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Author Topic: Wireless Measurement Capsule??  (Read 5679 times)

Lou Kohley

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Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« on: April 09, 2016, 03:26:54 pm »

I recently purchase a Line 6 wireless measurement setup that I like, but is a bit clunky.
It got me thinking, I have the Line 6 handheld mics. Is there a way to make a screw on omni measurement capsule.

This would be way more compact and clean looking. I know the handheld can't supply phantom but I imagine it can do the bias current.
I'm trying to learn more about how wireless capsules work. Is this idea possible?

LOU
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2016, 04:36:19 pm »

I recently purchase a Line 6 wireless measurement setup that I like, but is a bit clunky.
It got me thinking, I have the Line 6 handheld mics. Is there a way to make a screw on omni measurement capsule.

This would be way more compact and clean looking. I know the handheld can't supply phantom but I imagine it can do the bias current.
I'm trying to learn more about how wireless capsules work. Is this idea possible?

LOU
The most important thing is to use a OMNI mic element.

I am not familiar with the line 6 systems but do they have one that has no companding?

MOST wireless mics use companding (compression/expansion).  This will mess with your measurements.
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Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

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Doug Fowler

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2016, 06:20:33 pm »

The most important thing is to use a OMNI mic element.

I am not familiar with the line 6 systems but do they have one that has no companding?

MOST wireless mics use companding (compression/expansion).  This will mess with your measurements.

Line 6 wireless is good to go for measurement.

I have two channels.  It's taken a while to catch on, but it works.  No companding.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2016, 10:35:35 pm »

Line 6 wireless is good to go for measurement.

I have two channels.  It's taken a while to catch on, but it works.  No companding.
Good to know.

I have heard of many people who try to use normal wireless and have issues.
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Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

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Lou Kohley

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #4 on: April 10, 2016, 11:59:56 am »

I appreciate the advice.

I am using a setup similar to Doug's. Measurement mic to Countryman Phantom PSU to Line6 belt pack. It works well but is bulky and ugly.

My idea in the first post would be to take the handheld version of the wireless and have a special omni measurement capsule made to screw on to the body.

It would make the handheld a fat looking measurement mic. I don't know how accurate something like this would be. I wanted to see if anyone had heard of anything like this. Or if it's even possible.

LOU
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #5 on: April 10, 2016, 01:26:01 pm »

We have 2 different wireless setups we use.  Depending on what the job requires.

I still like wire best  however-and carry long lengths.  But in some cases-stadiums and such-wire gets to be a bit unpractical.

For single channel I use the Lectrosonics that we simply plug a regular omni mic into.

For mutlichannel, I have 8 channels of (I am drawing a blank on the brand) but it is a cheaper brand that has no companding.

I use the omni lav mics.  Yes they are not as flat as a real mic, but they are close enough-especially below 12Khz-which you can't even get to in a stadium at 800'.

I have little "clip on" poles that we attach to seats and clip the mics to the tops of the poles.

I know it seems "cheesy", but does the job great.  We set up high gain directional antennas to get the distances we need.
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Ivan Beaver
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Russell Ault

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2016, 12:56:59 am »

For mutlichannel, I have 8 channels of (I am drawing a blank on the brand) but it is a cheaper brand that has no companding.

I use the omni lav mics.  Yes they are not as flat as a real mic, but they are close enough-especially below 12Khz-which you can't even get to in a stadium at 800'.

Hi Ivan!

Any chance you could look up that brand for us? Also, which omni lavs are you using? Did you create calibration files for them?

Thanks!

-Russ
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Helge A Bentsen

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2016, 01:48:21 pm »

I recently purchase a Line 6 wireless measurement setup that I like, but is a bit clunky.
It got me thinking, I have the Line 6 handheld mics. Is there a way to make a screw on omni measurement capsule.

This would be way more compact and clean looking. I know the handheld can't supply phantom but I imagine it can do the bias current.
I'm trying to learn more about how wireless capsules work. Is this idea possible?

LOU


If you have a handheld transmitter, you can fit a DPA Microphones SL1 adapter and a DPA 4007 capsule on it.
Ive used my d:factos with Line6 this way several times(d:facto is a SL1 adapter with a 4018V capsule)
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Don Boomer

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2016, 12:02:26 am »

The most important thing is to use a OMNI mic element.

I am not familiar with the line 6 systems but do they have one that has no companding?

MOST wireless mics use companding (compression/expansion).  This will mess with your measurements.

Not only do they not have any compression/expansion but they also have no data compression. Generally speaking digital wireless systems don't have companding but they do have data compression which generally causes a lot of phase shift. No phase shift with Line 6 until you get up to 19kHZ.
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Don Boomer
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Scott Carneval

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2016, 09:48:15 am »

Not only do they not have any compression/expansion but they also have no data compression. Generally speaking digital wireless systems don't have companding but they do have data compression which generally causes a lot of phase shift. No phase shift with Line 6 until you get up to 19kHZ.

Don,

Can you point us to a specific model of Line 6 wireless that would be suitable for measurement? Is there a device that will allow me to use my existing omni measurement mic (wired) with one of your belt-pack transmitters?

Thanks.
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Martin Morris

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2016, 07:50:34 am »

Not only do they not have any compression/expansion but they also have no data compression. Generally speaking digital wireless systems don't have companding but they do have data compression which generally causes a lot of phase shift. No phase shift with Line 6 until you get up to 19kHZ.

Hi Don, attached screen shot of my XD-V75 setup. Amazing bit of kit for the price. Green trace is Line 6 Phase, increasing from 1k.
Red trace with Phase correction filter. Is anyone else getting this? - pink noise source.

Mag is ruler flat.

PS - I purchased your Line 6 P180s off eBay last year, they work well ... cheers

Cheers
Martin
« Last Edit: June 09, 2016, 08:09:10 am by Martin Morris »
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fedele de marco

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2016, 12:15:16 pm »

I recently purchase a Line 6 wireless measurement setup that I like, but is a bit clunky.
It got me thinking, I have the Line 6 handheld mics. Is there a way to make a screw on omni measurement capsule.

This would be way more compact and clean looking. I know the handheld can't supply phantom but I imagine it can do the bias current.
I'm trying to learn more about how wireless capsules work. Is this idea possible?

LOU


I regularly use a V75 Line 6 with two different microphones:

The Isemcom Isemic 725 TR
and the italian MELLAB TX-3

isemic has custom cables.
For other microphones i suggest the use of a denecke or countryman phantom power supply

They directly are put in the belt pack fromthe bios of which are directly fed.

This is the measure of the Line 6 system.

this is the best response you can find iin a not purely dedicated trading system.

The phase response in from 8 Kz and up is not a problem. Remember that you use this system
 in live optimizations, and with only one microphone normally, in difficult situations.  So...we are talking about relative measures.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2016, 12:17:20 pm by fedele de marco »
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Sven Oxtoby

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Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2016, 05:47:24 am »

Hi Lou

I know the handheld can't supply phantom but I imagine it can do the bias current.
I'm trying to learn more about how wireless capsules work. Is this idea possible?

I can't address your specific situation re: Line6, but for more background on this kind of idea, maybe also take a look at Beyerdynamic's TGMM1w omni measurement mic capsule for their flagship TG1000 (digital) wireless mic system. Adele's system engineer uses it.
http://europe.beyerdynamic.com/shop/mp/microphones/vocals-and-instruments/stage-vocals/tg-1000/tg-mm1w.html

EDIT: I just saw that this was already posted in another thread.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2016, 05:51:33 am by Sven Oxtoby »
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Sven Oxtoby
Ox Audio (http://www.oxaudio.co.za)
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Wireless Measurement Capsule??
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2016, 05:47:24 am »


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