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[Frank Czar]

Hi Guys,

Wondering how the Yamaha TF series is doing in the real world? I have not seen or heard to much about it since its release. Any one have one, use one? Opinions?
I've just heard a lot of people gripe about the preset and auto gain feature, this is not an issue as it can be defeated and you can adjust everything manually.
I own and have owned over 12 Yamaha's (Pro stuff that is, I can't comment on MI stuff)and the one thing I love is their reliability.

[Riley Casey]

Second hand info but ...  A person who's ears and judgement I trust a great deal had a shoot out in their shop between the TF and the X32 and the Behringer won on both sound and useablity.  On the basis of that I bought two X32s this summer and my five other digital consoles are all Yamaha.

[Jeff Foster]

Hi Guys,

Wondering how the Yamaha TF series is doing in the real world? I have not seen or heard to much about it since its release. Any one have one, use one? Opinions?
I've just heard a lot of people gripe about the preset and auto gain feature, this is not an issue as it can be defeated and you can adjust everything manually.
I own and have owned over 12 Yamaha's (Pro stuff that is, I can't comment on MI stuff)and the one thing I love is their reliability.

I have one.  I like it.  It works well for my needs...

http://forums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/topic,154290.msg1422668.html#msg1422668

[Wichak Chanmuang]

Hate this mixer. I pray not to see it on my band's shows. Why? Here are the reasons
- touch screen only to adjust anything. It's too slow to work with.
- very thin sound.
- only 2 Efx engine. Not enough for me.

[Frederik Rosenkjær]

- only 2 Efx engine. Not enough for me.

It has more than two FX engines. You can get more by using some of the stereo auxes into which the extra engines can be inserted. Then you can route the busses to the stereo bus and then you have more send/receive effects.

[Scott Helmke]

I like it, though it's not as heavily featured-laden as the more expensive consoles. Sounds good, pretty good design for a starter digital console.

The touch screen interface is miles ahead of the previous Yamaha generations, even the CL/QL. And the network control is super easy to set up.

[Jeff Foster]

- touch screen only to adjust anything. It's too slow to work with.

You obviously haven't ever touched one and are basing your statements on a likely very brief internet view.  There is a nice big silver knob called the 'touch and turn' knob.  Tap on any setting on the screen and that physical control knob now controls that function.  You also have four user defined knobs that can be set to control functions regardless of what the touch screen shows - again, giving you physical tactile controls.

- very thin sound.

Personal preference.  It clearly sounds better to me than the LS9 or M7CL consoles.  It may not be in CL territory, but it doesn't cost anywhere near that much either.  The sound quality is just as good as any other console in it's price range.

[Wichak Chanmuang]

You obviously haven't ever touched one and are basing your statements on a likely very brief internet view.  There is a nice big silver knob called the 'touch and turn' knob.  Tap on any setting on the screen and that physical control knob now controls that function.  You also have four user defined knobs that can be set to control functions regardless of what the touch screen shows - again, giving you physical tactile controls.



Personal preference.  It clearly sounds better to me than the LS9 or M7CL consoles.  It may not be in CL territory, but it doesn't cost anywhere near that much either.  The sound quality is just as good as any other console in it's price range.

"Touch and turn" is the basic feature found on every touch screen console, so I don't count it. The more buttons that correspond to the function, the better you can mix without to put too much concentration on the mixer. So I still prefer the digital mixer with more knobs ^___^


Ok.. Let take it as you say..  "Personal Preference"

[Jeff Foster]

"Touch and turn" is the basic feature found on every touch screen console, so I don't count it. The more buttons that correspond to the function, the better you can mix without to put too much concentration on the mixer. So I still prefer the digital mixer with more knobs ^___^

One word: Digico

I used to think the same way until I took a chance and got a Steinberg CMC-AI controller for Cubase (My DAW of choice).  I thought it was pretty gimmicky at the time.  I wanted lots and lots of buttons and knobs because that's what would impress other people.  But I got it for a good deal and figured I'd give it a shot.  Now, I can't imagine editing without it.  It makes editing a LOT faster than having a separate knob for each function or a bank of knobs for varying functions.  With it, I just point with the mouse to what I want to control, and turn the AI knob.  I found it has actually made me far more productive.

When I saw that Yamaha had adopted the same idea with the TF series, I figured it would be just as useful in a live setting.  In fact, even before the TF came out, I sometimes wished the consoles I found myself running had a similar function.  The Digico's have it(*), but I can't afford one of those.  Having had my TF3 for a while now, I can say that I can mix MUCH faster using the touch screen and the touch and turn knob than I ever could with having separate knobs.  It is far faster to glance at the screen and tap the function I want, than to search through a bank of identical knobs to make sure I grab the right one.  I actually spend less time looking at the console now.  That time searching through all those knobs to find the right one is now spent looking at the stage making sure I don't miss anything, or spent fine tuning other areas that I never had the time to do before.

You said that it is found on every touch screen console.  I'd like to know what other consoles have it (other than the Digicos).  Maybe I haven't been looking closely enough, but I don't recall seeing that kind of function on any other sub $10k console.

(*) I have seen interviews of big name engineers using Digico consoles that have pretty much found the same thing...they enjoy using the touch and turn knob and find themselves using it way more often than they thought they would because of how much faster it is to do things with it.

[Wichak Chanmuang]

One word: Digico

I used to think the same way until I took a chance and got a Steinberg CMC-AI controller for Cubase (My DAW of choice).  I thought it was pretty gimmicky at the time.  I wanted lots and lots of buttons and knobs because that's what would impress other people.  But I got it for a good deal and figured I'd give it a shot.  Now, I can't imagine editing without it.  It makes editing a LOT faster than having a separate knob for each function or a bank of knobs for varying functions.  With it, I just point with the mouse to what I want to control, and turn the AI knob.  I found it has actually made me far more productive.

When I saw that Yamaha had adopted the same idea with the TF series, I figured it would be just as useful in a live setting.  In fact, even before the TF came out, I sometimes wished the consoles I found myself running had a similar function.  The Digico's have it(*), but I can't afford one of those.  Having had my TF3 for a while now, I can say that I can mix MUCH faster using the touch screen and the touch and turn knob than I ever could with having separate knobs.  It is far faster to glance at the screen and tap the function I want, than to search through a bank of identical knobs to make sure I grab the right one.  I actually spend less time looking at the console now.  That time searching through all those knobs to find the right one is now spent looking at the stage making sure I don't miss anything, or spent fine tuning other areas that I never had the time to do before.

You said that it is found on every touch screen console.  I'd like to know what other consoles have it (other than the Digicos).  Maybe I haven't been looking closely enough, but I don't recall seeing that kind of function on any other sub $10k console.

(*) I have seen interviews of big name engineers using Digico consoles that have pretty much found the same thing...they enjoy using the touch and turn knob and find themselves using it way more often than they thought they would because of how much faster it is to do things with it.

I assume that you haven't tried any Allen-Heath Mixers. QU series is in the same price range with TF serie. 

[Ray Aberle]

I assume that you haven't tried any Allen-Heath Mixers. QU series is in the same price range with TF serie.

Yeah, but the OP did not ask about the QU series; he asked about the Yamaha TFs...

-Ray

[Scott Helmke]

Yeah, but the OP did not ask about the QU series; he asked about the Yamaha TFs...

The Qu also has the Touch 'n' Turn type functionality, which is probably why it was brought up.

[Cristian Good]

Hi Guys,

Wondering how the Yamaha TF series is doing in the real world? I have not seen or heard to much about it since its release. Any one have one, use one? Opinions?
I've just heard a lot of people gripe about the preset and auto gain feature, this is not an issue as it can be defeated and you can adjust everything manually.
I own and have owned over 12 Yamaha's (Pro stuff that is, I can't comment on MI stuff)and the one thing I love is their reliability.

I used the TF5 every day for 2 months straight this past summer on the road with The Cavaliers Drum and Bugle Corps. I was a little skeptical at first like most people but after using it for awhile there were a lot of things that I really like. Here are just a couple things that I noticed as I went throughout the summer.

1. The TF Series SPANKS the X32 in friendliness and appearance. The touch screen was pretty bright and the Scribble strips are WAY brighter and more detailed than the X32. The one thing that always throws me off with the X32 is that I want to touch things to select things which you can with the TF. In a world where everything is touch that is a big feature in my opinion. That being said, I really wish Yamaha would have copied the X32 and put all the Knobs and parameters for a single channel on the massive blank space where the Ipad goes. I also wish it had more stuff on the back. The x32 is LOADED when it comes to that. And of course the price difference is a big part as well.

2. As far as the sound goes I didn't notice a huge detriment. I was using 4 Yamaha DSR215s and 2 DSR115s (no subs I know. not my choice.) I had no problem pushing the sound I needed. I really like the presets that are in the board. Yeah there are the specific mic ones which are nice but the OUTPUT presets are killer. Especially the one knob loudness EQ on the main with the DSP switch on the speakers on sounded incredible.

3. I loved the easy Ipad/ipod plug and knob right next to the screen. Also the user defined knobs and keys were nice. They also doubled the libraries from the 01v96i. 200 scenes, 200 presets, etc. The effects were okay.

DISADVANTAGES (Things that I noticed or didn't like.)

1. I was running 32 channels with about 50ish scenes. Each channel had it's own EQ, Gate etc... As the summer went on the response to change scenes became slower and slower. Like the audio would change instantly but the faders would take a good TWO SECONDS to change. So if something went wrong I was screwed and had to wait 2 seconds. Same with the mute input button. I really hope this changes with future updates.

2.Also the screen was really hard to see in direct sunlight as with any iPad or touch device.

3. No midi. Don't know if you personally care but I was a little bummed..

4. Also no fade times like the 01v96i. From what I understand those aren't really that widely used but I use them A LOT so it was a big deal for me. I really hope they can put that in a future update.

5. The ipad app could use a little work in my opinion. As well as the editor. Also I used a Microsoft Surface for the editor like the do in the Tutorials on Youtube. I personally hated it. Maybe you'll like it.

So to end here's the last thing to remember with the whole "touch screen" efficiency thing. If you use your right hand to select a part of a channel strip, then move it back to the knob, then adjust the knob, then move it back to the screen to select something else, then move your right hand back to the knob..... you see where I'm going. You're probably ready to quit just after that sentence!! lol

If you leave your right hand on the knob and select things on the screen with your left hand you can FLY around the board. Overall a good mixer that I really enjoyed using. I know that the lack of the stage boxes and expansion card is a large deterrent from getting one. Another area where the x32 is superior.

Let me know if you have any more questions! Like I said I got it in may and used it for 80 days straight. =)

Also before I forget having the 32 custom fader bank on the TF5 is AWESOME.

[ProSoundWeb Community]