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Author Topic: Where do I place my eq's  (Read 8781 times)

Joseph Ugalino

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Where do I place my eq's
« on: June 13, 2015, 08:34:52 pm »

I'm new, I've searched, and searched, and changed my username to my real name but the more I read, the more I know I don't know what I'm doing :P

I'm a DJ, the most complicated system I've ever done aside from my mains is having 2 speakers set up as stage monitors connected directly to AUX 1 and 2 of my mixer without an eq.

I have a big gig to me coming up, and while I got away with feedback challenges with just my mixer eq, It'll probably be harder in my upcoming gig.

4 vocals who have 3 instruments, and a keyboard as well as bass. I will only provide 4 monitors for the 4 vocals. No monitor for keyboard or bass, they will be behind vocals

So what I did was I purchased 2 dual channel 31 band eq's to help combat feedback (behringer fbq 3102).

I was thinking, I should insert each channel of each eq into each of the 4 vocals "insert" port directly on my mixer. This way I can cut out any feedback frequency coming out of my monitors as well as mains.

A Friend of mine says nobody does that, I should instead have each channel of the eq right before the monitors so that I can eq everything that comes out of the monitors. It makes sense to me but do I really need to eq instruments coming out of monitors?

Any help would be greatly appreciated
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2015, 09:09:00 pm »

Hello Joseph and welcome to the forums.

The most common signal path is Aux output to EQ input, then EQ output to the input of the monitor power amp.
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Irvin Pribadi

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2015, 10:09:44 pm »

It depends on a few things.

If your main speakers are not positioned optimally and contribute to stage mic feedback, then adding the EQ as inserts does help.
Does the mains have a separate EQ as well?
OTOH if adding EQ as inserts and no other EQ in the chain for the mains, the tonal shaping of your main speakers may differ significantly than your wedges.

Btw, a few years back what I found as a great EQ was Behringer's FBQ2496. It's a feedback destroyer, but I simply used it as a 20-band dual ch parametric EQ (with super narrow Q down to 1/60 octave) which IMO way trumps a 31 fixed band EQ.
It's flexible enough that I can use say 12 PEQ bands to get the right sound and kill most known rings and leave the other 8 bands on auto feedback suppression; and that's per ch ... it's really pretty cool.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2015, 07:38:47 am »

An eq alone will not "fix" issue.  In fact in many cases it can make them WORSE

It all depends on if it is used properly.

When not used correctly you can totally destroy the sound.

It often takes years of experience in all kinds of different situations to get a decent "handle" on how to use it.

There is no "simple" answer-but a lot of depends.

And eq can be used for many things, feedback control, loudspeaker adjustment/flattening, tonal shaping etc.

It is NOT a simple thing to jump into.

Yes you can do "something", but is it right?

The best thing is to just start playing with the eqs-NOT in a gig situation and start training your ear as to how the different react, and learn how to hear the differences.
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John Rutirasiri

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2015, 12:39:30 pm »

4 vocals who have 3 instruments, and a keyboard as well as bass. I will only provide 4 monitors for the 4 vocals. No monitor for keyboard or bass, they will be behind vocals

Did the contract/rider/band ask for separate monitor mix for each singer (that is, 4 different monitor mixes)?  If not, don't over-complicate things -- just provide them a single vocal monitor mix out of one of the aux sends and use one channel of your EQ as Tim said.  (Rarely do I need more than 3 separate vocal monitor mixes.)

IMO if you only have 4 monitors, I would have a monitor for the keyboard player and one for the bassist.  Then use two vocal monitors up front.  Being behind the vocalists (and their monitors) does not mean they're not going to hear them.

John R.
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Kevin Bayersdorfer

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2015, 12:48:00 pm »

Yeah, the most common setup is Aux>EQ>Monitor Amp. Like Ivan said. Set up your rig at home with mics and monitors in approximate positions they will be in in the show. Then play with the EQ and see where your mic/monitor combo is most susceptible to feed back. Of course this will change a bit once at the venue, but the combo will have certain frequencies that will feedback first. Look up Ringing out monitors.   
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Scott Wagner

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2015, 01:04:21 pm »

... but the combo will have certain frequencies that will feedback first.   
Ummm, no. Feedback frequencies are path dependent and will change with positioning changes of speakers, mics, and reflection path (is the singer wearing a hat?), etc.

To the OP: Setting up the rig at home is great advice. What you'll be learning, however, is the process. The actual frequencies will change (sometimes over the course of the performance).
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Mac Kerr

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2015, 02:40:49 pm »

Yeah, the most common setup is Aux>EQ>Monitor Amp. Like Ivan said. Set up your rig at home with mics and monitors in approximate positions they will be in in the show. Then play with the EQ and see where your mic/monitor combo is most susceptible to feed back. Of course this will change a bit once at the venue, but the combo will have certain frequencies that will feedback first. Look up Ringing out monitors.   

Yes, that is the most common way to set up, it is not however optimal. Assuming you have the facilities, and a way to cue up the monitor mix while you make adjustments, it is better to insert the eq on the aux bus. That way you will actually hear the changes in the mix as you use the eq to both eliminate feedback, and make the mix sound good. Cueing up the mix with the eq in line with the output only lets you hear the mix without eq. You might be able to tell when you've eliminated the feedback, but you have no idea whether or not you have also made the mix sound crappy.

Mac
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Rob Spence

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2015, 03:00:45 pm »

If you could tell us more detail on your gear it can help us offer advice specific to your setup. Right now we are guessing.

Are your amplifiers right near your mix position (or perhaps you use powered speakers)?

Make & model of gear will help.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
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Joseph Ugalino

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Re: Where do I place my eq's
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2015, 04:08:27 pm »

Thanks for the welcome Tim, and thanks for all the posts everyone!

Irvin: Donít know that there is an optimal position for the mains, http://www.yelp.com/biz/sunset-lanai-camp-h-m-smith there is glass  :(

In the DJ business for over 20 years, havenít used an EQ in the last 10, so no my mains donít have an eq. I suppose I could get another fbq3102 or the destroyer you mentioned and sell it after the gig.

Ivan: Will definitely continue to experiment with my new toys at home, will even bring the monitors/eq to gigs where itís not required.

John: Rider does ask for 4 separate monitor mixes specifically for the 4 singers

Kevin: I purchased the fbq3102ís because of all of the reading on ringing out monitors, will continue to read and practice

Scott: Yeah I know enough that the sound is different as bodies fill the room. Which makes me want to buy a destroyer instead of an eq for my mains. Because if i ring out a room when its empty, will those same frequencies I cut out all of a sudden become ok frequencies when the room is full???

Mac: Optimal, thatís what Iím looking for. In the past, I used to run my amps wide open because it was common, then I learned a little about gain setup.

Rob: Hereís the embarrassing part, itís not all matching. Itís what I have, I take whatever gear I need for a particular gig. Itís more than likely Iíll be setup on stage with the band as weíre providing DJ service

For this gig:

Monitors will be a pair of EV SX300ís powered by a QSC PLX1804, and a pair of EV ELX115 powered by a CROWN XLS1500.

My mains I have a pair of EV ETX 15P and a EV QRX 218S powered by a CROWN XLS1000.

Mics are SHURE SM58. What Iíve recently purchased for the gig is a behringer xenyx2442 and of course the pair of fbq3102 and a 12 channel snake
« Last Edit: June 14, 2015, 04:11:02 pm by Joseph Ugalino »
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Re: Where do I place my eq's
¬ę Reply #9 on: June 14, 2015, 04:08:27 pm ¬Ľ


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