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Author Topic: Eclipse Audio FIR Designer  (Read 1004 times)

Mark Wilkinson

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Re: Eclipse Audio FIR Designer
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2021, 03:10:45 PM »

Thought I'd add a follow on post about how i use FirDesigner to tune speakers....and how helpful i find FirD's Auto Mag, & Auto Phase capability.
Don't mean to be contradicting Timo, who has far more experience with this sort of thing than i do. 
Just thought I'd throw out what seems to be working well for me, and ask for critique....

The Smaart screen grab below is of a 4-way DIY synergy.
It has a pair of 12"s, four 4"s, and a dcx464 coax CD.  Its straight sided conical horn is 75x60 degrees, about 34" x25".
(It's a new project that still needs a secondary flare, which  should eventually help smooth out off-axis responses further.)



First step is taking raw measurements for each driver section separately, from on-axis out to whatever off-axis angle i want to average together.
0, 10, 20 and 30 degree measurements were averaged for each section.  (Both FirD and Smaart have a great averager...i tend to use Smaart's because that automatically saves the trace with the raw measurements.)

Next step is to choose xover points and slopes based on what seen so far.  In this case, I chose a 100Hz high-pass, 12"s to cross to 4"s at 250Hz, 4"s to dcx-mid at 650Hz, dcx-mid to dcx-HF at 3800Hz.

Then I put those xovers into FirD as target curves for each section, and import each sections' response traces average. (one driver section at a time).
FirD then matches driver's response to the target curves.
Since the measurement I'm using for matching is an average, I generally import the average trace with 1/12th octave smoothing.  And then also use Auto Mag/Phase at 1/12th smoothing for auto-correction.  (If it were a single measurement, 1-12th is usually too aggressive to match response to, and more smoothing is often needed. I know Michael John cautions against overcorrection.)

Ok, FirD generates a FIR file for each section, they go into the processor, and delays and levels are all that needs to be set.
It sounds like a long process, but like anything it gets easier and quicker with repetition.  I can do the whole 4-way from scratch in around a hour or so now.

Anyway, here's 0,10,15,20, and 30 deg horizontal traces.
To me at least, they look very good...(and more importantly, the box sounds great !!)
So I'm all for the Auto Mag/Phase taking the work out of dialing in EQ's etc :)






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Don Davis

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Re: Eclipse Audio FIR Designer
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2021, 03:03:32 PM »

Thought I'd add a follow on post about how i use FirDesigner to tune speakers....and how helpful i find FirD's Auto Mag, & Auto Phase capability.
Don't mean to be contradicting Timo, who has far more experience with this sort of thing than i do. 
Just thought I'd throw out what seems to be working well for me, and ask for critique....

The Smaart screen grab below is of a 4-way DIY synergy.
It has a pair of 12"s, four 4"s, and a dcx464 coax CD.  Its straight sided conical horn is 75x60 degrees, about 34" x25".
(It's a new project that still needs a secondary flare, which  should eventually help smooth out off-axis responses further.)

First step is taking raw measurements for each driver section separately, from on-axis out to whatever off-axis angle i want to average together.
0, 10, 20 and 30 degree measurements were averaged for each section.  (Both FirD and Smaart have a great averager...i tend to use Smaart's because that automatically saves the trace with the raw measurements.)

Next step is to choose xover points and slopes based on what seen so far.  In this case, I chose a 100Hz high-pass, 12"s to cross to 4"s at 250Hz, 4"s to dcx-mid at 650Hz, dcx-mid to dcx-HF at 3800Hz.

Then I put those xovers into FirD as target curves for each section, and import each sections' response traces average. (one driver section at a time).
FirD then matches driver's response to the target curves.
Since the measurement I'm using for matching is an average, I generally import the average trace with 1/12th octave smoothing.  And then also use Auto Mag/Phase at 1/12th smoothing for auto-correction.  (If it were a single measurement, 1-12th is usually too aggressive to match response to, and more smoothing is often needed. I know Michael John cautions against overcorrection.)

Ok, FirD generates a FIR file for each section, they go into the processor, and delays and levels are all that needs to be set.
It sounds like a long process, but like anything it gets easier and quicker with repetition.  I can do the whole 4-way from scratch in around a hour or so now.

Anyway, here's 0,10,15,20, and 30 deg horizontal traces.
To me at least, they look very good...(and more importantly, the box sounds great !!)
So I'm all for the Auto Mag/Phase taking the work out of dialing in EQ's etc :)
Amazing Mark, just how many projects do you have gong on? Between you and Peter I can't keep up.
Looks fantastic BTW
« Last Edit: September 10, 2021, 04:02:40 PM by Mac Kerr »
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Mark Wilkinson

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Re: Eclipse Audio FIR Designer
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2021, 08:40:11 AM »

Amazing Mark, just how many projects do you have gong on? Between you and Peter I can't keep up.
Looks fantastic BTW

Hi Don,  kind words, thank you.
Hope all as been well for you.

Too many projects  haha....
Peter's design and your drawings really got me started years back.  I had so much fun with the PM90 & 60, I've just kept going with one project after another...at least a dozen.
Wish all the builds had stayed about live sound though (that's where my heart and respect for folks know-how stays; hi-fi circles are too often plain nuts, Lol).
Unfortunately, the very limited local live-sound partnership opportunities didn't pan out.

I really would like to try this latest synergy project out live though...it's about as loud as the PM boxes, weighs under 70 lbs, and is the best sounding i've managed yet.
Really rocks under some Labhorns .  (Mr Danley also surely knows how to inspire a DIYer!)
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Eclipse Audio FIR Designer
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2021, 08:40:11 AM »


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