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[Robert "VOiD" Caprio]

Lots of good info here Keith, take it all in, as it seems you are doing.  First things first... how old are the guys in the band?  As others have said, use the opportunity to "train" them now to learn how to play PROPERLY, without crushingly LOUD stage volume.  If they are teens, or really any age for that matter, that could be tough... but you have to be tougher.  They could do a lot of damage unless you start 'em on the right track NOW.  IEMs would definitely be beneficial but that's a whole other forum entry.

As to the issue at hand I had really great results with various bands of all genres and JBL MRX 525s (one per side) with two MRX 518 subs per side driven by Crown XTi-4K and 6K amps.  Stage volume was vigorously monitored.  I've heard great things from the powered QSC rigs too.  Bennett Prescott's article on a down-n-dirty club rig would likely provide even more fodder for you to ponder.

Slight topic swerve but this got me to thinking that as far as I know no manufacturer at the consumer level that makes powered speakers provides an equivalent turn-key, non-powered system... or does someone? Of course d&b and others have such systems but they are obviously far out of reach of the average club guys.

For example: take the amps and processing from a JBL VRX speaker (or what have you) and put it in a rack unit for those that would want to tweak things (or just take the weight out of the speakers).  Or does that not even make any sense?  Seems like if you go with a passive system you always have to do a lot more legwork to match up your drive rig to the speakers.

Oh, and by the way... since you are a self-professed "newbie" I would suggest finding someone experienced to hire for a day or two to help you out and get you going.  One day with someone explaining and showing you things will do more than a week (or more) with a book and your own experimentation.  There's likely a guy on here that is local to you that you could work out a mutually agreeable situation with.  If not, find a local sound co. and just flat out hire a guy for the first gig or two. 

[Bob Leonard]

It isnt.  Switching to a slow-blow fuse might be if some use in this case. However I felt there might be a liability issue. 

The resistor is a high resistance... i don't recall the value but is part of the power supply.
It doesn't carry 5 amps or need to.  When the fuse blows something unbalances and the resistor sees too much voltage.

The internal fuse supplies 100V DC to the 3 output sections.

Note: working on switching supplies is hazardous and should only be done by qualified personnel. 

It is kind of pretty and does have a nice metal RF shield. 

One other thing to note: my research indicates that this amp has been "revised". just what the revision is I do not know.  All my references here are for the model number that ends in 001

I was able to look at a very hard to read schematic. R644, R655, R656 are 255K resistors in series and appear to be tied directly to the output stage of the amplifier as part of a circuit used to provide a reference voltage to that stage. That's the high altitude synopsis which leads me to think you may have driven the speakers too hard for too long. I hate to throw that in, and I also hate to say that failing amplifiers is my biggest reason for not using powered cabinets. Had this happened to an amplifier powering one of my 725s I could have worked around the issue easily. But, without the amp on the bench and a clear schematic in front of me I can't confirm any of this.

[Kenny Deal]

Going with in ears opens an entirely new situation as far as costs and your mixer. You'll find lots of discussion on these throughout this board.

A consideration for powered speakers should be the Mackie HD1531 and HD1801 subs, pretty bulletproof and loud at a great price. You can find an extensive review on the discussion here I believe.

I would avoid Mackie speakers unless it is older Eaw/Italian made stuff. The HD series are throw away components. The circuit boards are not even servicable. I was up at Whitinsville at Performance Audios shop(Mackie authorized service) when he showed me the inside of one. He had alot of them there for service and did not have kind works about Makcie since Loud Technologies took them over. Go with JBL if your budget is tight or look at the RCF ART series. That was what the Mackie designs were based off and they are 10x better quality. I have chinese made MAckies and I can't give them away and have had nothing but trouble with them.
As far as power vs non powered I use powered because of portabily and I disagree with having all your eggs in one basket. In fact it's just the opposite. I have had an amp give out on one speaker and still had the other one to get through the set and then I'd swap another one out. Like anyone who does this for a living, you carry spare parts. I keep one extra amp, 1 extra driver and one extra horn. Atleast if a main amp gives out I still got one to finish the set and then I can swap out the amp in 10 mins with an electric drill. The reason I like the self powered stuff is in small venues I sometimes just use my Mackie 808s and the Powered mains aloow plenty of headroom while I use the powered side of the mixer for monitors. You wll have plenty of power for his band as long as you size the system to your needs. When in doubt, go bogger than you need. better to have extra headroom than push the gains to compensate.

[Kenny Deal]

ohhh Tampa! I'm picturing outdoor shows in the direct sunlight... here's what to do if you speaker thermals out if you happen to have a clip on fan with you. 

I like these 535's a lot and they get a lot of use and sound great.   This show was last year, 18 pc big band and it was brutally hot.

That is exactly what I do. Those clip on fans do alot.

[David Hayes]

I am probably the least qualified person here to give this advice, but from my personal experience I would think seriously about the powered speakers.  I am not in a metal band, but I am in a hard rock band ( Godsmack, Saliva, Tool, etc..).  When I started putting together our system I had no one giving me any advice.  I have bought some stuff that is now basically useless to us.  By the time I got good advice from guys here and other pros elsewhere I was already in pretty far.  Our system is decent ( Mixwiz, gang of Crown and QSC power amps, 6 or 7 passive 12" monitors which I loaded with Eminence drivers, 18" subs loaded with Eminence drivers, etc..)  The thing is I now have enough money in it to not be inclined to start over from scratch.  That said, if I had the budget and the advantage of this place as a resource when I started, I most likely would have went with all powered speakers and probably a digital console.

Anyway, these guys know what they're talking about and I'm sure you have a lot of good advice here.  Good luck with your son's band.

[Dave Wightman]

I have been using RCF powered speakers in small bars for a few classic rock cover bands (including my own) and love them! Every time I do a sound gig with them, I am more impressed by the sound and even prefer the sound of my RCFs to the PRX speakers I have heard. I am using the RCF Art312As as mains, but for a metal band, you will probably want something more powerful. In your case, I would take a look at the 700 series. You definitely will not be disappointed!

[Tim Perry]

I was able to look at a very hard to read schematic. R644, R655, R656 are 255K resistors in series and appear to be tied directly to the output stage of the amplifier as part of a circuit used to provide a reference voltage to that stage. That's the high altitude synopsis which leads me to think you may have driven the speakers too hard for too long. I hate to throw that in, and I also hate to say that failing amplifiers is my biggest reason for not using powered cabinets. Had this happened to an amplifier powering one of my 725s I could have worked around the issue easily. But, without the amp on the bench and a clear schematic in front of me I can't confirm any of this.

It's R610 24K 5% part of a voltage divider with one end tied to VBULK before the fuse.

It is at the top of the last page of the schematic set and can be viewed clearly by magnifying the file to 150 % and arrowing to the desired part of the picture.

It is R610 24K 5% - part of a voltage divider with one side tied to VBULK before the VBULK fuse.

[Scott Wagner]

It's R610 24K 5% part of a voltage divider with one end tied to VBULK before the fuse.

It is at the top of the last page of the schematic set and can be viewed clearly by magnifying the file to 150 % and arrowing to the desired part of the picture.

It is R610 24K 5% - part of a voltage divider with one side tied to VBULK before the VBULK fuse.

Have you deterimed what's causing the 5A fuse to take a dump?

[Sam Feine]

Back on the original topic, a pair of kw153 over a pair of kw181 is a very decent setup for a band just starting out. I have plenty of experience with the QSC stuff and have never had any sort if problems with it. Also as far as the board, deffinatly go digital, that way as you learn how to use things like compressors and gates you will have all that you could need at your finger tips. I have used the presonus and have played around with the Behringer x32, I was sceptical at first but found it to be an extremely useable little board and its motorized faders really put it ahead of the presonus in usability. That said its build qualaty isn't too great but it at least comes with a three year warranty.
When your factoring the cost of everything don't forget stands and cables as they are very neccisary and always cost more than you expect to pay, also a good snake is a much better purchase than a cheap one, look at whirlwind if you are going analouge or if you go with the X32 they have a digital snake box for it so you can run cat6 instead of heavy analouge snake cable.

Also one last thing, look toward getting a copy of yamaha's "exploring sound reinforcement" as well as the sound reinforcement hand book. It is an instructinal film that goes over most of the basics and would be a good thing to get you started and to show the band as well.

Hope this helps

[Tim Perry]

Have you deterimed what's causing the 5A fuse to take a dump?

Aerobics instructors with I-pods, Users pushing the switch to "MIC", users pushing the bass boost switch, lack of sub woofers,.. in short pushing it too hard.

The owner originality tried to do this with 70 volt ceiling speakers... about 16 i think. Blew them and the amplifier up the first day. 

[ProSoundWeb Community]