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[Mike Fischer]

Hi Folks, My name is Mike and I am hoping for some help and guidance.   I work for a school that is building a new gymnasium and fitness center and we are looking to do some A/V stuff in each direction.  I reached out to a "professional" and they came back with a 250K budget which is no were near our price point.  Any help or suggestions is appreciated.

- Gym, we will be using the gym for basketball and volleyball games, graduation, assemblies and community movie nights.  The most critical part of all of those is graduation.  We need a system that will be clear with microphone speech.  The second in order of importance is community movie nights.  I am getting pricing on projectors and screens now. 

The space is roughly 9000 square feet ( 110x80), it will have a wood floor, insulated metal walls with sheet rock, and a 30 foot open ceiling.

How many speakers do I need and what type of other equipment.  I would like to keep the audio part of this project to around 15K.   In regards to video is there something that will allow me to hang a projector so it wouldn't get damaged?  Our goal in regards to video is a 20-30 foot wide screen.  The budget for video (screen and projector) is around 15K, is this reasonable? 

- Fitness Center , our fitness center is 1200 square feet (30x40).  I am primarily just looking for background sound.  Could I use just a receiver and speakers?  How many speakers would I need.  The floor with be rubber mats but the ceiling is open and there are a bunch of windows, walls are sheet rock.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks,
Mike

[Ivan Beaver]

Hi Folks, My name is Mike and I am hoping for some help and guidance.   I work for a school that is building a new gymnasium and fitness center and we are looking to do some A/V stuff in each direction.  I reached out to a "professional" and they came back with a 250K budget which is no were near our price point.  Any help or suggestions is appreciated.

- Gym, we will be using the gym for basketball and volleyball games, graduation, assemblies and community movie nights.  The most critical part of all of those is graduation.  We need a system that will be clear with microphone speech.  The second in order of importance is community movie nights.  I am getting pricing on projectors and screens now. 

The space is roughly 9000 square feet ( 110x80), it will have a wood floor, insulated metal walls with sheet rock, and a 30 foot open ceiling.

How many speakers do I need and what type of other equipment.  I would like to keep the audio part of this project to around 15K.   In regards to video is there something that will allow me to hang a projector so it wouldn't get damaged?  Our goal in regards to video is a 20-30 foot wide screen.  The budget for video (screen and projector) is around 15K, is this reasonable? 

- Fitness Center , our fitness center is 1200 square feet (30x40).  I am primarily just looking for background sound.  Could I use just a receiver and speakers?  How many speakers would I need.  The floor with be rubber mats but the ceiling is open and there are a bunch of windows, walls are sheet rock.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks,
Mike

FIRST of all you have to change you name to your REAL FULL NAME or the thread will be locked

Does the 15K include everything?  Meaning speakers-amps-processing-mixing-racks-playback-wiring-wall jacks-mics-install labor- tuning-warranty etc?  All those things add up.

It is not a matter of "how many speakers"-but rather where they are placed in relation to the audience and so forth.

How is the gym laid out for graduation?  Is it long and narrow or wide and shallow?  It makes a BIG difference in the choice of speaker system used.

To be honest 15K is low for a real install company who has insurance-licensed etc. and will be there if a problem arises.

Of course that depends on the other needs.  Can you get by with a 4 channel volume only mixer?  That is a lot less expensive than a 16channel full function console.  Forget wireless mics and go with just a couple of mic inputs.  Maybe even save the playback for a later purchase.

Part of your problem is that it is a gym-which usually means lots of reflections and reverb.

So the proper speaker choice has to be something that has pattern control down to a decently low freq.  This means SIZE and cost.

Cheap speakers will make a lot of noise and may sound decent in the music store-but put them in your gym and it all falls apart.

Loud sound is easy-good clear sound is not so easy-or cheap.

It can be done-but it has to be careful design with some limitations.

[Mike Fischer]

Thanks Ivan!
For graduation the gym is set up wide and shallow.  In regards to money, the 15K is just for equipment.  The total budget install and mics would be around 25k.  Is that a reasonable number?  If not what is a realistic cost?  I would rather do it right the first time and if that means only getting certain things now and adding on later that I would do that.  If it is a matter of just a few thousand more I would get it all at once.

Do you have suggestions on types of speakers and speaker placement, or any other equipment that I should be looking at?

FIRST of all you have to change you name to your REAL FULL NAME or the thread will be locked

Does the 15K include everything?  Meaning speakers-amps-processing-mixing-racks-playback-wiring-wall jacks-mics-install labor- tuning-warranty etc?  All those things add up.

It is not a matter of "how many speakers"-but rather where they are placed in relation to the audience and so forth.

How is the gym laid out for graduation?  Is it long and narrow or wide and shallow?  It makes a BIG difference in the choice of speaker system used.

To be honest 15K is low for a real install company who has insurance-licensed etc. and will be there if a problem arises.

Of course that depends on the other needs.  Can you get by with a 4 channel volume only mixer?  That is a lot less expensive than a 16channel full function console.  Forget wireless mics and go with just a couple of mic inputs.  Maybe even save the playback for a later purchase.

Part of your problem is that it is a gym-which usually means lots of reflections and reverb.

So the proper speaker choice has to be something that has pattern control down to a decently low freq.  This means SIZE and cost.

Cheap speakers will make a lot of noise and may sound decent in the music store-but put them in your gym and it all falls apart.

Loud sound is easy-good clear sound is not so easy-or cheap.

It can be done-but it has to be careful design with some limitations.

[Scott Hofmann]

I would definitely go back to the guy that gave you the $15k budgets and have him break down the costs to see exactly what equipment and services would be provided for that amount!
Was this done by a "professional" as well?

[Mike Fischer]

The only quote I have is the one for 250,000 for the sound and projector/screen.

I would definitely go back to the guy that gave you the $15k budgets and have him break down the costs to see exactly what equipment and services would be provided for that amount!
Was this done by a "professional" as well?

[Ivan Beaver]

Thanks Ivan!
For graduation the gym is set up wide and shallow.  In regards to money, the 15K is just for equipment.  The total budget install and mics would be around 25k.  Is that a reasonable number?  If not what is a realistic cost?  I would rather do it right the first time and if that means only getting certain things now and adding on later that I would do that.  If it is a matter of just a few thousand more I would get it all at once.

Do you have suggestions on types of speakers and speaker placement, or any other equipment that I should be looking at?

That should be doable.

The FIRST thing anybody trying to help should ask for is DRAWINGS showing the seating area-stage-possible locations for speakers and so forth.

You have to determine what needs to be covered-BEFORE you can try to guess what it will take to cover it.

Your setup may not be what some people think.

Gyms and stages come in all sizes/shapes.

[Scott Carneval]

Did you explain your budget to the company before they gave you the $250k quote?  Your $25k budget is reasonable and I would bet the company can come back with another quote if they know your budget.  I get clients all the time who ask for a system but don't know or are unwilling to share their budget.

Where are you located?  There might be a member here who either is or can recommend a qualified integrator. 

Also, is there a separate budget for acoustic treatment for the gym, or is that included in the $25k?  As Ivan pointed out, gymnasiums are terrible acoustic environments, and even the $250k system will probably sound like crap if the room isn't properly treated.

[Mike Fischer]

Thanks Scott!  We are located in Portsmouth, NH.  We did tell the vendor that we have a limited budget.  At the time we were really trying to get a feel of the cost so we can budget appropriately.   The project does have some basic treatment in the gym but that is something we want to continue to explore.  How much would it cost to get a decent treatment?   

If you do know of any vendors in the area please let me know.

Thanks again,
Mike

Did you explain your budget to the company before they gave you the $250k quote?  Your $25k budget is reasonable and I would bet the company can come back with another quote if they know your budget.  I get clients all the time who ask for a system but don't know or are unwilling to share their budget.

Where are you located?  There might be a member here who either is or can recommend a qualified integrator. 

Also, is there a separate budget for acoustic treatment for the gym, or is that included in the $25k?  As Ivan pointed out, gymnasiums are terrible acoustic environments, and even the $250k system will probably sound like crap if the room isn't properly treated.

[Cailen Waddell]

Mike - did your vendor break down the costs?   You can easily spend 100k or more on just the projection in the gym with the image size you are talking about.   


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[Ivan Beaver]

  How much would it cost to get a decent treatment?   

Treatment prices vary quite a lot.

It depends on a lot of factors-such as where you can actually put treatment-what the end result is expected to be.

Without more information (such as detailed drawings or a site visit) it is hard to say.

Consider that a 2" 6 lb 4x8 panel will cost somewhere around $200 each installed (your prices may vary-depending).

Usually acoustic treatment involved both absorption and diffusion.

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