ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: [1] 2  All   Go Down

Author Topic: Using second layer (33-64) on LS9 when you only have 32 physical outputs  (Read 5887 times)

chris broadway

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 29

If anyone with LS9 experience can validate this idea, I'd appreciate it.  I have an LS9 with 32 channels and the ability to expand to 64 channels.  I use both my slots in the rear for IEMs and multichannel recording, and do not need 64 physical inputs.  My question is based on using the second layer as a virtual area to "catalog" various musicians.  I run the sound for a church and there are many musicians that float in and out depending on the day and service.  Instead of having a single "soundcheck" all musicians use, I want to have the capability to catalog each musician.  My thought is to use the virtual layer 33-64 as the "holding area" having all the presets, then loading that specific performers presets to a channel 1-32 when they perform.  For example Singer "A" will be saved on channel 33 and Singer "B" on channel 34.  When Singer "A" is with the band I copy channel 33 to channel 8.  When Singer "B" is with the band I copy channel 34 to channel 8.

Or is this a better idea, When Singer "A" is with the band change the insert out/in on channel 8 to point to channel 33.  When singer "B" is with the band change the insert out/in on channel 8 to 34?

Let me know your thoughts.
Logged

Tommy Peel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1462
  • Longview, Texas

If anyone with LS9 experience can validate this idea, I'd appreciate it.  I have an LS9 with 32 channels and the ability to expand to 64 channels.  I use both my slots in the rear for IEMs and multichannel recording, and do not need 64 physical inputs.  My question is based on using the second layer as a virtual area to "catalog" various musicians.  I run the sound for a church and there are many musicians that float in and out depending on the day and service.  Instead of having a single "soundcheck" all musicians use, I want to have the capability to catalog each musician.  My thought is to use the virtual layer 33-64 as the "holding area" having all the presets, then loading that specific performers presets to a channel 1-32 when they perform.  For example Singer "A" will be saved on channel 33 and Singer "B" on channel 34.  When Singer "A" is with the band I copy channel 33 to channel 8.  When Singer "B" is with the band I copy channel 34 to channel 8.

Or is this a better idea, When Singer "A" is with the band change the insert out/in on channel 8 to point to channel 33.  When singer "B" is with the band change the insert out/in on channel 8 to 34?

Let me know your thoughts.

Chris I'm pretty new to the LS9, but I think a better way would be to use the built in dynamics and EQ libraries. You can save the EQ and Dynamics settings for a person under their name and then recall it when needed on to whatever channel they're on. Here's a screenshot from Studio Manager:

I strongly recommend running SM on a computer while mixing. It makes many tasks easier and gives you a second screen and you can use a real keyboard when naming stuff.
Logged

David Jameson

  • SR Forums
  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 96

I would have to agree with Tommy.  I worked with a mobile church which did basically the same thing (different musicians each week).  I created individual presets for EQs, Sends, Dynamics, etc and saved them under the musician's name.  (this was with a Midas Pro Series console but should work basically the same for the LS9 as mentioned by Tommy)  When they showed up, I just recalled their settings and tweaked to taste.

Good luck.
Logged
Jameson Productions
Anderson, SC 29625
jameson_prod at bellsouth.net

Alec Spence

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 446
  • Herts, UK

Agree with the others, presets are the way to go with the Yamaha flow - and yes, much easier using Studio Manager!
Logged

Tim Tyler

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 276
  • Richmond, Va USA

If anyone with LS9 experience can validate this idea, I'd appreciate it.  I have an LS9 with 32 channels and the ability to expand to 64 channels.  I use both my slots in the rear for IEMs and multichannel recording, and do not need 64 physical inputs.  My question is based on using the second layer as a virtual area to "catalog" various musicians.  I run the sound for a church and there are many musicians that float in and out depending on the day and service.  Instead of having a single "soundcheck" all musicians use, I want to have the capability to catalog each musician.  My thought is to use the virtual layer 33-64 as the "holding area" having all the presets, then loading that specific performers presets to a channel 1-32 when they perform.  For example Singer "A" will be saved on channel 33 and Singer "B" on channel 34.  When Singer "A" is with the band I copy channel 33 to channel 8.  When Singer "B" is with the band I copy channel 34 to channel 8.

Chris -

Your plan would work fine, I would be careful with your scene saving.  If you feel it is helpful to do this scheme, you should consider updating these channels (or not) at the end of the service before resaving.

I have found the value of having specific channel parameters for each performer to be very useful for monitors, for foh not so much, due to differences in the changing venue conditions, which may be a moot point if all of your work is in the same place... in any event, dialing in a vocal channel should not be very problematic in your situation.

Cheers,

-Tim T
Logged

chris broadway

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 29

A workload difference comes to my mind.  There are 6 different vocalist, 4 different guitarists, three different drummers, 4 different keyboards, etc...each possibly needing their own dynamics 1 and 2, EQ, and HA gain.  If I used the dynamics and eq libraries, I would have to swap three "things" and then adjust the HA gain every time there is a people change (usually 3 different people at a minimum) ...If I kept all of a persons settings on a virtual channel specifically for them I would only have to change one thing on the main fader to point to the virtual fader.  Am I seeing it wrong?  It is seeming easier to use single virtual faders to catalog specific people verse using multiple libraries in different areas.  I'm not looking for someone to agree with me, but just give pros and cons for the way you would do it.

Scenes would not work well here because there are too many performer variations and simple things like what to call the scene become an headache.




Logged

Samuel Rees

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1879
  • Washington, D.C.

How many channels do you use normally? How many 'variation' channels would you expect to make? This would affect how practical it is. It might make more sense to set up a generic scene with every single channel you might need, including double patches for different vocalists and etc, arranged however you'd like in channels 1-64, then just pull up he channels you want for that day on the custom fader layer.

Copy and paste doesn't take headamp gain with it - I think you'd want to use the channel move function. Can someone confirm that? Another reason custom fader might be helpful. Also - if you have your "vocalist 1" channel and then your "sub vocalist 2" channel saved away on layer two, you still won't be able to save them with different headamp values. The LS9 only has one live value for each headamp at a time, remember? The only way to save multiple headamp settings is with more headamps, or scenes
Logged

Tim Tyler

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 276
  • Richmond, Va USA

Chris -

First, a "scene" on an LS9 is the STATE OF THE CONSOLE, whether or not you save and name it in the scene storage area.  When you turn the LS9 off, the mixer remembers the settings and they appear when you next turn the LS9 on.  Using scene storage and manipulation is a very valuable and helpful tool in organizing your shows.

Second, the real world of mixing will quickly show you that trying to save and anticipate every possible permutation of singers, players and instruments will be a fruitless endeavor.  3 drummers with 6-8 mics each = 18-24 channels.  4 keys with 4 channels each = 16 channels.  You're already out of channels on a 32 channel board.

My solution would be to devise a "super scene", which is a "most case" scenario.  This generic scene will have channels laid out for the biggest drum kit, the most keys, gtrs, vocals, horns, percussion and "whatever" that you will see, and save this scene.  When you have 8 channels for drums and you need 6, or when you have 8 channels for keys and need 4, you're covered.  Every time you have a significant change in the band makeup, save and label that scene.  You will soon find out which situations occur the most frequently, and there probably won't be as many different setups as you have envisioned.  I would be surprised if you would need more than a dozen or so scenes to be covered.

I wouldn't be too anxious to complicate this.  No matter what parameters you start with, you'll still be tweaking channels, and with the exception of the monitors, being in the ballpark on settings is the best you can ask for.

You haven't mentioned where monitors will be mixed...

-Tim T
Logged

chris broadway

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 29

How many channels do you use normally? How many 'variation' channels would you expect to make? This would affect how practical it is. It might make more sense to set up a generic scene with every single channel you might need, including double patches for different vocalists and etc, arranged however you'd like in channels 1-64, then just pull up he channels you want for that day on the custom fader layer.

Copy and paste doesn't take headamp gain with it - I think you'd want to use the channel move function. Can someone confirm that? Another reason custom fader might be helpful. Also - if you have your "vocalist 1" channel and then your "sub vocalist 2" channel saved away on layer two, you still won't be able to save them with different headamp values. The LS9 only has one live value for each headamp at a time, remember? The only way to save multiple headamp settings is with more headamps, or scenes

Being there are 20 people that move in and out of the band, there would have to be 400 scenes to capture all the possible variations.  This is why I think scenes would not work.  Correct me if I am wrong please. 
I do think your right and head amp does not have a copy paste function.  So is your thought process to create 20 specific fader channels (one for each performer) on the 2nd or custom layer and when they perform simply  use the channel move function, then tweak the gain? 

Logged

Mac Kerr

  • Old enough to know better
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6880
  • Audio Plumber

Being there are 20 people that move in and out of the band, there would have to be 400 scenes to capture all the possible variations.  This is why I think scenes would not work.  Correct me if I am wrong please. 
I do think your right and head amp does not have a copy paste function.  So is your thought process to create 20 specific fader channels (one for each performer) on the 2nd or custom layer and when they perform simply  use the channel move function, then tweak the gain?

The old settings are not going to be right for the different show 99% of the time anyway. I'd make a cheat sheet with notes on the specific setup needs for each performer and just reset the channels as you need to. No plan survives contact with the enemy.

Mac
Logged

ProSoundWeb Community


Pages: [1] 2  All   Go Up
 



Page created in 0.072 seconds with 22 queries.