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Author Topic: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W  (Read 2667 times)

Neil White

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Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« on: October 11, 2016, 01:54:53 am »

Does anyone have practical experience interfacing an RTS 2 wire system with the newer Freespeak II Base 2. My specific question is how the Base handles things if both channel 1 and 2 on the RTS side are wet powered channels with +30v on them. I have the audio side working fine but before I send this out in a rental environment, I want to be sure the unit will not be damaged if two wet PL channels are assigned to the unit. I have had a slightly confused discussion with Clearcom who seem to suggest we will need to dry out the two wire before interfacing. Before I order custom panel work for our unit I thought I would reach out here to see if there is any real world experience of combining these systems.
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Pete Erskine

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2016, 10:24:41 am »

Does anyone have practical experience interfacing an RTS 2 wire system with the newer Freespeak II Base 2. My specific question is how the Base handles things if both channel 1 and 2 on the RTS side are wet powered channels with +30v on them. I have the audio side working fine but before I send this out in a rental environment, I want to be sure the unit will not be damaged if two wet PL channels are assigned to the unit. I have had a slightly confused discussion with Clearcom who seem to suggest we will need to dry out the two wire before interfacing. Before I order custom panel work for our unit I thought I would reach out here to see if there is any real world experience of combining these systems.

In RTS mode with power (and therefore termination) on the power is only on pin2.
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Pete Erskine
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Neil White

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2016, 10:26:33 am »

In RTS mode with power (and therefore termination) on the power is only on pin2.

And if in RTS mode with power off, termination off and an external PSU providing two wet channels to pin 2 + 3?
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brian maddox

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #3 on: October 11, 2016, 11:23:28 am »

And if in RTS mode with power off, termination off and an external PSU providing two wet channels to pin 2 + 3?

Which would be what would come out of a Studio Technologies Model 47a for instance.  Their website provides the following information regarding power on both pin 2 AND 3...

"The Model 47A is a little different, also providing two 2- channel interfaces but with power provided on both intercom channels of both interfaces. So on the 3-pin XLR interface connectors there is 30 volt DC power and channel 1 audio on pin 2 and 30 volt DC power and channel 2 audio on pin 3. This leads to the question: why would someone need power on both pins? Only if the Model 47A is being used to connect the party-line audio channels to beltpacks by way of a Source Assignment Panel. Commonly known in the TV field as SAP panels, they are typically used in TV production trucks and trailers. They can also be found in some fixed installations. An installation that uses a SAP panel will allow the Model 47As four party-line intercom channels (two associated with each of two interfaces) to be assigned (routed to) in any order to any beltpack. And by having power on all channels any routing combination made by the SAP panel will supply the connected beltpacks with their required power. (Remember that all beltpacks get their power only from pin 2.) In mobile production applications its typical for two or three Model 47A units to be used together to provide eight or twelve party-line channels that are connected to a SAP and then on to an I/O panel with multiple XLR connectors."

I'm not sure if Neil's application has anything in common with the ST application listed above, but it is an interesting question i'd love answered as well.  Just what WOULD happen if you introduced such a source directly to the single channel 2W inputs on the FSII.  Since i work regularly with both Model 47s AND FSII it not just an academic question for me.

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brian maddox
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Neil White

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #4 on: October 11, 2016, 01:23:23 pm »

I'm not sure if Neil's application has anything in common with the ST application listed above, but it is an interesting question i'd love answered as well.  Just what WOULD happen if you introduced such a source directly to the single channel 2W inputs on the FSII.  Since i work regularly with both Model 47s AND FSII it not just an academic question for me.

Thanks Brian, that is exactly the kind of scenario I was thinking of. Our PS20 supply's by default in RTS/2 mode have power on both channels. Whilst it would be nice to assume that most of the time we will be interfacing the FSII Base via 4W, the chances are that it may get plugged in to either a PS20 directly or a SAP with two wet channels assigned to it. Furthermore, this is a rental unit, and so it's important for us to know how the unit will behave if we send it out and it just gets plugged in to "some comms" without too much attention.

The unit handles the audio routing nicely - RTS TW plugged into 2W A shows up as channel 1 audio on A and channel 2 audio on B. I just want to have confidence that the unit can handle the DC voltage also. I would rather not have to package the unit with a bunch of DC blocking isolation transformers if it can be avoided.
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Pete Erskine

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2016, 04:13:01 pm »



I'm not sure if Neil's application has anything in common with the ST application listed above, but it is an interesting question i'd love answered as well.  Just what WOULD happen if you introduced such a source directly to the single channel 2W inputs on the FSII.  Since i work regularly with both Model 47s AND FSII it not just an academic question for me.

It would not affect the fsII at all.  Currently I am usinf a M47 to convert the 2W on my FSII and have it set to power in RTS mode.  The null on the 47 is always great but added with the nulling on the FSII Base2 it is virtually the same as the 4W 
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Neil White

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #6 on: October 11, 2016, 05:28:07 pm »

It would not affect the fsII at all.  Currently I am usinf a M47 to convert the 2W on my FSII and have it set to power in RTS mode.  The null on the 47 is always great but added with the nulling on the FSII Base2 it is virtually the same as the 4W

Looks like that is exactly what I was hoping for, that the FSII Base 2 is happy to accept DC Voltage from a model 47 or similar on both pin 2 and 3.

Thanks Pete, great to know its tried and tested and I'm not going to let the magic smoke out of our brand new base!
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brian maddox

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #7 on: October 11, 2016, 08:18:11 pm »

It would not affect the fsII at all.  Currently I am usinf a M47 to convert the 2W on my FSII and have it set to power in RTS mode.  The null on the 47 is always great but added with the nulling on the FSII Base2 it is virtually the same as the 4W

Great info.

At the risk of topic swerve, i'm curious what your use case is to use a M47 to convert the 2W on the FSII.  Adding more than four 4W ports to the FSII?  Or something more arcane.  Always curious to see how others solve Comms interface issues, especially when we're mixing and matching CC and RTS...
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"It feels wrong to be in the audience.  And it's too peopley!" - Steve Smith

brian maddox
bdmaudio@gmail.com

'...do not trifle with the affairs of dragons...

       ....for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup...'

Pete Erskine

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2016, 11:35:08 am »

Great info.

At the risk of topic swerve, i'm curious what your use case is to use a M47 to convert the 2W on the FSII.  Adding more than four 4W ports to the FSII?  Or something more arcane.  Always curious to see how others solve Comms interface issues, especially when we're mixing and matching CC and RTS...

I am using the stand alone base2 and needed 8 4-wire ports to interface to the Riedel.

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Pete Erskine
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brian maddox

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Re: Freespeak II Base 2 with RTS 2W
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2016, 03:41:58 pm »

I am using the stand alone base2 and needed 8 4-wire ports to interface to the Riedel.

Production
Audio
Lights
Truck Director
ISO audio
ISO SM
Producers
Truck A1

Makes perfect sense.  Thanks.

[Although i can't help but note that if you were using Eclipse HX with an E-Que card instead of Reidel you'd just have all those FS beltpacks available as ports on your matrix.  :)  Sorry, couldn't resist...]
« Last Edit: October 13, 2016, 04:53:12 pm by brian maddox »
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"It feels wrong to be in the audience.  And it's too peopley!" - Steve Smith

brian maddox
bdmaudio@gmail.com

'...do not trifle with the affairs of dragons...

       ....for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup...'
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