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[duane massey]

One size does not fit all. For small one-man (or woman) operations where the owner always sets up the gear. NL4's all around are OK. In my case I don't have anything that is biamped, and I prefer the NL4's.
If you have a bigger operation with greater needs (more personnel, multiple systems, etc) it would make sense to either have connectors match the cable, although I would tend to just use 4c cable on everything.

[George Dougherty]

Luke, I can see why that would leave a bad taste in your mouth, but a poorly designed system doesn't make me think using an NL2 instead of an NL4 is the best idea.  Like others said, my rig either doesn't go without me or it only goes with someone who knows it as well as I do.  If I were renting my rig without operator I'd probably change some things slightly but not much.  In your crazy scenario I'd prefer an amp panel with NL8's for the big snakes and I'd wire NL4's like my amp rack where adjacent jacks carry 1/2 on the first connector and +/-2 crossed to pin +/-1 on the second.  That allows for easy biamp, passthrough or single channel use just like the back of most modern amps and I'd have parallel NL4's setup along side the NL8's with everything clearly labeled.  I'd probably also have an NL8 out on the snake boxes so they could be used as an extension if necessary.  I've used rigs where you had to patch in odd ways or almost rewire an amp rack for every gig and it taught me the benefit of versatile connector bays even if it costs a few more dollars on the front end.

Admittedly, like others I'm headed towards an all 12/4 rig, but that's mostly for ease of pack and versatility for when I need more 4 conductor cables in a distributed setup than my current setup allows for.

I might also kick someone off my rig if they knowingly and purposefully wired up for a 1.6ohm load, but that's my gear and my protectiveness of its longevity.

[Luke Geis]

Notice I said cheap and clever? NL8 is expensive and you have to make a custom panel to boot for it to connect to the amps. Once it was all grasped in your head it was much easier, but walking in anew made for a head spin that took awhile to recoup from. Even being a pretty seasoned engineer by that point made it difficult to look at it and go oh yeah, easy peasy....... I know what pin 1 and pin 2 are. I even know what pin 3 and 4 are easily when I am holding an NL8 connection in my hand. It is more difficult when you have to look at something and go I now how many cables are in here, but is it 1 channel of amp per connector, or is it 2 channels of amp in parallel per connector? My major point being that if you have only two connections, it is very easy to know that if you have a connector that is known to only carry two connections. Same goes for NL4 and NL8. Shoot, even EP6 is easy to look at and know what is going on. When you have a system that uses either, or, you have to make it engineer ( and dare I say idiot ) proof..... I am going to look at a cable with NL4 connections and double check the cable to prove to myself it is 4con. This takes time. If the cable only has an NL2 and I know I only need a 2con cable, there is no doubt in my mind how many connections are in that cable end. If I have an NL8 in my hands, I expect 8 connections and that both ends are the same. NL4 connectors are the biggest point of failure in system setups that use both 2con and 4con cable. If the cable is not clearly marked, all bets are off if the cable has 2con in it. I would agree that using all 4con cable with NL4 connectors will eliminate all problems and give you the most versatility, but 90% of companies I have worked for ( many of them rather large ) have not met that level of duh yet.......

As to the 1.6 ohm load bit, I only did what I was told. Trust me I asked the same question you probably would; why on earth risk it? The owner said that the amps will tolerate since it is background and spoken work only; there is little fear of running the amp near its potential. At the time I wasn't in a position to argue, I just did what I was told. After further research, you begin to learn that it is actually OK to do. The nominal impedance of the speaker is rated as such, but its actual impedance VS. frequency is very different. While of course not being able to exactly calculate the impedance of a speaker at any given frequency, you can safely assume that it's average impedance will still be higher ( after cable length and range of frequency reproduction are factored ) than the nominal impedance at any given point in time. Keep in mind most of the time when we were doing this, we had hundreds of feet of cable between the amp and the last speaker in line. 200' of 12ga. cable has a .6ohm impedance. This alone would put the nominal impedance above a 2 ohm load. If you use a 50' cable between 5 speakers and a 100' cable snake to get to the speaker from the remote amp location, you can see how you would easily have better than 1 ohm of impedance just from the cable alone! Not so much of a fear anymore when you have broadband impedance eating away watts of power to a speaker that is 100' + away. Now if the speakers were within a very close distance with less than 100' of total cable between all of them, then yes, there could be a worry? Distributed sound system provision is a weird market segment, one I feel lucky to have been a part of and certainly glad to not have to do. When you have to get 10-12 speakers powered that are 100' or more away from the place where you can place and power an amp, you have to get creative and brave. The next option is 70volt, but they don't make a 70 volt version of an SRX712m and the client wants real speakers in plain view, what do you do? You run the least amount of cable as you can that gets the most amount of work done.

[Jonathan Burk]

Is there any sound quality compromise if I make homemade speaker cables with speakon/neutrik connectors (or generic maker if those are brand names) and 12-gauge lamp cord?    It seems like it would be a fraction of the cost compared to the ones on the major retailer websites.   And speaker cables should not be shielded or twisted, correct?

Or does someone have a source where you can get them at wholesale cost?

I've had good luck getting high quality PA speaker cables off of Craigslist and Ebay.  One guy sold me 100' of 12ga for $30!  I cut it into two 50' cables and they've been great for years. 

[Tom Roche]

Just for a giggle swerve, there was a craze a few years back amongst "cork sniffer" guitarist to chase down power cables from old vacuum cleaners to use as speaker cords.  Someone did this and claimed to hear an improvement on an internet board and it was off to the races.  People believed that years of passing near max rated current (in a 15A vacuum) did something to the wire that made it sound better.
Now it's probably a reasonable wire to use being round, jacketed, fairly flexible and around 14AWG.  But I wouldn't go hunting down old vacuums just to get some. 

It's true!  Kirby vacuum cleaner cords are supposed to be one of the best, and they're plentiful in pawn shops all over the U.S.  Sanitaire and Oreck get good ratings.  There's a cult-like following for Dyson vacuum cords.  They say Dyson cords do something special to the midrange, but they have too much low freq attenuation for me.  Stay away from Shark and Dirt Devil cords, which oddly are favored by a lot of DJs.

[Scott Holtzman]

It's true!  Kirby vacuum cleaner cords are supposed to be one of the best, and they're plentiful in pawn shops all over the U.S.  Sanitaire and Oreck get good ratings.  There's a cult-like following for Dyson vacuum cords.  They say Dyson cords do something special to the midrange, but they have too much low freq attenuation for me.  Stay away from Shark and Dirt Devil cords, which oddly are favored by a lot of DJs.

ROFL....

I remember trying to have a conversation with an 'audiophile' who claimed they could hear the difference in cables.  I pointed out to him that the cables the music was recorded on are very ordinary by comparison. 

I didn't win the argument and that was the beginning of a new rule that I can't comment on video or audio system in social situations.  A couple of Thanksgiving's ago my wife and I were at her sons house.  He was all proud of his flatscreen mounted on the wall however the cable was running down the wall.  I drove back home and got my tools and fished the wire behind the studs as I could not sit there and look at it. 

I was told this was not socially acceptable.  Like telling someone they were stupid for spending hundreds of dollars for speaker cables.

We don't get asked out a lot.

[John Roberts {JR}]

ROFL....

I remember trying to have a conversation with an 'audiophile' who claimed they could hear the difference in cables.  I pointed out to him that the cables the music was recorded on are very ordinary by comparison. 

I try to never argue with people about what they "hear". It can be proved or disproved by controlled listening tests, but that is more work than most will tolerate.

I didn't win the argument and that was the beginning of a new rule that I can't comment on video or audio system in social situations.  A couple of Thanksgiving's ago my wife and I were at her sons house.  He was all proud of his flatscreen mounted on the wall however the cable was running down the wall.  I drove back home and got my tools and fished the wire behind the studs as I could not sit there and look at it. 

I was told this was not socially acceptable.  Like telling someone they were stupid for spending hundreds of dollars for speaker cables.

We don't get asked out a lot.

You want to visit me? I have some outlets that need re-wiring.


JR

[Luke Geis]

I have 2 large screen tv's mounted on the wall! I call them my big black orbs that float on the wall. Most anyone who comes to my place is in awe about how I can have a sound bar, Playstation, chromecast and everything else going to the tv in which no cables can be seen going to and from it. The next phase is totally networking the house! I am fortunate here to have 100+mb connection speeds! I will eventually have 4k capability in every room and everything will be on a gigabit network.

I will say that the capacitance of and length of a guitar cable will make a difference in the sound of an electric guitar, but the difference between 5 cables will be so small that it is not something to invest time and money in. Monster cable can kiss my booty, some of my best sounding guitar cables are the cheapest Sam Goody cables money can buy at $14 for a 25' cable! My most expensive $50 " studio grade " guitar cable is actually the worst sounding one I own........

As to speaker cables, they are so far from the weakest link in the chain that there is no point even worrying about it. No sonic compromise no matter what cable you use. To me it is about function. We buy round black cable because it is the easiest to run, coil and maintain while also looking good when ran well. Try doing that with zip cord, or explaining to a client that your using a Kirby vacuum cleaner power cable for speaker cable when he came over to tell you he thinks the sound isn't right, it needs more XXX.......

[Stephen Kirby]

In a high impedance guitar cable, the wire will make a noticeable difference.  I don't like Monster cables as all I've tried have been microphonic.  You can slap them on a stage and hear them.  George L's are supposed to be super hi-fi but sound shrill to me.  I do use them within a pedal board (which has a passive bypass switch box I built on it to avoid the pedals when I'm not using them).  My preferred cable sonically is Planet Wave.  Balanced sound and no microphonics.  Not wild about the spring thing on the sleeve of the plug but I've only had one hang up on me over the last 10 years.

In home hi-fi the effect is less but still noticeable with some equipment.  You just try things and see what works between the stages that it's put.  I've got some cables that sound euphonic and rolled off, others are excessively bright into some inputs.  There's no "best", it's just what works best.

[Scott Holtzman]

In a high impedance guitar cable, the wire will make a noticeable difference.  I don't like Monster cables as all I've tried have been microphonic.  You can slap them on a stage and hear them.  George L's are supposed to be super hi-fi but sound shrill to me.  I do use them within a pedal board (which has a passive bypass switch box I built on it to avoid the pedals when I'm not using them).  My preferred cable sonically is Planet Wave.  Balanced sound and no microphonics.  Not wild about the spring thing on the sleeve of the plug but I've only had one hang up on me over the last 10 years.

In home hi-fi the effect is less but still noticeable with some equipment.  You just try things and see what works between the stages that it's put.  I've got some cables that sound euphonic and rolled off, others are excessively bright into some inputs.  There's no "best", it's just what works best.

Stephen, a microphonic cable?  I would have to see it to believe it?  What are you doing knocking the electrons around?

[ProSoundWeb Community]