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Author Topic: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops  (Read 8552 times)

Doug Fowler

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SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« on: July 31, 2012, 04:22:05 pm »

Mark -  I'm not trying to be a smart ass here, but this is a perfect opportunity to demonstrate why I think SysTune Delay Analysis is a game changer.

Procedure:

1.  Get a valid sub measurement and save the overlay  (no receive delay insertion required, but you can do it if you want to).
2.  Get a valid tops measurement and save the overlay (no receive delay insertion required, but you can do it if you want to).
3.  Use the two overlays as input to Delay Analysis.  If you get the "Delay" and "Reference" wrong, ST will report the delay value as negative time, and you'll know immediately.
4.  Pick one of the three values offered.  The first will be for positive polarity, max summation.  Second will be reverse polarity, max summation.  The third I find very intruiging, flattest summation through crossover.  Or use a custom value.

Done.

If you wish, you can compare phase while you are doing this.  There is also the possibility for a custom delay value, which is very handy.  Keep in mind you can see the results of your delay values on the screen, without the system being stimulated.

The next issue of Live Sound! will have a piece on this very topic.  It benefits not only beginners who need to do field alignments, but for those of us who can already use the phase method, it saves a lot of time.  A lot of time.  If you need to do a ten minute EQ and alignment job, the amount of time saved by using this feature is invaluable.

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Helge A Bentsen

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Re: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2012, 09:28:28 pm »

Is it possible to use this method for delays/fills as well?

I tend to use a lot more time before a gig getting delay times right than doing system EQ. I guess it's time to try the demo and see if I can save some time :)
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Doug Fowler

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Re: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2012, 09:43:18 pm »

Is it possible to use this method for delays/fills as well?

I tend to use a lot more time before a gig getting delay times right than doing system EQ. I guess it's time to try the demo and see if I can save some time :)

Helge -

Of course.  DA is configurable with respect to frequency range for alignment.  There are presets, and custom options.

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Paul Tucci

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Re: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« Reply #3 on: August 01, 2012, 10:13:33 pm »

The next issue of Live Sound! will have a piece on this very topic. .

I look forward to reading this.

PT
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Mark McFarlane

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Re: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2012, 01:36:38 am »

Mark -  ...

I am assuming I am the 'Mark' you are addressing. Sorry I didn't see this post for a week. 

Thanks Doug for the heads up, I'll probably try the demo of SysTune, but it is unfortunate it is Windows only, I am a Mac guy, but I have other Windows-only software....

It looks like the 'standard version' would be adequate for my needs, but I wasn't quite sure about the significance of this feature, which is missing in the standard version: 'Offline investigation of stored data'. I do like to be able to capture traces in Smaart to study later, when I am not connected to the audio card...

I also didn't see an online support forum for SysTune: http://www.afmg-network.com

With the current exchange rate, 400Euro ($500) certainly compares favorably against Smaart's $895 price and the remote iPad interface looks interesting. Are there any authorized dealers that sell SysTune at a lower price?

« Last Edit: August 10, 2012, 01:38:14 am by Mark McFarlane »
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Nicolas Poisson

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Re: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2012, 03:17:24 am »

I'll probably try the demo of SysTune, but it is unfortunate it is Windows only, I am a Mac guy, but I have other Windows-only software...
Hi,
There used to be two demos of Systune 1.0:
- the full-featured version, limited to 30 days,
- a feature-limited version, unlimited in time

The second demo is no longer available on Systune's website since update to 1.2. However, it can be still downloaded on Renkus-Heinz website.
http://www.renkus-heinz.com/systune/index.html

This version, which I use, has all the basic functions (including up to 8 channels) and is sufficient for basic users, which I am.

I'am also a Mac guy, so before you try:
- Systune Demo did not work in Parallels
- Systune Demo did not even work in WinXP + Bootcamp, which is strange because it is supposed to be exactly like a PC.
I use an old PC laptop for it.

Another thing: I always have had "drops" in the signal during measurements. This creates artifacts on the curves. These are easily detectable so you can still perform measurements, but this is annoying when trying to average curves with artifacts. I read that this is related to the interface, but I am not sure of anything.

Maybe all of this does not happen with the 1.2 version, but try before you buy.

There actually is a dedicated forum section for Systune, "Easera Systune":
http://www.afmg-network.com/viewforum.php?f=14
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Bruce Olson

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Re: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2012, 11:28:13 am »

It looks like the 'standard version' would be adequate for my needs, but I wasn't quite sure about the significance of this feature, which is missing in the standard version: 'Offline investigation of stored data'. I do like to be able to capture traces in Smaart to study later, when I am not connected to the audio card...
All versions allow you to store what we call an Overlay file. This is a single file that contains the raw measured data, and allows you to, for instance, change from 1/3rd octave to 1/96th octave, show the data windowed or not, etc. The off-line feature in the Pro version allows you to analyze a multi-ch audio recording as though it were a live signal. I am using this feature to allow me to analyze 8-ch recordings of measurements in motion picture theaters stored using Pro-Tools to see the effects of different FFT sizes and Sample Rates, as though I were measuring live. Dual or Multi-ch FFT is possible if one of the channels has the reference signal.

Quote
I also didn't see an online support forum for SysTune: http://www.afmg-network.com
As Nicolas said, you can find it here: http://afmg-network.com/viewforum.php?f=14

Quote
With the current exchange rate, 400Euro ($500) certainly compares favorably against Smaart's $895 price and the remote iPad interface looks interesting. Are there any authorized dealers that sell SysTune at a lower price?
You can find info on purchasing SysTune here: http://systune.afmg.eu/index.php/st-purchase-en.html

HTH,
Bruce
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Doug Fowler

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Re: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2012, 12:13:38 pm »

Hi,
There used to be two demos of Systune 1.0:
- the full-featured version, limited to 30 days,
- a feature-limited version, unlimited in time

The second demo is no longer available on Systune's website since update to 1.2. However, it can be still downloaded on Renkus-Heinz website.
http://www.renkus-heinz.com/systune/index.html

This version, which I use, has all the basic functions (including up to 8 channels) and is sufficient for basic users, which I am.

I'am also a Mac guy, so before you try:
- Systune Demo did not work in Parallels
- Systune Demo did not even work in WinXP + Bootcamp, which is strange because it is supposed to be exactly like a PC.
I use an old PC laptop for it.

Another thing: I always have had "drops" in the signal during measurements. This creates artifacts on the curves. These are easily detectable so you can still perform measurements, but this is annoying when trying to average curves with artifacts. I read that this is related to the interface, but I am not sure of anything.

Maybe all of this does not happen with the 1.2 version, but try before you buy.

There actually is a dedicated forum section for Systune, "Easera Systune":
http://www.afmg-network.com/viewforum.php?f=14

Nicolas -

If you are using an older PC, check its ability to handle real time audio with the DPC latency checker.

http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml
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David Martínez

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Re: SysTune procedure for aligning subs and tops
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2014, 07:56:58 am »

Hi,
I have seen you are using Systune with ProoTools to allow me to analyze 8-ch recordings of measurements.
Is possible to use Systune for mixing, for example this 8-ch, in order to analyse the phase and more parameters each channel.

Best regards

David

 
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Mac Kerr

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« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2014, 07:59:37 am »

Hi,
I have seen you are using Systune with ProoTools

Please go to your profile and change the "Name" field to your real first and last name as required by the posting rules displayed in the header at the top of the section, and in the Site Rules and Suggestions in the Forum Announcements section, and on the registration page when you registered.

Mac
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