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Author Topic: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help  (Read 20963 times)

Jeff Young

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Re: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help-WRONG!!!
« Reply #70 on: November 24, 2012, 01:01:42 pm »

I have never seen a "trim knob for solo" what is that?  You may have a master solo level "knob", but that has NOTHING to do with the sound that is coming out of the speakers.

What are you using the aux for?

It sounds like you need to start learning what the knobs are for/do.  Just turning knobs and "hoping" to get a good sound is NOT the way to go about it.

Does you guitar player just turn the tuning keys and "hope" that he gets them in tune?

There IS a METHOD to go about.  GUESSING is NOT it.

When we first set it up I had no idea about aux/solo/busses/ etc.. But after this thread and what seems to be a ridiculous amount of time the last week and a half studying online manuals and tutorial sites, PAG NAG instructionals. It appears that all I need to do is route the vocal thru L/R, set levels, ring out the system, get rid of one of the 2x15's (which might ultimately be used for an onstage monitor while the other for PA if capabilities allow), make sure the 2x15 that we actually use in the basement is not interfering with the vocal mic's, turn down the guitars(which I have no idea yet how that's gonna happen, our lead guitar alone has so much power that he is running at volume level 1 or 2 if he turns his amp down at all it sounds all screwed up, probably some room in his pedal board to give him some leeway but im sure that will take some convincing.) Have come to the conclusion that  have been trying to use entirely too much of the board for what we actually need it to do...

in the most simplest of needs,...one lead mic on channel 1, one backup vocal on channel 2 set levels, ring out system (with speaker/s in correct locations, adjust all volumes to correct levels making sure that guitars dont drown out the vocals defeating everything I have done here.
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help-WRONG!!!
« Reply #71 on: November 24, 2012, 05:00:30 pm »

When we first set it up I had no idea about aux/solo/busses/ etc.. But after this thread and what seems to be a ridiculous amount of time the last week and a half studying online manuals and tutorial sites, PAG NAG instructionals. It appears that all I need to do is route the vocal thru L/R, set levels, ring out the system, get rid of one of the 2x15's (which might ultimately be used for an onstage monitor while the other for PA if capabilities allow), make sure the 2x15 that we actually use in the basement is not interfering with the vocal mic's, turn down the guitars(which I have no idea yet how that's gonna happen, our lead guitar alone has so much power that he is running at volume level 1 or 2 if he turns his amp down at all it sounds all screwed up, probably some room in his pedal board to give him some leeway but im sure that will take some convincing.) Have come to the conclusion that  have been trying to use entirely too much of the board for what we actually need it to do...

in the most simplest of needs,...one lead mic on channel 1, one backup vocal on channel 2 set levels, ring out system (with speaker/s in correct locations, adjust all volumes to correct levels making sure that guitars dont drown out the vocals defeating everything I have done here.

You have learned more than it initially appeared.  Good work, Jeff, and thanks for sticking with us.  The processes here at Ye Olde Skool of Harde Audible Knocks, is kind of socratic with a bit of curmudgeonly-ness thrown in.  Stir in some Impatience of Expertise for good measure....

You've identified places where you were adding unnecessary electrical gain, such as multi-busing signals.  The concept of not aiming Other Loud Things into the vocal has taken hold.  If the band is patient, you can try various things one at a time so you can hear how they impact the results.

Let us know what you try and how it went.

As for the guitarist, there is no simple solution.  The best is a smaller amp, but your Basement Tonmeister either doesn't own one or would complain that he "can't get his sound."  Good luck... and remember, Acoustic solutions for Acoustic problems.... your answer is in there.  Really.  Trust me, I play a doctor in community theater... /humor
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Jeff Young

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Re: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help-WRONG!!!
« Reply #72 on: November 25, 2012, 02:09:46 am »

You have learned more than it initially appeared.  Good work, Jeff, and thanks for sticking with us.  The processes here at Ye Olde Skool of Harde Audible Knocks, is kind of socratic with a bit of curmudgeonly-ness thrown in.  Stir in some Impatience of Expertise for good measure....

You've identified places where you were adding unnecessary electrical gain, such as multi-busing signals.  The concept of not aiming Other Loud Things into the vocal has taken hold.  If the band is patient, you can try various things one at a time so you can hear how they impact the results.

Let us know what you try and how it went.

As for the guitarist, there is no simple solution.  The best is a smaller amp, but your Basement Tonmeister either doesn't own one or would complain that he "can't get his sound."  Good luck... and remember, Acoustic solutions for Acoustic problems.... your answer is in there.  Really.  Trust me, I play a doctor in community theater... /humor

everything to zero...
brought mic's to feedback...
low cut...
mid shelve...
Graphic uneeded...
move speakers...
better overall sound in almost every way...best recordings as well

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John Halliburton

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Re: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help-WRONG!!!
« Reply #73 on: November 25, 2012, 09:47:45 am »

everything to zero...
brought mic's to feedback...
low cut...
mid shelve...
Graphic uneeded...
move speakers...
better overall sound in almost every way...best recordings as well
Congratulations!

Leave the graphic eq in circuit, things change(crowded room or empty for instance), and be ready to use it just in case.

Best regards,

John
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Jeff Young

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Re: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help-WRONG!!!
« Reply #74 on: November 25, 2012, 10:06:04 am »

Congratulations!

Leave the graphic eq in circuit, things change(crowded room or empty for instance), and be ready to use it just in case.

Best regards,

John

took drummer out of PA completely and ran his kick drum to a little Crate powered mixer and 1x15 behind the drums...

even though these changes to settings, set up, and lay out resulted in nothing but better sound all the way around with more leveled recordings taken from my Zoom....still spent three hrs listening to the drummer tell me that everyone needs to be mic'd off and ran thru the PA.

But thanks all, at least its facing the right direction now
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Greg_Cameron

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Re: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help-WRONG!!!
« Reply #75 on: November 25, 2012, 12:43:12 pm »

even though these changes to settings, set up, and lay out resulted in nothing but better sound all the way around with more leveled recordings taken from my Zoom....still spent three hrs listening to the drummer tell me that everyone needs to be mic'd off and ran thru the PA.

Then tell your drummer to cough up $20k or so for a bigger/better PA that can handle it.
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Cameron Pro Audio

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Re: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help-WRONG!!!
« Reply #76 on: November 25, 2012, 12:45:04 pm »

Then tell your drummer to cough up $20k or so for a bigger/better PA that can handle it.

As an older lady suggested to a soundman, "Put mics on the drums and TURN THEM DOWN!"
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Samuel Rees

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gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help
« Reply #77 on: November 25, 2012, 03:49:14 pm »

What a world that would be - where "mic'ing" something would allow you to negatively reinforce the sound it makes!
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Mac Kerr

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Re: gain issues in live set up not sure how to fix..please help
« Reply #78 on: November 25, 2012, 03:53:20 pm »

What a world that would be - where "mic'ing" something would allow you to negatively reinforce the sound it makes!

Whoosh!
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