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[Bob Maitland]

I know it's just January 2, but this may well be the most hilarious statement of the entire year.

Why do you feel this way?

We might not have an electrician on staff but we do have accountants that work for fortune 500 companies here in the state of Wisconsin.

[Ray Aberle]

Why do you feel this way?

We might not have an electrician on staff but we do have accountants that work for fortune 500 companies here in the state of Wisconsin.

Probably cos one of the old jokes of live sound... "How does a sound company get to a million dollars in live sound? You start with 2 million."

So given that an absolute minimum "Quick and Dirty Bar Rig" will start at, what, $25K these days? And it sounds like you are planning on spending more then that-- so let's say you spend $100,000. 100 shows, is $1,000 required net profit per show. 5 people in the group? Plus a FOH tech, maybe a systems tech? So need at least a thousand per show in payroll. Insurance. Travel/lodging/per diem. So will you be charging at least $3,000 per show? AND can book that for 100 shows over the course of your-- what was it, labor day to memorial day for a season? So nine months, that's 12 shows a month, three per week-- and that's with no breaks.

[Tim McCulloch]

Why do you feel this way?

We might not have an electrician on staff but we do have accountants that work for fortune 500 companies here in the state of Wisconsin.

Oy.

Accountants are only as good as the numbers/info you give them.

I really suspect that there are circumstances and situations that have not been "accounted for" in the business plan for the "Wisconsin Winter Dog & Pony Show" (you need a working title, so here it is!).   All this presumes that your performers/presenters, crew and local hires are compensated appropriately; if you're touring a missionary gig where everyone is either volunteering or receiving a minimal stipend the metrics change.

I know you didn't come here for an inquisition about the business plan, but we're pretty good at rooting out the weaknesses that underlay certain types of technical challenges.

If you'll tell us what the show is all about and give some specifics about the gear and the way it will be used we can give you better advice.

Have fun, good luck.

Tim Mc

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

Why do you feel this way?

We might not have an electrician on staff but we do have accountants that work for fortune 500 companies here in the state of Wisconsin.

The question is do you have anyone on staff with practical experience in show production and logistics.  Can your accountants load and unload the trucks, set up and operate sound, lighting and staging?

You need more than bean counters.

[Stephen Swaffer]

We're just a group of people who love music and have money to invest...and don't even care about the money. We can get a 100% return on our investment plus depreciation and interest after just 104 shows.

[/quote/]

I know a number of talented musicians that would love to travel for fun.  With a guaranteed 100% ROI, investors would be easy to find.  Why aren't they all on this bandwagon?

[Ray Aberle]

I know a number of talented musicians that would love to travel for fun.  With a guaranteed 100% ROI, investors would be easy to find.  Why aren't they all on this bandwagon?

Well, technically, we don't know that they're not. Remember that the OP is just concerned about power availability for this production that has no name, and we've no idea about the actual power requirements...

So maybe Bob can give us some more information, so that we can start to determine what kind of power they really need, and what options we have.

-Ray

[I know we're all a bit concerned about the back story here, but hey, let's stick with what we know, and what else Bob chooses to share with us before passing more judgement about this whole scenario...]

[Stephen Swaffer]

Well, technically, we don't know that they're not. Remember that the OP is just concerned about power availability for this production that has no name, and we've no idea about the actual power requirements...

So maybe Bob can give us some more information, so that we can start to determine what kind of power they really need, and what options we have.

Your right Ray, what doesnt add up to me is "no problem buying genny/distro", but can't afford electricians to do tie ins?  Setting up a genny/running cables is just as much or more labor than doing tie ins.  So maybe all that labor is going to be donated vs paying an electrician?  But $15k for a genny (plus fuel/maintenance) should pay for quite a number of tie ins.  I was just involved in a production that involved literally thousands of hours of donated time-but sooner or later you run out of manpower and steam and it is easy to overlook/dismiss how much behind the scenes work it takes to get it all done.

Regardless of overall power requirements (unless you will overtax many venues available power), my gut feeling is the most economical is going to be to be able to accurately communicate your needs to the venues electrician-be they in house or contracted.  I might be wrong, but if I do the tie in of a correctly sized distro, my liability should not extend beyond my tie in so if I am familiar with venue I have less than half a day for tie in and whatever my minimum service call is for removal?  If you call me from out of town, it might be seen as a pain and a premium call-if the venue is my customer I am content to make a reasonable amount because I value the next call-and its nice not to have to bid their next remodel.

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

Your right Ray, what doesnt add up to me is "no problem buying genny/distro", but can't afford electricians to do tie ins? 

Yup.  Without hard info on the production and gear it's difficult to rationalize such statements.

Bob...

You've asked a fairly vague and open question to a bunch of people used to working with entire systems of inter-related products and logistics, many of us in business for ourselves or working for/with sizable production companies. We're accustomed to looking beyond individual issues to see how things fit together in the total picture, so have patience, provide any requested info and don't take offense if you're asked to explain the rationale for things you're taking as "givens".

 

[Bob Maitland]

A few things...I was wrong when I said we would get a 100% return on our investment after 104 shows, instead, we would get back our original investment plus interest and depreciation. Nobody here is spending their life savings, and all of us are doing it for the love of music more so than the love of money.

I don't really feel comfortable discussing the business plan on a public forum, but more or less, its a mobile dj production with a unique twist and is targeted toward the teen market.

All of the investors are working investors, with twice as many needed per show. Most of us work full time with OT on the weekends, some of us will be available on the odd weekends, while others will be available on the even weekends. Everyone working will get paid a decent amount of money for a hard days work.

I was reluctant to give you the gear list because we're not using higher end gear from Clay Paky, Robe, High End Systems, or Martin. But what we are using should get us through 520 hours of use, at which time we can decide to upgrade if necessary.

Our original gear list:
A small active QSC line array system...I believe its 3 tops per side and 4 subs center.

(4) epson powerlite pro G6050w 3 lcd 5500 lumens projectors, 498w each, 1992w total
( Elation EPV375HO 37.5M pitch led panels, 520w each, 4160w total
(1) X-BEAM 5000 laser, 200W each, 200W total
(10) Chauvet intimidator spot 355z irc moving head, 309w each,3090w total
(4) Adj vizi beam 5R, 350W each, 1400w total
(2) SL nitro 510 phillips led strobes, 360w each,720w total
(4)chauvet DJ Core 3x3, 226w each, 904w total
(4)Adj matrix beam led, 75w each, 300w total
(18) Adj dotz par w/25 degree lens, 36W each, 648w total
(28) Adj 5p hex lights, 49W each, 1372w total
( Adj sweeper beam quad, 81w each, 648w total
...plus special effects-undetermined, control boards, processors, etc.

...don't have any idea why the number 8 above is showing the cool icon above

[Bob Maitland]

Your right Ray, what doesnt add up to me is "no problem buying genny/distro", but can't afford electricians to do tie ins?

I didn't realize that an electrician would be that inexpensive.

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