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Author Topic: Direct box with XLR input  (Read 20910 times)

Greg_Cameron

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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #30 on: February 14, 2013, 01:11:57 am »

http://artproaudio.com/artcessories/di_boxes/product/xdirect  $29/ea at B&H. decent for this purpose..

Really for this type of application, you want a passive DI with a decent transformer rather than an active DI without a transformer. The reason is that direct coupled active DIs can still allow noise problems to occur under some circumstances. Line level devices don't need the high impedance afforded by active DIs relative to passive ones. The transformer isolation of a passive DI will guarantee 100% isolation from any possible noise that would be caused by the direct coupled circuitry of a non-tranformer type active DI.

edit: fixed run-on sentence.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2013, 01:14:58 am by Greg Cameron »
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Dave Neale

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Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #31 on: February 14, 2013, 01:22:48 am »

Hi, I rarely post here anymore, but here goes.



The Pioneer mixers definitely have attenuation for the outputs.

However, I get that a dj is showing up with this thing and its their gear and how you might not want to get into his digital mixer and play with settings.

Which brings me to...

What you really need to do is train your client a bit.  They should be sending you a level you can use. They should be willing to work with you and really they should ask if what they are sending you is a good nominal level.

Most djs don't know anything about that stuff until you train them a bit.

I've never had one get mad at me once I explained the headroom concept and walked them through setting proper gain stages.  I try to get them to eq flat and ask me for what shaping they want at my console. That's a mixed bag, but if they work with me I can keep things a lot more linear.

 Most of them can appreciate the difference when we do a venue walk.

I do always do a dual compressor set up to finesse the feed a bit. You need to play with it but you can fatten up the bottom and get the big rave feel at a lower system level.

If a guitar player was peeling everybody's face off in a small space you'd say something, right? Or if DI'd keys are clipping? Same deal.

They're djs, you will have to remind them a lot.

Oh, and lots of stuff is digital now. Yellow is the new red.
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Patrick Tracy

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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #32 on: February 14, 2013, 12:30:12 pm »

I looked in the mixwiz manual
XLR input sensitivity -60 to +10 db
TRS input sensitivity -40 to +10 db
Pad in (MIC or LINE) >10k ohm, -20dB

It looks like there's a typo: XLR sensitivity should be -60 yo -10dB. The gain control has a 50dB range with a 20dB offset between XLR and TRS, plus a 20dB pad that works on either.

With the pad engaged the TRS input can handle +30dBu.

The XLR-TRS is just the first thing to try and may be all you need. But with visiting DJs it's not a bad idea to be prepared with more solutions.

Jerome Malsack

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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #33 on: February 14, 2013, 01:06:17 pm »

Not down a snake.

RCA to TS into the DI, xlr out the DI down the snake, common.
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Patrick Tracy

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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #34 on: February 14, 2013, 11:27:03 pm »

RCA to TS into the DI, xlr out the DI down the snake, common.

And perhaps a lower output than the XLR.

Jerome Malsack

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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #35 on: February 15, 2013, 08:03:46 am »

And perhaps a lower output than the XLR.

and that line level -20 db consumer output is lower than a base guitar pickup without amplification?

The mixers input is not able to adjust the gain +60 db?? most do.
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Patrick Tracy

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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #36 on: February 15, 2013, 11:17:18 am »

and that line level -20 db consumer output is lower than a base guitar pickup without amplification?

The mixers input is not able to adjust the gain +60 db?? most do.

I was recognizing the lower output as a possible advantage if the DJ is slamming the levels. But I would still start with a simple XLR-TRS from the DJ mixer balanced out.

Nate Armstrong

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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #37 on: February 18, 2013, 03:53:25 pm »

Hi, I rarely post here anymore, but here goes.



The Pioneer mixers definitely have attenuation for the outputs.

However, I get that a dj is showing up with this thing and its their gear and how you might not want to get into his digital mixer and play with settings.

Which brings me to...

What you really need to do is train your client a bit.  They should be sending you a level you can use. They should be willing to work with you and really they should ask if what they are sending you is a good nominal level.

Most djs don't know anything about that stuff until you train them a bit.

I've never had one get mad at me once I explained the headroom concept and walked them through setting proper gain stages.  I try to get them to eq flat and ask me for what shaping they want at my console. That's a mixed bag, but if they work with me I can keep things a lot more linear.

 Most of them can appreciate the difference when we do a venue walk.

I do always do a dual compressor set up to finesse the feed a bit. You need to play with it but you can fatten up the bottom and get the big rave feel at a lower system level.

If a guitar player was peeling everybody's face off in a small space you'd say something, right? Or if DI'd keys are clipping? Same deal.

They're djs, you will have to remind them a lot.

Oh, and lots of stuff is digital now. Yellow is the new red.

I am done trying to have this conversation with Dj's  more often than not it goes in one ear and out the other. Local guys normally understand and realize I want it to sound as good as possible, they send me a good signal. When the headliner comes on. that's is when I have a problem even after I have explained it to them and that I left head room for there performance to be louder than the others.. Every one of these shows I do I have at least 1 ( normally more ) dj that redlines, and im tired of fighting it.

I have yet to test my 1/4 in output and see if that drops the signal down.
I plan on purchasing 2 DI's leaning toward the Klark techinca or Radial.

For now I got 2   -20 DB pads.  That plus the pads on the Mix wiz should be more than enough.

after all the Di's and outboard gear, Im thinking i should of just got a digital board..

thanks for the help everyone !
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Dave Neale

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Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #38 on: February 18, 2013, 04:15:00 pm »

I get that. Have you tried slamming them with the monitor mix to trick them into pulling their master down?
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Marlow Wilson

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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2013, 05:54:06 pm »

I get that. Have you tried slamming them with the monitor mix to trick them into pulling their master down?

Dave,

I know you mean well.

Real professionals won't f*** with the monitor levels.  Real touring DJ's also won't take well to the nanny soundman.  It's our job to work with them, not the other way around

Just my thoughts.
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Re: Direct box with XLR input
« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2013, 05:54:06 pm »


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