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Author Topic: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?  (Read 5853 times)

Kevin Maxwell

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #20 on: August 26, 2014, 12:42:30 pm »

Both approaches ultimately pull air and dirt in from the outside.

You can put a filter on the fan, so pulling air in with the fan and using a filter on it should reduce dirt accumulation inside, but in harsh environments you must keep the filter clean so it doesn't block the airflow. 

JR

Keeping the dust out with a filter that wouldn’t block the airflow. I wonder how hard that would be to do. This is assuming that the fan pulls the air in, in my opinion it would be a waste of time trying to filter a fan that blows the air out of the mixer. And I assume that if the mixer is designed with one type of fan (in or out) that you couldn’t just reversed the mounting of the fan.

Could it even be an external filter unit making changing the filters easier. Or even an add-on filter mechanism. And then how hard would it be to have something that monitored the airflow and warned when it is time to change the filter. I don’t know what kind of filter would suit the needs, what has good airflow and can trap the kind of fine particles that can cause the problems. My motorcycle has a foam air filter that is oiled. I wonder if that is the type that is needed.   
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John Roberts {JR}

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2014, 01:01:42 pm »

Keeping the dust out with a filter that wouldn’t block the airflow. I wonder how hard that would be to do. This is assuming that the fan pulls the air in, in my opinion it would be a waste of time trying to filter a fan that blows the air out of the mixer. And I assume that if the mixer is designed with one type of fan (in or out) that you couldn’t just reversed the mounting of the fan.

Could it even be an external filter unit making changing the filters easier. Or even an add-on filter mechanism. And then how hard would it be to have something that monitored the airflow and warned when it is time to change the filter. I don’t know what kind of filter would suit the needs, what has good airflow and can trap the kind of fine particles that can cause the problems. My motorcycle has a foam air filter that is oiled. I wonder if that is the type that is needed.

This is actually a pretty mature technology for power amplifiers. In my experience typical customers can not be trusted to routinely service fan filters. Perhaps professional users might be more diligent.

For consoles, (and power amps) the faders and switches do not need to be cooled so do not require any moving air (they should be sealed or otherwise protected). A reasonably reliable design strategy for power amps is to manage the forced air path, to not blow dirt into sensitive circuit areas. A few dust bunnies on the heat sink fins can be blown off in a once a year cleaning.

I would hope that a console if it uses forced air cooling could do a similar partitiion of air path, perhaps using an internal heat exchanger (like a heat sink) to segregate dirty air from clean electronics.

I have often seen console designer screw up relatively simple engineering tasks (like console power supplies), so they may likewise be behind the technology curve regarding cooling.

I like keeping the control surface as a separate functional unit from the processing engine, so they can be more easily backed up, and or protected from the environment.

JR

PS we are still not close to generic standard definitions for things as simple as console EQ, so I am not optimistic. Not my job mon...  ;D ;D
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Tommy Peel

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2014, 02:52:30 pm »

This is actually a pretty mature technology for power amplifiers. In my experience typical customers can not be trusted to routinely service fan filters. Perhaps professional users might be more diligent.

For consoles, (and power amps) the faders and switches do not need to be cooled so do not require any moving air (they should be sealed or otherwise protected). A reasonably reliable design strategy for power amps is to manage the forced air path, to not blow dirt into sensitive circuit areas. A few dust bunnies on the heat sink fins can be blown off in a once a year cleaning.

I would hope that a console if it uses forced air cooling could do a similar partitiion of air path, perhaps using an internal heat exchanger (like a heat sink) to segregate dirty air from clean electronics.

I have often seen console designer screw up relatively simple engineering tasks (like console power supplies), so they may likewise be behind the technology curve regarding cooling.

I like keeping the control surface as a separate functional unit from the processing engine, so they can be more easily backed up, and or protected from the environment.

JR

PS we are still not close to generic standard definitions for things as simple as console EQ, so I am not optimistic. Not my job mon...  ;D ;D

I hope in the future more manufacturers will move to systems like the Avid S3L and iLive. I think the S3L makes more sense than the iLive though as it separates all the components(I/O, Engine, and Faders/Control surface).

It'll be nice when the new Behringer MIDI Fader banks become compatible with the x32; with something like that you could have your faders and still be wireless from the stage to FOH. IMO the more modular a system is the better for the most part. The "next generation" x32 should be pretty interesting; I wish they sold something functionally similar to the x32 surface w/o the processing and I/O to use with the Rack/Core version.
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Stu McDoniel

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2014, 08:24:52 pm »

I did a festival in CA a few months ago.  There was fine dust that got EVERYWHERE!!!!!!

It was blowing all around-not just near the stage.  There was nothing you could do to keep it away from gear.

There was layer that stuck to everything.

Faders would be real problem-analog or digital.
A 3M Electronics Service Vacuum is just what the doctor ordered for you guys with digital consoles and festivals like Ivan posted.  Put the brush on
and pull that crud off the mix before it "works" its way into your consoles.

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Bob Leonard

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2014, 11:42:46 pm »

I own one of these. Great vac for electronics, but very expensive for what it is.
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Chris Hindle

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #25 on: August 27, 2014, 07:58:35 am »

A 3M Electronics Service Vacuum is just what the doctor ordered for you guys with digital consoles and festivals like Ivan posted.  Put the brush on
and pull that crud off the mix before it "works" its way into your consoles.
Ya. Nice.
For under $40.00 about 15 years ago, I picked up a 1 gallon Shop-Vac.
Same motor/filters as the big boys, but a nice small container. Works a charm for cleaning the wife's car, and the carpeted stairway at home too.
Bought it for the semi-annual system cleanouts, and it works a treat inside my computers as well.
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Stu McDoniel

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #26 on: August 27, 2014, 10:59:09 am »

Ya. Nice.
For under $40.00 about 15 years ago, I picked up a 1 gallon Shop-Vac.
Same motor/filters as the big boys, but a nice small container. Works a charm for cleaning the wife's car, and the carpeted stairway at home too.
Bought it for the semi-annual system cleanouts, and it works a treat inside my computers as well.
The 3M Vac will not discharge damaging static electricity.  That shop VAC can produce enough static to smoke sensitive electronics. 
Most any home VAC should not be used with static sensitive gear.
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John Roberts {JR}

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #27 on: August 27, 2014, 11:44:07 am »

The 3M Vac will not discharge damaging static electricity.  That shop VAC can produce enough static to smoke sensitive electronics. 
Most any home VAC should not be used with static sensitive gear.

I recall one shop vacuum that doubled as a van de graf generator... Every time I vacuumed my office, I was so charged up that I drew a nasty spark to the first ground I touched.

JR
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Chris Hindle

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #28 on: August 27, 2014, 12:09:50 pm »

The 3M Vac will not discharge damaging static electricity.  That shop VAC can produce enough static to smoke sensitive electronics. 
Most any home VAC should not be used with static sensitive gear.
Gee, guess my luddite analog is showing.....
I do use a ground strap when working under the hood of the computers.....
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Ya, Whatever. Just throw a '57 on it, and get off my stage.

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Re: Who makes the most rugged digital consoles?
« Reply #28 on: August 27, 2014, 12:09:50 pm »


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