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Author Topic: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure  (Read 3163 times)

Peter Hvedstrup

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Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« on: November 25, 2015, 03:38:34 am »

Hi all

I find my TSW-718 and TFL-760Ht sounding i bit bright with the standard Turbos settings, i was wondering if my gain structure is off. Most jobs is mostly one stack each side with 1x TSW-718 and 1x Flood, so no need to compensate for summing mids.

The settings from the Turbosound dsp spreadsheet suggests a relative gain of +2 db on the TSW-718 and 0db on the 12", 6.5"and 1". My amps all have a fixed 32db voltage gain and therefore i have just adjusted my dsp with +2db on the subs. What are your experiences?

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jason misterka

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2015, 06:21:28 am »

Hi all

I find my TSW-718 and TFL-760Ht sounding i bit bright with the standard Turbos settings, i was wondering if my gain structure is off. Most jobs is mostly one stack each side with 1x TSW-718 and 1x Flood, so no need to compensate for summing mids.

The settings from the Turbosound dsp spreadsheet suggests a relative gain of +2 db on the TSW-718 and 0db on the 12", 6.5"and 1". My amps all have a fixed 32db voltage gain and therefore i have just adjusted my dsp with +2db on the subs. What are your experiences?



Those settings are for the standard Turbo amp rack of the day, which was two T45 on the bottom and two T25 on top.

If I recall correctly there was a BIG gain difference between the two amplifiers, something like 26dB vs 35.7dB input gain.   

So you should turn down your highs and mids significantly.  Brightness is not typically the issue with these boxes, though maybe it will stick out more with only one per side. 

Jason
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Peter Hvedstrup

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2015, 06:43:20 am »

Those settings are for the standard Turbo amp rack of the day, which was two T45 on the bottom and two T25 on top.

If I recall correctly there was a BIG gain difference between the two amplifiers, something like 26dB vs 35.7dB input gain.   

So you should turn down your highs and mids significantly.  Brightness is not typically the issue with these boxes, though maybe it will stick out more with only one per side. 

Jason
Thanks for your reply

I thought i was for relative gain which means that i have been running my system wrong for a while.

If i i compensate for the different gains on the MC2 amps to my fixed 32db gain on my Powersofts it would look like this but i surely need to use my ears.

        Gain    Powersoft   Relative gain on my amps.
T45   35,75 +2           32                   5,75 Low
T45   35,75     0          32                   3,75 Low-mid
T25    26     0          32                    -6   Hi-mid
T25    26     0          32                    -6   Hi
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Scott Carneval

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2015, 07:58:04 am »

I assume you don't have a measurement rig? The numbers Turbosound gives are a good starting point but there are some variables at play even among different brands of amp/dsp.


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Peter Hvedstrup

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2015, 08:05:52 am »

I assume you don't have a measurement rig? The numbers Turbosound gives are a good starting point but there are some variables at play even among different brands of amp/dsp.


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Hi

If the the gains from Turbosound are relative only to specific amps with odd gains they are hardly a good starting point?

I don't own a measuring rig but will soon have it smaarted.

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Scott Carneval

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2015, 08:28:20 am »

Hi

If the the gains from Turbosound are relative only to specific amps with odd gains they are hardly a good starting point?

I don't own a measuring rig but will soon have it smaarted.

The gains are probably your easiest parameter to 'get right' just using your ears and calculator (as you've already done). The delays and crossover points are going to require some fine tuning. Different filters in different DSP's will behave differently, which may require some adjustments to the delay and/or crossover points to compensate.
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jason misterka

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2015, 10:07:56 am »

The gains are probably your easiest parameter to 'get right' just using your ears and calculator (as you've already done). The delays and crossover points are going to require some fine tuning. Different filters in different DSP's will behave differently, which may require some adjustments to the delay and/or crossover points to compensate.

That is correct but I would also say that these boxes were built before the prevalence of DSP and when we first got our Floodlight rig years ago it was utilizing BSS analog crossovers without the ability to add delay.  I'm sure an able tech can add value and SQ with an alignment, but it shouldn't sound that bad without one, or there is a problem in the gain structure of the bands.

Jason
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Scott Carneval

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2015, 10:28:28 am »

No doubt it will still sound very good with the given settings. Tony Andrews designed the Floodlights to be 'phase coherent' without any added delay back in the 90's but I think that term carried a different meaning than it does today.

I guess my point is that if you're using modern DSP there's still some room for improvement if you have a proper measurement rig and the chops to use it.


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Dave Pluke

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2015, 10:44:58 am »

If the the gains from Turbosound are relative only to specific amps with odd gains they are hardly a good starting point?

They're a good starting spot for HPF, LPF, polarity and delay.

If one is not using the mated amps of the day, gain structures have to be determined from scratch.

Dave
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Peter Hvedstrup

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Re: Turbosound Floodlight gain structure
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2015, 05:50:29 am »

They're a good starting spot for HPF, LPF, polarity and delay.

If one is not using the mated amps of the day, gain structures have to be determined from scratch.

Dave

Ok!

Thanks for all your replies. I will fiddle with gains and report back.
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