 and MTL-1 as the much larger MTH-4 and MTL-4 series.  Those were monsters by today's standards.  It's been a while but I have heard both systems and remembering them sounding good for their time and the application they were intended for.  But it really has been a while!

I still have a 24 box EV Xi-array rig that really impressed BE's, promoters, and audiences in the 90's, but I just don't want to have to lug those boxes around any more.  My current subs (db S30N's) are not any smaller but are lighter.  The db T-12's are about 65 lbs. vs. over 200 lbs. ea. for the Xi's, and are a hell of a lot easier to rig and fly!  Some might argue that the Xi rig might sound better, but the T12's meet the tech riders (has to be a line array), and being self powered are much easier to deal with.  And they too impress the BE's, promoters, and audiences.
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Stephen Kirby

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #14 on: September 03, 2016, 05:05:58 pm »

That would be the 2nd question.  Joshua, are you looking to fly something like a moderate sized LA or something like a Danley SH96?  Or is this for ground stack only?

The reason I asked about SPL is that I do a community park event for 300+ with a pair of DSR112s over 4 CuboSubs.  The last one was an R&B group.  The organizers are fine with mid 90's levels in the grass seating area and mid 100's where people are dancing.  They're talking about a larger event for which I've been investigating renting SM-80s over dual TH118s.  But if you want 115dB in the audience, that's a whole different level of equipment and is going to involve some fairly serious rigging.
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Rick Powell

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #15 on: September 04, 2016, 12:46:40 am »

That would be the 2nd question.  Joshua, are you looking to fly something like a moderate sized LA or something like a Danley SH96?  Or is this for ground stack only?

The reason I asked about SPL is that I do a community park event for 300+ with a pair of DSR112s over 4 CuboSubs.  The last one was an R&B group.  The organizers are fine with mid 90's levels in the grass seating area and mid 100's where people are dancing.  They're talking about a larger event for which I've been investigating renting SM-80s over dual TH118s.  But if you want 115dB in the audience, that's a whole different level of equipment and is going to involve some fairly serious rigging.

The OP said he wants to go lightweight and keep it under $1200 a box, probably used. There's not a lot of stuff I can think of in this category. The Community 920's or 960's are very loud and efficient mid/hi boxes and can be had for that price range, but they also cut off at a frequency similar to the MTH-1's. I agree, if you want to live with the weight, a pile of the EAW KF650/SB1000 boxes (2 of each a side, or maybe increase the subs if you want monster low end), WITH the UX8800 processor, would be a standard screaming outdoor system, and could be found for $1200 a box or less depending on model, condition and age.
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Robert Piascik

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #16 on: September 04, 2016, 08:44:45 am »

I want to know what others are doing do cover an outdoor rock gig for 300 people. I'm okay with 100 different answers.

I'm using Danley SM80 over 2x TH118 per side (which is over your budget). I can also use Yamaha DSR112/TH118 which is close to your budget but not as good.
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Pi Entertainment Services
Midas M32R / MR18
Behringer X32R / XR12
Danley SH50 / SM80 / TH118 / TH115
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RCF NX 12SMA
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Powersoft X4 / M50Q
Crown iT8k / Xti6k

Scott Bolt

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #17 on: September 04, 2016, 11:11:31 am »

I am a little confused on the budget.  $1200 a box is a good starting point, but does that assume that there will be only 2 tops over 2 subs?

Mr Kirby has nailed the other question very well.

When people say that you need lots of rig outdoors, they are referring to needing to have concert level sound coverage over a large area.  This is line array territory ..... and is out of budget for most of us mere mortals ;)

For most town festivals .... where it would not be unusual to see 300-500 people in the area of the stage, you don't usually need (or desire) concert level sound anywhere but the immediate area around the stage IMO.

This is how a pair of DSR112's over some competent subs (or several of them) can be a solution to your question.

I have covered such a show before with a pair of DSR112's with 4 JBL PRX 618S-XLF's center clustered.  This was for a Scorpions motorcycle club summer party of ~700.

The key to how this could work is that many of the people were not interested in sitting in an area where the SPL was >100db (just the dancers .... of which there were much less of ;) ).

In a festival setting, the people that are >70ft from stage, likely still want to be able to carry on a conversation.  If you can cover a 70x70 foot area with concert level sound, then you are OK in this type of venue IMO.

You should look seriously at the TH118's though.  They may appear to be quite expensive, but they can out-thump anything I can think of for the same price ..... and you have fewer of them to carry to do it.

The other thing to consider is the weight of each part you have to carry.

While it is true that an SRX828p is a great speaker for price/thump ratio, if you can't carry it or haul it, it doesn't really matter.  This is where having a bunch of PRX718XLF's pays off.  Each one isn't that heavy (~81lbs), and they put out very respectable amounts of thump.  I can carry one by myself in a pinch, but they are too large for most people to do by themselves.... and I greatly prefer a 2nd pair of hands myself to move them as well.

Just some things to think about.
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Rick Powell

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #18 on: September 04, 2016, 12:19:55 pm »

I'm using Danley SM80 over 2x TH118 per side (which is over your budget). I can also use Yamaha DSR112/TH118 which is close to your budget but not as good.

I also use the TH118/SM80 combo. It provides good coverage and sounds good at loud volumes, sound very detailed at a distance, and is very portable, but there are times where we could use more outdoors (Robert P has some experience with a "2 per side" TH118/SM80 combo). Finding these used, you might come close to your price range, but I have only seen a handful of TH118's and maybe 2 pair of SM80's ever in the used market...people tend to hang on to them once they get them.
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Josh Carkner

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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #19 on: September 04, 2016, 01:00:58 pm »

That would be the 2nd question.  Joshua, are you looking to fly something like a moderate sized LA or something like a Danley SH96?  Or is this for ground stack only?

A ground stack system is really what I'm looking for. If they did have the ability to be flown that may be useful for me some day.
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Re: Time for an upgrade
« Reply #19 on: September 04, 2016, 01:00:58 pm »


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