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Author Topic: Where do I place my eq's  (Read 8912 times)

Rob Spence

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2015, 04:40:23 pm »

Thanks for the welcome Tim, and thanks for all the posts everyone!

Irvin: Donít know that there is an optimal position for the mains, http://www.yelp.com/biz/sunset-lanai-camp-h-m-smith there is glass  :(

In the DJ business for over 20 years, havenít used an EQ in the last 10, so no my mains donít have an eq. I suppose I could get another fbq3102 or the destroyer you mentioned and sell it after the gig.

Ivan: Will definitely continue to experiment with my new toys at home, will even bring the monitors/eq to gigs where itís not required.

John: Rider does ask for 4 separate monitor mixes specifically for the 4 singers

Kevin: I purchased the fbq3102ís because of all of the reading on ringing out monitors, will continue to read and practice

Scott: Yeah I know enough that the sound is different as bodies fill the room. Which makes me want to buy a destroyer instead of an eq for my mains. Because if i ring out a room when its empty, will those same frequencies I cut out all of a sudden become ok frequencies when the room is full???

Mac: Optimal, thatís what Iím looking for. In the past, I used to run my amps wide open because it was common, then I learned a little about gain setup.

Rob: Hereís the embarrassing part, itís not all matching. Itís what I have, I take whatever gear I need for a particular gig. Itís more than likely Iíll be setup on stage with the band as weíre providing DJ service

For this gig:

Monitors will be a pair of EV SX300ís powered by a QSC PLX1804, and a pair of EV ELX115 powered by a CROWN XLS1500.

My mains I have a pair of EV ETX 15P and a EV QRX 218S powered by a CROWN XLS1000.

Mics are SHURE SM58. What Iíve recently purchased for the gig is a behringer xenyx2442 and of course the pair of fbq3102 and a 12 channel snake

My experience with feedback destroyers is that except for some high end ones aimed at installs, do not compensate correctly as the room changes. Most simply keep pulling out frequencies till they use up their abilities and don't release unneeded ones later.

I find that if I think about where sound will go and what it will bounce off of, I can place speakers and mics to their best advantage and make minimal EQ cuts.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
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Scott Wagner

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2015, 05:05:37 pm »

Scott: Yeah I know enough that the sound is different as bodies fill the room. Which makes me want to buy a destroyer instead of an eq for my mains. Because if i ring out a room when its empty, will those same frequencies I cut out all of a sudden become ok frequencies when the room is full???
First, "feedback destroyers" tend to do more harm than good. I would stick with the EQ that you can control yourself.

Second, there's a LOT more to it than bodies in the room. Every little change on stage will affect which frequencies are the problem (think "reflection path" from the monitor to the mic). The trick is to find the worst two or three frequencies before you start (bring up the gain until it starts to ring - cut that frequency), and then pay attention as the performance is happening in case you need to adjust things. Learn what the different frequencies actually SOUND like (this is one place where an RTA is actually useful). That way you have some idea of which slider to grab on the EQ in the heat of battle.

Third, use the pattern of the mic to make your life easier. With a SM58 (or any cardioid mic), the null (area of least sensitivity) is straight behind the barrel of the mic. Aim that null at the monitor. The reality is that you can't fight Physics, so use it to your maximum advantage.
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Scott Wagner
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Joseph Ugalino

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2015, 09:39:11 pm »

I think I'll run how most do and thats not using the insert but definitely pick up an eq for my mains. Should I get a fbq3102 like for my monitors or the fbq6200 which has a pink noise generator?
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Scott Wagner

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2015, 10:26:40 pm »

I think I'll run how most do and thats not using the insert but definitely pick up an eq for my mains. Should I get a fbq3102 like for my monitors or the fbq6200 which has a pink noise generator?
I can't see what you'd gain from the pink noise generator, unless you've got a measurement rig & the chops to use it correctly. Save yourself some money.
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Scott Wagner
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duane massey

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #14 on: June 14, 2015, 10:30:52 pm »

For basic set up, Ivan is correct. All of the tools mentioned (physical positioning, EQ's, FBX, etc) are all very useful IF used properly.
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Duane Massey
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Joseph Ugalino

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #15 on: June 14, 2015, 11:42:49 pm »

I can't see what you'd gain from the pink noise generator, unless you've got a measurement rig & the chops to use it correctly. Save yourself some money.

Sounds good. I'll purchase the fbq3102 for my mains
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Joseph Ugalino

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #16 on: June 14, 2015, 11:46:08 pm »

For basic set up, Ivan is correct. All of the tools mentioned (physical positioning, EQ's, FBX, etc) are all very useful IF used properly.

Will definitely pay attention to postioning, Ive avoided feedback in the past without using an eq via placement and just the channel eq's
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Jerome Malsack

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #17 on: June 15, 2015, 08:46:12 am »

Also consider the pattern of the horn on the speakers. 

Some of the horns are designed to be used in a vertical upright position. 

These horns on the speakers direct the sound off the ceiling and down into the crowd.  So the monitor to the right or left could present as the problem and not the one behind the mic.

The sound from these type of horns will be pointing the sound down across the LF driver at a 10 to 30 degree angel.  The side lobe of the SM58 may pick this up. 
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Bill McIntosh

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #18 on: June 15, 2015, 09:28:44 am »

Also consider the pattern of the horn on the speakers. 

Some of the horns are designed to be used in a vertical upright position. 

These horns on the speakers direct the sound off the ceiling and down into the crowd.  So the monitor to the right or left could present as the problem and not the one behind the mic.

The sound from these type of horns will be pointing the sound down across the LF driver at a 10 to 30 degree angel.  The side lobe of the SM58 may pick this up.

I bought some short speaker stands (Yorkville SKS-02B) and use my monitors vertically instead of horizontally on the floor. (Alto TS112A boxes.)  Have not had feedback issues since then. 

First gig, the band asked me turn the monitors down, too loud.  Not only got better pattern control, but it reduced the distance to their ears by at least half -- closer to 2/3 for our 6'3" keyboard player.
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Stephen Kirby

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #19 on: June 15, 2015, 02:32:44 pm »

Again the question, how many monitor mixes are you supplying.  While you can definitely optimize things with eqs on each monitor, you can also get wrapped around the axel.  e.g. which wedge is feeding back? from which mic? and so on.

I agree with the advice to simplify.  If you can, one monitor mix with one eq on that and the other eq on the mains.

Practice hearing frequencies.  There are online tools to practice this as well.

The biggest thing I've seen is the difference between carving out frequencies to get the highest level setting without feedback vs. getting intelligibility for the singers.  A few months ago I did this gig with a classic rock band and the leader had this big pile of gear.  Separate monitor board and everything.  Unfortunately most of it was low end gear but that's another story.  He was "ringing out" the monitors as I was setting up my drums.  The singers were complaining that it was muddy and they couldn't hear themselves clearly, even over the guitarist noodling around.  I went back to his pile of FOH racks and he said that he had automatic eqs that indicated which frequency was feeding back (which I think is a Peavey thing) and he had the monitors (one for each singer) with what was essentially a smile curve.  I flattened them out, took out the low end, found a couple of frequencies that dominated feeding back and dropped them maybe 6-dB and left everything else alone.  If you chop a bunch of frequencies you reduce the overall level and you actually end up with this scalloped response that is more prone to feedback as you turn up to make up for the lost level.  Remember that the intent is for the singers to hear themselves.
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Re: Where do I place my eq's
¬ę Reply #19 on: June 15, 2015, 02:32:44 pm ¬Ľ


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