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[Rich Orde]

Hey all,

I run sound for a band and the drummer is very light footed on his kick pedal and some times, depending on room acoustics, to get enough thump out of the kick drum I end up battling with low end feedback from his mic because of the amount of additional mic gain needed.  I have tried laying the mic (Beta 52A) inside the drum on the pad, and mounting it to a mic stand placing it at the opening to the front head port.  Both placements result in feedback at times.

Most recently at a high volume outdoor gig I was running into a lot of trouble with feedback but it only happened when he was not playing.  During the song, no problems, however it was usually on the verge.  No luck with the gate because he plays so soft.

I am looking at this:

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/KellyShuCom?adpos=1o5&creative=55673940721&device=c&matchtype=&network=g&gclid=Cj0KEQjwtb6hBRC_57Pvyfn66LsBEiQAtlFVu5u8_h_w07UyiGEIIzpisC5oaoHZxHET2Md5pdw4VgQaAhQC8P8HAQ

Do you think this would help reduce problems from bass vibrations since the mic will be shock mounted?

Would you suggest, based on his playing style, to place the mic in line with the beater or a bit off center?  Looking to get a strong attack.

Any suggestions are appreciated.  Thanks

[chuck clark]

I was running into a lot of trouble with feedback but it only happened when he was not playing.  During the song, no problems, however it was usually on the verge. 

Hi Rich, you might try placing the mic sideways inside the drum on a towel that both cushions from vibrations and damps extraneous front & back head vibrations. The sideways mic placement utilizes the cardiod pick up pattern of the mic to help reject sound from the back which can help minimize the "power alley" effect coming off the mains to the center area of the stage where the kick drum is usually located. 
  Also you might try a bit of judicious notch eq at the offending frequency if you have fully parametric eq available.  Also have a pep talk w/ the drummer. He might be hearing the power alley effect and thinking the low end is huge. If he helps you "get there" by playing it normally you can back off from the edge a bit AND have great tone. Good luck.
Chuck

[Milt Hathaway]

The 52 is very susceptible to mechanical feedback (vibrations through the riser, etc.) The Kelly Shu mount is a very good idea for your problem.

[Rich Orde]

Chuck, I never tried placing the mic sideways because my desire was always a strong attack and it would have seemed to me that a sideways mic would miss the true attack of the beater, but it's worth a try.  They are playing another challenging room this weekend and I will have to experiment with that.

No chance of pep talking the drummer.  We have all tried that and he is 60 with a jazz upbringing so he plays with his ankle, not his leg.  Very set in his ways with no interest in changing.

Prior to the 52A we were using another kick drum mic from a set of drum mics (think it might be Audix) and that didn't have as much natural low end as the Shure, but it also had its share of feedback challenges.

[RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS]

The 52 is very susceptible to mechanical feedback (vibrations through the riser, etc.) The Kelly Shu mount is a very good idea for your problem.

I have hundreds of shows with my Beta 52s, never have I had feedback with them.  They are not particularly susceptible to feedback for any reason other than poor gain structure.  If you've had problems with yours then you might need to have it serviced.

Sounds to me like the OP possibly has a compressor set up on the kick channel with too much make up gain or weird threshold/ratio settings.

[Keith Broughton]

I have hundreds of shows with my Beta 52s, never have I had feedback with them.  They are not particularly susceptible to feedback for any reason other than poor gain structure.  If you've had problems with yours then you might need to have it serviced.

Sounds to me like the OP possibly has a compressor set up on the kick channel with too much make up gain or weird threshold/ratio settings.

I'm with Ryan on this one. Only feedback I have ever had was with the drum monitor sub.
Have you tried a Shure 91 inside the drum?
Notching the freq with a para EQ would help.

[Caleb Dueck]

I've had low end feedback from kick mics at times.  From memory, they were from too-soft-kicking drummers.  Also, the tone of the kick was awful. 

Is this rock style music?  If so, he has to kick it!  Polite little taps can't make thunderous impact to the audience, except with triggers and samples.  Try to fix the issue at the source.

[Caleb Dueck]

Oh, Kelly Shu and a D6, with properly tuned and non overdampened drum, help a lot.

[Gordon Brinton]

...drummer is very light footed...
...he is 60 with a jazz upbringing so he plays with his ankle, not his leg.  Very set in his ways with no interest in changing.

...high volume outdoor gig...
...looking to get a strong attack...

Does the rest of the band want more aggressive kick in their show?
I am guessing that the band is using either the wrong drummer or the wrong soundman. They each seem to be pulling in opposite directions.

[John Penkala]

Does the rest of the band want more aggressive kick in their show?
I am guessing that the band is using either the wrong drummer or the wrong soundman. Which is it?

I guess another way to look at it is does the style of music played warrant a kick sound with more attack? If the answer is yes, you can try getting the mic on the inside closer to beater as discussed or even try micing the batter head from the other side. If you still don't get the results you need, try triggering a sample. 

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