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Author Topic: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.  (Read 15612 times)

Dave Rickard

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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2012, 10:47:18 am »

I A/B'd my ZOOM H2 with a pair of KSM32's and a tube pre into an Alesis Masterlink. It's not the same, but it's very good. It's perfect for this!

I record most of my mixes with it. Listening to my mixes later has shown me strengths and weaknesses in my work, and improved my mixes.  We all have blind spots, and these recordings let me hear mine objectively.

Listening to my recordings has been a VERY good thing for me. As for listening to this particular drummer?  Maybe, maybe not....
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Randy Culpepper

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Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2012, 12:53:07 pm »

I hate being micro managed. If you pay me to mix a show let me mix it. Give me the idea of your band and let me run with it. Don't constantly check me. Feel free to come out front during sound check and listen to the mix and let me know what you think. Every venue is different and if you simply want a fader jockey to move faders at specific points then you may as well program a computer to mix off a click track. Live music should be live and flow with the energy of the crowd. If I don't feel free to mix a band to the best of my ability and creativity they will never sound as good as they could.
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John Roberts {JR}

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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2012, 01:13:33 pm »

I hate being micro managed. If you pay me to mix a show let me mix it. Give me the idea of your band and let me run with it. Don't constantly check me. Feel free to come out front during sound check and listen to the mix and let me know what you think. Every venue is different and if you simply want a fader jockey to move faders at specific points then you may as well program a computer to mix off a click track. Live music should be live and flow with the energy of the crowd. If I don't feel free to mix a band to the best of my ability and creativity they will never sound as good as they could.

The customer is always right, even when they are wrong, as they often are. If they are paying you for your services you can always decline the gig.

The win-win, is to educate them about unwise choices by managing their expectations, and hopefully giving them what they want, when possible.

JR
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Don't tune your drums half-ass. Listen to what a properly "cleared" drum sounds like.   http://circularscience.com/

Patrick Tracy

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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2012, 01:20:15 pm »

If that method works why doesn't the drummer just fire the sound guy and mix from stage?

Timothy J. Trace

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Re: Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2012, 01:25:33 pm »

If that method works why doesn't the drummer just fire the sound guy and mix from stage?
Stand by for part two of Gordon's story.  ;)
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Rob Dellwood

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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #15 on: November 02, 2012, 02:36:31 pm »

I A/B'd my ZOOM H2 with a pair of KSM32's and a tube pre into an Alesis Masterlink. It's not the same, but it's very good. It's perfect for this!

I record most of my mixes with it. Listening to my mixes later has shown me strengths and weaknesses in my work, and improved my mixes.  We all have blind spots, and these recordings let me hear mine objectively.

Listening to my recordings has been a VERY good thing for me. As for listening to this particular drummer?  Maybe, maybe not....

I do this as well when mixing.  Helpful in improving ones mixes over time.  As to the OP, I'm wondering what kind of recorder the drummer is using?  Maybe it's junk and indeed is 'lying' to the drummer.  The portable Zoom recorder I use at FOH gives me excellent sound and reproduces well what is actually being heard at the show.

It's hard to believe that this drummer actually wants 'buried vocals and guitar'.  This makes no sense, especially for a 'variety pop band'.  I'd turn down the show, or take it, and mix it the way you think best for the room and material.  Worst that could happen is you won't be asked back, lol.   ;)
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Chuck Simon

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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #16 on: November 02, 2012, 02:56:21 pm »

The customer is always right, even when they are wrong, as they often are. If they are paying you for your services you can always decline the gig.

The win-win, is to educate them about unwise choices by managing their expectations, and hopefully giving them what they want, when possible.

JR
l
Right!  Basing a live mix on a recording is not good practice but doing what you are told to do by the person paying you is.
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John Roberts {JR}

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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #17 on: November 02, 2012, 03:15:59 pm »

Ironically perhaps, I quit my last comfortable, decent paying day job because I found myself arguing with the guy who signed my paychecks. So I understand the need to also satisfy yourself.


JR
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Don't tune your drums half-ass. Listen to what a properly "cleared" drum sounds like.   http://circularscience.com/

Gordon Brinton

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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #18 on: November 02, 2012, 04:09:23 pm »

...I'd turn down the show, or take it, and mix it the way you think best for the room and material.  Worst that could happen is you won't be asked back, lol.   ;)

(I'm the Original Poster.)

I've considered mixing it my way and having the luxury of never being asked back. But that may not be the best outcome in the long run.

1.) It would make the referring sound company look bad to the "now angry" client because they recommended me based on my professionalism.
2.) My own reputation would suffer as bands in this area tend to pass on word-of-mouth info about sound companies. One bad apple (dissatisfied client) can spoil the bunch.

I didn't want to turn down the show either, because I am helping the other sound guy resolve a scheduling conflict. I am free that night and, who knows, I may need the favor returned some day.
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Gordon Brinton

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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2012, 04:22:48 pm »

His portable recorder is a modern digital jobbie with two condenser mics sticking out the top. I am sure it sounds better than most old time recorders but still... I've learned from doing some serious home recording that the room changes the sound a little, the mic changes the sound a little, the playback system changes the sound a little, and the playback listening room changes the sound a little.

I don't care how you slice it, making critical mixing decisions based on a recording will yield different results than making mix decisions in person. Your ears hear it differently than a mic does.

But alas, I suppose I am being rail-roaded into doing it his way.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2012, 04:29:27 pm by Gordon Brinton »
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Re: Band makes judgement through a portable recorder.
« Reply #19 on: November 02, 2012, 04:22:48 pm »


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