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Author Topic: Meyer Constellation effectiveness  (Read 5512 times)

Lee Buckalew

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Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« on: August 28, 2015, 03:39:27 pm »

I have had limited experience with Constellation during one of the Star Wars in Concert stops.  That use was live, onstage only, for venue to venue consistency in the orchestra's sound-field.  The system worked very well for that application.

Do any of you have any experience with the system in a very live, very reflective space?
We have a client considering multiple new sound systems and one direction that they are wanting to consider is a Meyer system with Constellation to address some acoustical property needs.  I believe that it was Brad Weber who had indicated quite some time ago that he was not all that impressed with the potential output capability and with the after sale support from Meyer.  I would expect Meyer to dispute this since it is their system so I wanted informed 3rd party input both on system capability and after the sale support.

The room in question is a metal pre-fab type church layout, nearly square and about 180'x180' with exposed roof beam truss and little to no acoustic treatment.  There is not even carpeting on the floor, concrete only.  Seating is in the 2000 person range including a small (6 or so rows deep) balcony that wraps around 3 sides of the venue.

My feeling is that a very live and acoustically problematic space that routinely has A Weighted fast response SPL of 100-105 dB/SPL during portions of services would be better served by adding an equivalent dollar value in acoustic treatment when compared to Constellation.  This client is not looking for variable acoustics but for a consistently more acoustically pleasant and interactive experience for their audience.

Thoughts from those who have used/experienced Constellation?

PM me if you prefer.

Thanks,
Lee
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Thomas Lamb

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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2015, 04:19:07 pm »

Lee,
What exactly are they hoping to achieve with constellation? Are they/will they not be putting in any acoustic treatment? Before I spent a wad on constellation I would want to work on acoustics. That's why I'm curious as to what they think constellation will help or fix.

T
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bigTlamb

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Lee Buckalew

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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2015, 04:28:20 pm »

Lee,
What exactly are they hoping to achieve with constellation? Are they/will they not be putting in any acoustic treatment? Before I spent a wad on constellation I would want to work on acoustics. That's why I'm curious as to what they think constellation will help or fix.

T

They are wanting to use Constellation to achieve a more intimate experience for worshipers without adding acoustic treatment.  They expect more interactive singing from the congregation. 

This is why I am wanting to hear from folks who have experienced/used the system in a very live and problematic acoustical environment.  My experience with other systems has been that an acoustically well behaved space with a short RT60 will experience the greatest ability to affect change.  Trying to fight the acoustical problems is what concerns me the most.

Lee
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Lee Buckalew
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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2015, 04:35:52 pm »



The room in question is a metal pre-fab type church layout, nearly square and about 180'x180' with exposed roof beam truss and little to no acoustic treatment.  There is not even carpeting on the floor, concrete only.  Seating is in the 2000 person range including a small (6 or so rows deep) balcony that wraps around 3 sides of the venue.

 This client is not looking for variable acoustics but for a consistently more acoustically pleasant ....

Kind of simple to point out the contradiction in this.  Two treatment options...deal with the RT-60 or use a D-9 Cat.
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Lee Buckalew

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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2015, 04:41:38 pm »

Kind of simple to point out the contradiction in this.  Two treatment options...deal with the RT-60 or use a D-9 Cat.

That is also my thought Dick but I need to have someone who has had some ears on an installation of this system to say that there is not (or is, I could be surprised) a way to use it to change the acoustics in the space and reduce the unwanted interactions that are creating the problems in the first place.

I am of the very strong opinion that until the space is dealt with acoustically that Constellation would not create any enhancement.  It may be very effective after treatment but...

Thanks,
Lee
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2015, 05:00:07 pm »

I have been involved in installation of several of these type systems and used to have the only portable VRAS (which is what the Constellation was called before Meyer bought it and put a new name on it) that we used to take around for demos.

For any of these type systems (there are several manufacturers who have this type of system-and each has advantages and disadvantages), the room has to be DEAD-NOT LIVE.

You CANNOT take away existing reflections (reverb).

You can only ADD IT.

Yes these type of systems can help congregational singing when the room is dead.

But putting them in a live room is a TOTAL waste of money.

All they can do is make a bad situation worse.

They REALLY need to be aware of this before making a large financial mistake.
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Thomas Lamb

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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2015, 05:01:02 pm »

I've never heard one in a reflective space. Nor do I think I want to. IMHO (not having the experience in a highly reflective space) I think your just adding more crap and making it worse. Using electronics to mitigate poor acoustics doesn't work well unless your considering a dead room to have poor acoustics (which you are not) and are trying to engance with electronics. I don't see an enhancement in your situation.
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bigTlamb

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Thomas Lamb

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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2015, 05:01:56 pm »

I have been involved in installation of several of these type systems and used to have the only portable VRAS (which is what the Constellation was called before Meyer bought it and put a new name on it) that we used to take around for demos.

For any of these type systems (there are several manufacturers who have this type of system-and each has advantages and disadvantages), the room has to be DEAD-NOT LIVE.

You CANNOT take away existing reflections (reverb).

You can only ADD IT.

Yes these type of systems can help congregational singing when the room is dead.

But putting them in a live room is a TOTAL waste of money.

All they can do is make a bad situation worse.

They REALLY need to be aware of this before making a large financial mistake.

Ivan beat me to it.
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bigTlamb

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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2015, 05:37:50 pm »

The only cost effective thing that pops into mind is diffusers.  How much height is there?  I'd look to break up the space with some hangs and some columns around the periphery. 
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Lee Buckalew

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Re: Meyer Constellation effectiveness
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2015, 06:20:50 pm »

I have been involved in installation of several of these type systems and used to have the only portable VRAS (which is what the Constellation was called before Meyer bought it and put a new name on it) that we used to take around for demos.

For any of these type systems (there are several manufacturers who have this type of system-and each has advantages and disadvantages), the room has to be DEAD-NOT LIVE.

You CANNOT take away existing reflections (reverb).

You can only ADD IT.

Yes these type of systems can help congregational singing when the room is dead.

But putting them in a live room is a TOTAL waste of money.

All they can do is make a bad situation worse.

They REALLY need to be aware of this before making a large financial mistake.

Thank you Ivan.  I understand this but Needed to hear from a system user.

Thanks,
Lee
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