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Author Topic: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?  (Read 36119 times)

Keith Broughton

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #10 on: May 14, 2016, 08:59:46 am »

A couple of points ...
 
1) If you have two separate sources – one for vocals and one for the band there is no interference between the two arrays … theatre sound systems have been doing this for year…


Correct. I missed the post about the vocal/band split.
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #11 on: May 14, 2016, 09:52:45 am »

More pointless speculation by folks that don't know the gig or the rig.  Bah fucking humbug.
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Lee Buckalew

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #12 on: May 14, 2016, 10:33:56 am »

A couple of points ...
 
1) If you have two separate sources – one for vocals and one for the band there is no interference between the two arrays … theatre sound systems have been doing this for year…

2) The MLA is not really a line array and because of the way it works the output from each of the transducers sums in a very constructive way. The system can achieve very precise coverage and SPL. If you have ever had a play with a MLA system (and I have been that fortunate) … it’s like magic.

To reinforce Peters first point.
Dual or A, B systems where one system is used for vocals and one for band or even A, B, C systems where one is used for the band and vocalists are alternated between two different vocal systems so that no two performers singing in close proximity to each other come through the same speaker system, have been used in live theatre for decades.  This is not dependent on speaker design (point source, clusters, line arrays, speakers with no speaker boxes)  but on system design. 
Dave Rat has often hung A, B line array systems for his clients.  I have even seen churches hang A, B systems.  It really is done a lot.

Now, to Peters second point.  MLA is not a line array, it is a Multicellular Loudspeaker Array utilizing multicellular drive.  It creates a complex point source that is truly phenomenal in it's capabilities not only for the results in the actual environment but also for how accurately the software predicts the actual results that will be achieved (+- 0.5 dB between prediction and result is typical). The resolution of both the software and the actual system are unparalleled.


Lee
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Justice C. Bigler

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #14 on: May 14, 2016, 11:39:39 am »

Who agrees to pay for something like this?  That's 36 more boxes plus amps and processing, not to mention motors and labor.  And for what, a marginally better better mix?  Seems like fiscal irresponsibility to me.
I'm 99% sure that the client never speced an A-B/dual line array system . The production company that won the bid on the show won because they submitted the low bid for the size of the gig that they had. After that, everything they brought and set up was up to them. And if their head sound nerd wanted to bring two sets of speakers and amps and processing and run twice as much cable for the same amount of money as a single hang each side; Well, that's up to them.
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Justice C. Bigler

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #15 on: May 14, 2016, 11:41:58 am »

MLA is not a line array, it is a Multicellular Loudspeaker Array utilizing multicellular drive.  It creates a complex point source that is truly phenomenal in it's capabilities not only for the results in the actual environment but also for how accurately the software predicts the actual results that will be achieved (+- 0.5 dB between prediction and result is typical). The resolution of both the software and the actual system are unparalleled.


Wow! Is that straight out of their marketing literature?   ::)
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Peter Morris

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #16 on: May 14, 2016, 11:52:30 am »

I'm 99% sure that the client never speced an A-B/dual line array system . The production company that won the bid on the show won because they submitted the low bid for the size of the gig that they had. After that, everything they brought and set up was up to them. And if their head sound nerd wanted to bring two sets of speakers and amps and processing and run twice as much cable for the same amount of money as a single hang each side; Well, that's up to them.

... the MLA is self powered  :) .... no additional amps and processing
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #17 on: May 14, 2016, 11:54:12 am »

I'm 99% sure that the client never speced an A-B/dual line array system . The production company that won the bid on the show won because they submitted the low bid for the size of the gig that they had. After that, everything they brought and set up was up to them. And if their head sound nerd wanted to bring two sets of speakers and amps and processing and run twice as much cable for the same amount of money as a single hang each side; Well, that's up to them.

The festival has used dual PA in the past but with JBL VerTec.
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"Practicing an art, no matter how well or badly, is a way to make your soul grow, for heaven's sake. Sing in the shower. Dance to the radio. Tell stories. Write a poem to a friend, even a lousy poem. Do it as well as you possible can. You will get an enormous reward. You will have created something."  - Kurt Vonnegut

Peter Morris

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #18 on: May 14, 2016, 11:57:07 am »


Wow! Is that straight out of their marketing literature?   ::)


not really ... I have helped to set one up and measured it ... it does what they say.

« Last Edit: May 14, 2016, 12:03:50 pm by Peter Morris »
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Lee Buckalew

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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2016, 12:14:48 pm »


Wow! Is that straight out of their marketing literature?   ::)

Not even a little.  I don't believe that any marketing literature claims it to be a complex directional point source.  It does not function as a point source at the boxes it sums at the listening plane(s) to give that result at the listener, not at the array.  I was merely trying to show the precision of the system. 

MLA actually does what is claimed.  As R&D continues I think Martin will continue to make significant advances in the measurement and application of FIR and affecting vector summation which will continue to push the envelope for both themselves and for other manufacturers and researchers.

Lee
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Lee Buckalew
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Re: If one line array is good, 2 must be better right?
« Reply #19 on: May 14, 2016, 12:14:48 pm »


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