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Author Topic: I need small powerfull side fills  (Read 7047 times)

Wes Rager

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I need small powerfull side fills
« on: January 31, 2013, 03:30:06 pm »

...for recorded music.  I have a GX5 for power.  Will cross at 80.  My short list is:
JBL AC18
QSC S82H
RH CFX81
EAW JF8
Any thoughts on these or are they too close to comment?  Thanks!
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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2013, 03:35:23 pm »

...for recorded music.  I have a GX5 for power.  Will cross at 80.  My short list is:
JBL AC18
QSC S82H
RH CFX81
EAW JF8
Any thoughts on these or are they too close to comment?  Thanks!

DJ monitors?  Sounds like that's your use.  Knowing the application is kind of necessary for getting meaningful responses.
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Wes Rager

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2013, 05:57:56 pm »

Yes, sorry.  DJ use for about 50 people.  Thx!
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2013, 07:25:14 pm »

Yes, sorry.  DJ use for about 50 people.  Thx!
SO to expand on Dicks comments-you STILL have not provided any useful information.

We know it is for a DJ-We know for how many people.  So here come more questions that have to be SPECIFICALLY answered-if you want to get any useful answers.

You said side fills-does that mean DJ monitors? or sidefills for the main PA?

If the later-what is the area to be covered-it can't be that large for 50 people-so what is the actual coverage area-maybe 10' deep and 80' wide?  We have NO idea based on your response.

What is the type of music?  DJ could be anything from Frank Sinatra for 70yr olds to hard techno for 18yr olds.  HUGE difference and needs.

Is  money an issue?

How do you plan on mounting them-stand-hanging etc? or are they going to be sitting on something?

You may know exactly what you want/need-but WE don't have a clue about what you are really trying to do.

Are you open to other suggestions? or must people choose between your choices-based on ?????

It is kinda like asking "what is the best car"  FIRST you have to determine what you want in a car-speed-comfort-number of passengers and so forth.  Without that-the answers don't mean a thing.

Sorry to be blunt-but that is the way it is.
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Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2013, 07:35:58 pm »

SO to expand on Dicks comments-you STILL have not provided any useful information.

We know it is for a DJ-We know for how many people.  So here come more questions that have to be SPECIFICALLY answered-if you want to get any useful answers.

You said side fills-does that mean DJ monitors? or sidefills for the main PA?

If the later-what is the area to be covered-it can't be that large for 50 people-so what is the actual coverage area-maybe 10' deep and 80' wide?  We have NO idea based on your response.

What is the type of music?  DJ could be anything from Frank Sinatra for 70yr olds to hard techno for 18yr olds.  HUGE difference and needs.

Is  money an issue?

How do you plan on mounting them-stand-hanging etc? or are they going to be sitting on something?

You may know exactly what you want/need-but WE don't have a clue about what you are really trying to do.

Are you open to other suggestions? or must people choose between your choices-based on ?????

It is kinda like asking "what is the best car"  FIRST you have to determine what you want in a car-speed-comfort-number of passengers and so forth.  Without that-the answers don't mean a thing.

Sorry to be blunt-but that is the way it is.

And what's the main system?  What processing do you have available?  What's your favorite color?
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2013, 08:04:36 pm »

And what's the main system?  What processing do you have available?  What's your favorite color?
WOW-I meant to ask that-but I forgot -got a brain fart-thanks for adding.  That would be a VERY important question to be answered.
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Ivan Beaver
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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2013, 08:17:10 pm »

WOW-I meant to ask that-but I forgot -got a brain fart-thanks for adding.  That would be a VERY important question to be answered.

Color you red.......
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Wes Rager

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2013, 08:48:16 pm »

OK, I knew you guys were good...time to come clean.  I have a home theater that is 20 x 30.  I can't get any good answers/insights from the typical HT sites and I use exclusively pro gear (except for a reciever), so I come here.  I'm looking for surrounds that can keep up with my fronts and subs.  My LCR's are three JBL 4622's (upgraded with 2450-SL CD's) that are actively bi-amped with three crown DSi-1000's.  These have pre-sets for my 4622's (this is until I can afford som SH50's)!  For subs I have 1-DTS-10 (14-50hz), 1-5749= 2 X 2242 (30-200), 1 -2245, and 1-AE TD18H (25-125).  For sub mgmnt I use a QSC DSP-30.  The subs are powered by a QSC 4050HD and a Crown XLS5000.

I am so close to reaching nervana, I just need better surrounds.  Music is 50% of my listening.  Would you foregive my transgressions and provide advice?  I have limited space, so that's how I arrived at my list- 11 x 16 (H) x 12  Thanks!
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Tim Weaver

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2013, 10:26:19 pm »

OK, I knew you guys were good...time to come clean.  I have a home theater that is 20 x 30.  I can't get any good answers/insights from the typical HT sites and I use exclusively pro gear (except for a reciever), so I come here.  I'm looking for surrounds that can keep up with my fronts and subs.  My LCR's are three JBL 4622's (upgraded with 2450-SL CD's) that are actively bi-amped with three crown DSi-1000's.  These have pre-sets for my 4622's (this is until I can afford som SH50's)!  For subs I have 1-DTS-10 (14-50hz), 1-5749= 2 X 2242 (30-200), 1 -2245, and 1-AE TD18H (25-125).  For sub mgmnt I use a QSC DSP-30.  The subs are powered by a QSC 4050HD and a Crown XLS5000.

I am so close to reaching nervana, I just need better surrounds.  Music is 50% of my listening.  Would you foregive my transgressions and provide advice?  I have limited space, so that's how I arrived at my list- 11 x 16 (H) x 12  Thanks!


Danley SH mini's are really good, but may not have enough Oomph for you. The JTR triple 8 is also a great box that is smallish, but has some pretty good output.
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Tim Weaver

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2013, 10:29:02 pm »


Danley SH mini's are really good, but may not have enough Oomph for you. The JTR triple 8 is also a great box that is smallish, but has some pretty good output.


You'll also find that we are pretty cool with HT people as long as you keep it real. We don't go for any audiofile BS here. If you ask us what is the best speaker cable for your situation, we are gonna say 12 gauge copper. You can get it at Home Depot like the rest of us!
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Mike Pyle

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2013, 01:03:30 am »

EV ZX1
Tannoy VX8
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Mike Pyle  Audiopyle Sound  707-315-6204
Dealer For: JBL, Soundcraft, Crown, dbx, AKG, Yorkville, EV, QSC, RCF, FBT, Danley Sound Labs, Fulcrum Acoustic, Tannoy, Lab Gruppen, Powersoft, Linea Research, VTC, EAW, Allen & Heath, Ashly, APB, Audix, One Systems, OnPoint Audio, Presonus, K&M, Ultimate, Global Truss, Road Ready, SKB, Gator, Radial Engineering, Turbosound, Midas, dB Technologies, American DJ, Odyssey, ProCo, Rapco, CBI, Elation, Mipro, Chauvet, Blizzard, Shure, Whirlwind, Bassboss, Yamaha, Line 6, Behringer, Whirlwind, On-Stage, more...

Tim Perry

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2013, 02:26:06 am »

So you have 3 600W speaker up front (with sensitivity of 101 dB @ 1 meter) and you want l & R rears to complement... As has been discussed many time PA speakers are not usually the best choices for any number of reasons. 

The AC18 which has a rotatable 120 x 60 horn seems to me to be either too wide or too narrow for a corner speaker.   

Assuming a square / rectangular room a 90 degrees box would sort of give you even near-field coverage yet maximize the sweet spot while minimizing reflections from the walls.

The JF 8 is 100 degrees conical.

The CFX81 is 150 x 60 degrees

The QSC AD-s82H is 90 x 60  ---- >  I "vote" for this one  mounted in a corner at a 45 degree angle from the wall.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #12 on: February 01, 2013, 07:43:08 am »

  I have limited space, so that's how I arrived at my list- 11 x 16 (H) x 12  Thanks!
No I am even MORE confused.  You have a room that is 11x12 (on the floor) and you can put FIFTY people in it?

I hope they are GOOD friends.

That is assuming you are talking feet.  If you are talking Meters-then that is a different story.  But if you have a room that has a ceiling 16M- WOW.  Is it a bit "boomy?

When looking at speakers you also need to consider the coverage pattern of the speaker in relation to the seating area.  The vertical height will also greatly affect this coverage.

So NOW we need a drawing or something that gives a general idea of the space you are trying to cover-possible locations of speakers and so forth.  But as a general rule-for a larger number of people you are going to need a wider pattern.

HOWEVER you really need to look past the "simple numbers" in the spec sheet.  Since these are all small speakers-they will have small horns.  Small horns exhibit pattern flip and the actual pattern (at all but the highest freq) is likely to be VERY different than the simple numbers.  You need to get the REAL story-if you are going to talk about coverage patterns-or are trying to cover people evenly.

Also remember that the surrounds typically don't need to "keep up" with the mains.  They often have quite a bit lower capacity in output.  I don't have any specs-but a "really wild guess" would be 10dB-(somebody please correct me if I am off base on this one-I really have no idea of a target regarding max output).

So where does the DJ come into this?????????
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Ivan Beaver
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2013, 11:19:59 am »

Ivan, he came clean... Home theater.

I suppose the DJ plays at intermission. ;)
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Tim Perry

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2013, 08:42:50 pm »

Ivan, he came clean... Home theater.

I suppose the DJ plays at intermission. ;)

Think of it as a private club with  A/V...  personally I'd be happy with Tannoys ... wait I HAVE Tannoys... I must be happy.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: I need small powerfull side fills
« Reply #15 on: February 07, 2013, 09:10:20 pm »

Ivan, he came clean... Home theater.

I suppose the DJ plays at intermission. ;)
Maybe in part of the original post-but what about the rest of the "description of the place".

Knowing what is truthful would really help.
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A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!
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