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Author Topic: Combining power/signal in one wire idea  (Read 8573 times)

Tim McCulloch

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2015, 02:15:53 am »

Is the outer jacket SO rated, or does the inner jacket on the AC cord combined with the outer jacket material combine to provide SO grade protection of the conductors?  (I hope that makes sense; the links don't readily provide that spec.)

Good question.  My guess is that this gets rated SJO or some variation thereof but you'd have to ask the manufacturers.
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Michael Thompson

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2015, 04:09:37 am »

Is the outer jacket SO rated, or does the inner jacket on the AC cord combined with the outer jacket material combine to provide SO grade protection of the conductors?  (I hope that makes sense; the links don't readily provide that spec.)

I've never seen this type of cable SO rated, but from what I gather reading the NEC code book (don't quote me on this), it doesn't have to be.  It falls under a different category due to it's "high-tech" or "proprietary" nature.
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Mark Cadwallader

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #12 on: November 06, 2015, 09:24:05 am »

I've never seen this type of cable SO rated, but from what I gather reading the NEC code book (don't quote me on this), it doesn't have to be.  It falls under a different category due to it's "high-tech" or "proprietary" nature.

Thank you. Hmmm. I'll see what I can find out, but I'm not sure if it would be worth an argument with the AHJ. Has anybody here been questioned by an AHJ about the use of combo cables?  (It might not be a real world issue, especially at the Lounge level, but I'm a cautious SOB.)
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #13 on: November 06, 2015, 09:47:10 am »

I've never seen this type of cable SO rated, but from what I gather reading the NEC code book (don't quote me on this), it doesn't have to be.  It falls under a different category due to it's "high-tech" or "proprietary" nature.

The most recent full NEC I have here is almost 10 years old and much has been updated in the last 3 Code cycles.

I think the big question will be if the "siamese" assembly has to meet the same requirements as any other electrical cable used in the same "occupancy", or if it's considered a detachable appliance supply cord.

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"Practicing an art, no matter how well or badly, is a way to make your soul grow, for heaven's sake. Sing in the shower. Dance to the radio. Tell stories. Write a poem to a friend, even a lousy poem. Do it as well as you possible can. You will get an enormous reward. You will have created something."  - Kurt Vonnegut

Rob Spence

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #14 on: November 06, 2015, 10:59:44 am »

The most recent full NEC I have here is almost 10 years old and much has been updated in the last 3 Code cycles.

I think the big question will be if the "siamese" assembly has to meet the same requirements as any other electrical cable used in the same "occupancy", or if it's considered a detachable appliance supply cord.

My read is that it is a detachable (since it does) appliance cord though since it isn't the one supplied with the device that could be questioned.

I have some 50' Siamese cables I use with my ZXa5s. Mostly I use em when not over subs.



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Michael Thompson

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #15 on: November 06, 2015, 11:46:02 am »

I'll also point out that Meyer Sound has offered "siamese" cables for years.  It's basically the same cable, but they use a multipin on the ends.  I rarely see this option in the wild, but one would assume that if a company like Meyer offers it, they have done the research.
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Mike Pyle

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2015, 11:50:12 am »

Yes they ARE bulky, all versions I have seen.
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Stephen Swaffer

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2015, 12:06:25 pm »

NEC 2014

640.8 allows "insulated conductors of different systems...to be bundled... in portable cords or cables, shall comply with 300.3(c)(1)."   And that says that all conductors must have insulation rated at highest voltage present.

The following is in section III Portable and Temporary Audio System installations:

640.41 addresses multi-pin connectors.  Basically have to be able to handle the load and be impossible to connect incorrectly-can't use edison's, etc.

640.42 makes a distinction between

 "(A) Between Equipment and branch circuit power.  Power supply cords for audio equipment shall be listed and shall be permitted to be used where the interchange, maintenance or repair is facilitated..."
 
and in 

(E) requires "equipment racks" to be supplied with extra-hard usage cord.

525 does not address combination use cables- it does reference to 640.



Seems to be a LOT of room for interpretation-might want to take the inspector out to a very nice lunch  and ask him his interpretation.

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Steve Swaffer

Frank DeWitt

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2015, 06:46:24 pm »

Just dreaming here but we know that the first thing that happens to that AC inside the amp is it gets converted to + and - DC.   It seems that it would be easier to place the power supply near the AC source and  send + and - 30 volt DC down a cable with line level audio.

I know, no one makes a powered speaker with a external powersupply, but perhaps they should.
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David Sturzenbecher

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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2015, 07:03:42 pm »


I know, no one makes a powered speaker with a external powersupply, but perhaps they should.

You can order SpeakerPower amps that will take 24VDC input.
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Re: Combining power/signal in one wire idea
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2015, 07:03:42 pm »


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