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Author Topic: best sub enclosures for my application ?  (Read 30263 times)

Pat Semeraro

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #30 on: April 26, 2013, 08:17:22 pm »

This sounds like the classic "Cheap, loud, low, easy" - pick two...  also, never underestimate the value of interesting used gear.  Everything from LABs, to Tubas, to JBL 728s to TH-115s show up eventually.  My first question is always how to make sure the speakers don't blow up!  This can be done the right way - great speakers, great amps and captive processing.  Or, this can be done cheaply with low powered amps with good limiters (think QSC PLX) and lots of boxes that couple together to get the output you require.  Cheap powered subs always blow up eventually and the good ones are expensive!

Whatever you end up using, there's lots of value in something that can measure in-room response.  Between the subs and the room there's often 2 or 3 problem notes that will respond to eq plus correcting the overall response - fixing those will give a much smoother sound. 
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dave celko

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #31 on: April 26, 2013, 11:41:25 pm »

i cant wait for the other 2 amps to arrive.i bridged the one 600a and ran it to one sub, and it was a massive difference. im willing to bet with each sub on a bridged 600a it will be damn close to the output levels im wanting.

if it is im going to invest in a much better eq and active crossover and see if i can get the sound a lil cleaner, and then go from there upgrade the subs one way or another
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #32 on: April 27, 2013, 08:11:06 am »


if it is im going to invest in a much better eq and active crossover and see if i can get the sound a lil cleaner, and then go from there upgrade the subs one way or another
What type of crossover are you using NOW?  If you don't have a crossover-then that will make a HUGE difference in the "sound" of the bass.  Right now you are just getting  a bunch of low mid "mush" (if you are not using a crossover) and probably can hear the real bass because of how loud the upper freq are and covering it up.

I highly doubt you will be able to hear a difference with a "much better eq".  It certainly won't "get the sound cleaner"-unless you using a total piece of trash.
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Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

dave celko

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #33 on: April 27, 2013, 03:41:07 pm »

What type of crossover are you using NOW?  If you don't have a crossover-then that will make a HUGE difference in the "sound" of the bass.  Right now you are just getting  a bunch of low mid "mush" (if you are not using a crossover) and probably can hear the real bass because of how loud the upper freq are and covering it up.

I highly doubt you will be able to hear a difference with a "much better eq".  It certainly won't "get the sound cleaner"-unless you using a total piece of trash.
its a technical pro xo2  crossover, i also have a cheap 31  band eq the problem witht he eg is its way to sensitive on the adjustments the slightest movement of the sliders gives a huge cut or boost in that freg range.

say i have the slider at the 0 mark and slide the slider upto the first mark above it it wont do a thing , move it a lil more and nothing , then the next lil movement will give a huge boost in that band.
its very very hard to adjust , i dont rember the brand off hand but yes it was a very cheap pos

any recommendations on a good eq and x over that wont break the bank?

we have a dance tonight so im about to me on my way over to work to start setting up for it
« Last Edit: April 27, 2013, 03:42:39 pm by dave celko »
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dave celko

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #34 on: April 28, 2013, 03:56:46 am »

the 1100a was sitting at work today when i got there so i hooked that up bridged to the 2 18's

at this point i think the lab subs may be out, it was definitely loud enough tonight with the new amp, and with some more carefull tweaking of the x over and eq got it sounding pretty dang good.
 we had to push the subs pretty hard tonight but they held up for 6 hours straight. ideally i think id like to add one more of the same subs so i can back off just a bit on the power level to each sub

what would the difference be between 2 18 subs at about 800w rms each  and then going to 3 of the same 18 inch subs at around 550w rms ?
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #35 on: April 28, 2013, 10:51:47 am »

the 1100a was sitting at work today when i got there so i hooked that up bridged to the 2 18's

at this point i think the lab subs may be out, it was definitely loud enough tonight with the new amp, and with some more carefull tweaking of the x over and eq got it sounding pretty dang good.
 we had to push the subs pretty hard tonight but they held up for 6 hours straight. ideally i think id like to add one more of the same subs so i can back off just a bit on the power level to each sub

what would the difference be between 2 18 subs at about 800w rms each  and then going to 3 of the same 18 inch subs at around 550w rms ?
One of my mentors years ago told me "It is far better to use fewer-better quality pieces of gear-than a bunch of cheap gear.  All you get is a louder mess".

So let's do the math on the subs.  Assuming everything is "equal".  The difference between 2 and 3 subs-(with the same power) would be about 3-4dB.  The difference between 550w and 800 W is about 1.5dB.

So 4-1.5=2.5.  So the 3 with less power would be about 1.5 to 2.5dB louder.  Simply due to the additional cone area.

Another advantage is that the power going to each one would be less-so they would have less stress-while producing more sound.  Not a bad trade off if you ask me.
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Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

dave celko

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #36 on: April 28, 2013, 07:07:37 pm »

One of my mentors years ago told me "It is far better to use fewer-better quality pieces of gear-than a bunch of cheap gear.  All you get is a louder mess".

So let's do the math on the subs.  Assuming everything is "equal".  The difference between 2 and 3 subs-(with the same power) would be about 3-4dB.  The difference between 550w and 800 W is about 1.5dB.

So 4-1.5=2.5.  So the 3 with less power would be about 1.5 to 2.5dB louder.  Simply due to the additional cone area.

Another advantage is that the power going to each one would be less-so they would have less stress-while producing more sound.  Not a bad trade off if you ask me.

thanks for the help, now i really need to decide if i spend another 302$'s for another enforcer 2 , or build 2 lab subs

its a hard choice as the subs will only be used for this one thing.
if i add another enforcer 2 my concern is how long will they last
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #37 on: April 28, 2013, 07:36:40 pm »

thanks for the help, now i really need to decide if i spend another 302$'s for another enforcer 2 , or build 2 lab subs

its a hard choice as the subs will only be used for this one thing.
if i add another enforcer 2 my concern is how long will they last
You will probably realize the same increase in sound quality by going to a real sub (like the lab sub)-instead of what you are using now.

I would estimate that a single lab sub would run circles around 3 of your current cabinets (probably more)
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A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

dave celko

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #38 on: April 28, 2013, 09:25:47 pm »

You will probably realize the same increase in sound quality by going to a real sub (like the lab sub)-instead of what you are using now.

I would estimate that a single lab sub would run circles around 3 of your current cabinets (probably more)
i just wish i could hear one before i decided what to do
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dave celko

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #39 on: April 29, 2013, 06:54:57 pm »

i just wish i could hear one before i decided what to do

been looking at the lab sub some more and i think i need to start with something a lil simpler for my first ones

ivan what are u thoughts on the Cinema F-20 ?

looks like it will go low and loud enough , and damn simple to build, though it is pretty tall but that isnt an issue for me

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Re: best sub enclosures for my application ?
« Reply #39 on: April 29, 2013, 06:54:57 pm »


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