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[David Hayes]

Hey Scott,

I start the subs at 3.00 and the tops at 12.00. Then maybe a little more on the subs if needed. I've never experienced clipping on either but for the larger venues and outside, I use the SRX system and add the 2 PRX718's on aux to supplement - it works like a charm!!

Are you guys saying you run a full range signal into the subs, then LP at the sub and send the full range signal on to the tops?

I ask because I aux the subs, or do the pan trick (LS801Ps) and run a full range signal to the tops (DSR12s) and either engage the HPF and set the LPF on the subs to 120 or more often than not I use a crossover at 100 and feed tops and subs off that.  I think the crossover way sounds better, but it would be convenient to take the crossover out of the picture.

[Debbie Dunkley]

Are you guys saying you run a full range signal into the subs, then LP at the sub and send the full range signal on to the tops?

I ask because I aux the subs, or do the pan trick (LS801Ps) and run a full range signal to the tops (DSR12s) and either engage the HPF and set the LPF on the subs to 120 or more often than not I use a crossover at 100 and feed tops and subs off that.  I think the crossover way sounds better, but it would be convenient to take the crossover out of the picture.

That is what I do and I get great results.- If it ain't broke don't fix it.
I used to do the same when I used PRX612's with the XLF subs - the 612's do not have HPF  so I had to. When I got the DSR's, even though they do have the HPF, I just did the same as before and it sounded good….and it keeps set-up simple.

I used to have to bring my crossover to gigs when I used a couple of K-subs with my PRX612's for while and it was a PIA !

[Scott Bolt]

Are you guys saying you run a full range signal into the subs, then LP at the sub and send the full range signal on to the tops?

I ask because I aux the subs, or do the pan trick (LS801Ps) and run a full range signal to the tops (DSR12s) and either engage the HPF and set the LPF on the subs to 120 or more often than not I use a crossover at 100 and feed tops and subs off that.  I think the crossover way sounds better, but it would be convenient to take the crossover out of the picture.

Not exactly.  From here: http://www.jblpro.com/ProductAttachments/JBL_PRX718XLF_v5.pdf

There is a HPF output on the XLF when you press the button for it on the back panel.  This creates an output from the sub that is "crossed over" at around 90 Hz so that even though you are running the top in full range, the signal going to the top has only the frequencies that the sub isn't handling for it.

From here:  http://yorkville.com/downloads/ownersman/om_ls801p.pdf

On page 3 you can see that the LS801p doesn't have a HPF output like the XLF does.  The output from this sub is a full range signal.  The only options for this sub would be to engage the HPF on the top (if the top has one), or to use a cross-over and run separate lines to the subs and tops.

[Stephen Kirby]

As was pointed out, there is an acoustic crossover in play.  In the scenario I asked about the dispersion of lower frequencies in a free field (outdoors) causes a more pronounced roll off than one may have planned on in leaving the upper ranges of the subs out of a particular source.

I guess for the big voiced male singer I'm going to be dealing with I can add in some sub on his channel to compensate for this.  I was just curious if anyone using these tops in an aux fed setup had experience with how solid the tops hold up in mid-bass outdoors when that source isn't in the subs.

[Scott Bolt]

As was pointed out, there is an acoustic crossover in play.  In the scenario I asked about the dispersion of lower frequencies in a free field (outdoors) causes a more pronounced roll off than one may have planned on in leaving the upper ranges of the subs out of a particular source.

I guess for the big voiced male singer I'm going to be dealing with I can add in some sub on his channel to compensate for this.  I was just curious if anyone using these tops in an aux fed setup had experience with how solid the tops hold up in mid-bass outdoors when that source isn't in the subs.

I brought my DSR112's to a party a friend was having at a lake house on a hill overlooking a lake that was about 60 yards from the house.  It was supposed to be background music only, but when I showed up, it was an entire band.

I didn't mic the kick, but I did mic the bass, vocals, and guitars.

The DSR's were blinking the limit lights all night long, but they sounded full and clear all the way to the dock.  The bass sounded fantastic through them.

I have A/B'd them to my Klipsch KP301 3-way 15" speakers.  While they are great at mid bass (very punchy), they aren't good at all at low bass.  It just isn't there.  I suspect the DSP takes it out.  My 15" have way more bass to them and give a much more full sound than my DSR's.  The DSR's are a MUCH nicer sounding speaker though..... and DSR's over XLF subs absolutely crush my 15" speakers.

I have never run aux fed subs though.  Hope this helps.

[Steve Garris]

Are you guys saying you run a full range signal into the subs, then LP at the sub and send the full range signal on to the tops?

I ask because I aux the subs, or do the pan trick (LS801Ps) and run a full range signal to the tops (DSR12s) and either engage the HPF and set the LPF on the subs to 120 or more often than not I use a crossover at 100 and feed tops and subs off that.  I think the crossover way sounds better, but it would be convenient to take the crossover out of the picture.

Scott, I actually do a Left - Subs, Right - Tops mix. I run the kick, bass guitar and keys panned 50/50. Everything else panned hard right to my 615's, set at full range. I find this simpler than even an aux fed mix (which I could easily do), and like Debbie said, it's a quick set up. I run a Mackie DL1608 on the stage, and just mix all night with my iPad. Lights are all sound activated.

[Jonathan Betts]

Scott, I actually do a Left - Subs, Right - Tops mix. I run the kick, bass guitar and keys panned 50/50. Everything else panned hard right to my 615's, set at full range. I find this simpler than even an aux fed mix (which I could easily do), and like Debbie said, it's a quick set up. I run a Mackie DL1608 on the stage, and just mix all night with my iPad. Lights are all sound activated.

Are you using a LPF on your sub?

[David Hayes]

Scott, I actually do a Left - Subs, Right - Tops mix. I run the kick, bass guitar and keys panned 50/50. Everything else panned hard right to my 615's, set at full range. I find this simpler than even an aux fed mix (which I could easily do), and like Debbie said, it's a quick set up. I run a Mackie DL1608 on the stage, and just mix all night with my iPad. Lights are all sound activated.

That's pretty much what I do.  Saves my Auxes for monitors and fills.

[Nick Reese]

Scott, I actually do a Left - Subs, Right - Tops mix. I run the kick, bass guitar and keys panned 50/50. Everything else panned hard right to my 615's, set at full range. I find this simpler than even an aux fed mix (which I could easily do), and like Debbie said, it's a quick set up. I run a Mackie DL1608 on the stage, and just mix all night with my iPad. Lights are all sound activated.

I also run the DL1608, but with aux fed subs (have never thought of doing it the left/right way). Do you use either a HPF or LPF on each individual channel as a way to LPF the subs and HPF the tops? Then leave the master output without any HPF/LPF and use only for eq? Seems like a pretty easy way of doing it, just wondering how you get the filters to the tops and subs this way.

[Stephen Kirby]

I don't think using the eq on a board is going to give you a very steep slope.  Most powered subs have a LPF built in and all the amps I have (Crest, QSC) have built in LP for sub use.  Newer DSP amps can implement full crossover functions.

You might get sufficient HPF from a board eq to keep good tops from blowing out while using the LPF on an amp or active sub.

Also, most powered tops have a built in HPF.  The discussion here is that the Yamaha DSRs (which look like the best bet for my uses) have a fairly high turn over point.  The EV EKX's that I was waiting to see how they sound have a more sophisticated onboard processing.  But given that they are slotted below the ETX which I didn't like the sound of, I think the Yammies are the ticket forward.

[ProSoundWeb Community]