ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: [1] 2 3  All   Go Down

Author Topic: Problem with LED Par64's  (Read 15372 times)

Mark Holley

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
Problem with LED Par64's
« on: March 29, 2012, 03:01:02 PM »

I have 8 Par64 LED's... they are the cheaper brand (chinese made) 3 of them now have an intermittent problem.  They are 4 ch DMX with ch 1 being intensity and strobe speed, ch 2-4 RGB levels.....   The cans are working as you can set the dips to be a static color and that works fine... problem is when you set the DMX to the proper channel & plug in the DMX cable the can shows the proper color and then in about 3 seconds fades to off, while other cans on that channel stay lit.   I've moved them to other locations in the chain of lights and it does the same thing...  almost seems to be in the DMX out jack but why...  could it be a voltage thing?  Each can is presenting the same problem.  All the others are working perfectly.

Any help would be very appreciated...  Now have 5 working cans instead of 8 which sux a little :-(

Mark 
P.S.   I know you get what you pay for and I know they are inferior quality... bet hey I got all 8 for 150 bucks :-)  and I baby them, just need em to work till I can afford the real deal
Logged

Jonathan Kok

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 238
  • Toronto
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2012, 03:13:16 PM »

I have 8 Par64 LED's... they are the cheaper brand (chinese made) 3 of them now have an intermittent problem.  They are 4 ch DMX with ch 1 being intensity and strobe speed, ch 2-4 RGB levels.....   The cans are working as you can set the dips to be a static color and that works fine... problem is when you set the DMX to the proper channel & plug in the DMX cable the can shows the proper color and then in about 3 seconds fades to off, while other cans on that channel stay lit.   I've moved them to other locations in the chain of lights and it does the same thing...  almost seems to be in the DMX out jack but why...  could it be a voltage thing?  Each can is presenting the same problem.  All the others are working perfectly.

Any help would be very appreciated...  Now have 5 working cans instead of 8 which sux a little :-(

Mark 
P.S.   I know you get what you pay for and I know they are inferior quality... bet hey I got all 8 for 150 bucks :-)  and I baby them, just need em to work till I can afford the real deal
If the fixtures have any sort of integral DMX Termination, that may be the problem.  But at the price of the fixture, that's probably not the case.

Assuming you are actually using DMX cable (not mic cable), then my first suggestion would be to put a DMX Terminator at the end of the line.  If you don't want to buy one, see below for how to build one into an XLR connector.


http://www.blue-room.org.uk/wiki/DMX_Terminator

More than likely, though, is that the output is in no way isolated from the circuit board, so something going wrong on the circuit board (bad ground, bad wire, bad trace, etc) is back-feeding into the DMX line.
Logged

Mark Holley

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2012, 03:23:28 PM »

Not all the cables are DMX...  infact these lights are actually backwards polarity so had to make some polarity flippers out of barrel connectors (male to female barrels)  I'm using short 2' XLR cables between the cans and I actually have 4 DMX cables but XLR are mingled throughout the rig...

this is the fixture:  http://www.stageape.com/pages/cantu.html  they run about a bill per can... i got a good deal from a friend they were left over from an install i think

Thanks for the diagram.. pretty sure I can make that... so I just use a standard XLR male connector with nothing on the other end?



If the fixtures have any sort of integral DMX Termination, that may be the problem.  But at the price of the fixture, that's probably not the case.

Assuming you are actually using DMX cable (not mic cable), then my first suggestion would be to put a DMX Terminator at the end of the line.  If you don't want to buy one, see below for how to build one into an XLR connector.


http://www.blue-room.org.uk/wiki/DMX_Terminator

More than likely, though, is that the output is in no way isolated from the circuit board, so something going wrong on the circuit board (bad ground, bad wire, bad trace, etc) is back-feeding into the DMX line.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2012, 03:27:52 PM by Mark Holley »
Logged

Mark Holley

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2012, 03:41:05 PM »

Will the lights being backwards polarity make any difference in making the terminator?
Logged

TJ (Tom) Cornish

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4317
  • St. Paul, MN
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2012, 05:28:45 PM »

Will the lights being backwards polarity make any difference in making the terminator?
Nope, assuming by backwards polarity you mean pins 2 and 3 are reversed.  A terminator is just a resistor, which works the same way both directions.
Logged

duane massey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1727
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2012, 05:47:18 PM »

My troubleshooting 101 for these types of fixtures:

Set all to the same DMX address;
Hook them up;
IF the problem is constant, mark the suspect fixtures;
Put the suspects fixtures in different parts of the signal chain;
If the suspect fixtures still exhibit the issues, it's an internal issue w/ fixtures

I have had numerous issues with similar fixtures. Problems vary from bad power supplies, bad dip switches, bad components on PCB(s), bad xlr connectors, and loose/bad internal cable/connector assemblies. Most of the time it is not worth the trouble to try to fix.
If parts were available (yeah, sure) you could swap parts from a known good fixture to a known bad one until you ID the bad part, but this can be time-consuming and frustrating.
Good luck.
Logged
Duane Massey
Technician, musician, stubborn old guy
Houston, Texas

Mark Holley

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2012, 07:03:01 PM »

Thanks .....
Pretty much what Ive done as far as moving the cans to a different location in the chain, same result.... this same thing happened at a gig, and i took the back off and just pressed down on all the harness connections and the dip switch connector and the problem disappeared... well untill now... all these cans worked perfectly last weekend but now 2 are squilrey....   made the terminator (probably should be running one of those anyway) going to try that, if no success, then probably the can... they are cheap chinese stuff and I knew eventually this kinda thing would happen :-(

Might take the cans apart and wiggle stuff :-) sometimes that works...


My troubleshooting 101 for these types of fixtures:

Set all to the same DMX address;
Hook them up;
IF the problem is constant, mark the suspect fixtures;
Put the suspects fixtures in different parts of the signal chain;
If the suspect fixtures still exhibit the issues, it's an internal issue w/ fixtures

I have had numerous issues with similar fixtures. Problems vary from bad power supplies, bad dip switches, bad components on PCB(s), bad xlr connectors, and loose/bad internal cable/connector assemblies. Most of the time it is not worth the trouble to try to fix.
If parts were available (yeah, sure) you could swap parts from a known good fixture to a known bad one until you ID the bad part, but this can be time-consuming and frustrating.
Good luck.
Logged

duane massey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1727
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2012, 10:24:37 PM »

Yep, "wiggle stuff" is right up there with "whack it a few times" on my methodology.
Logged
Duane Massey
Technician, musician, stubborn old guy
Houston, Texas

Mark Holley

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 27
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2012, 10:54:42 PM »

Well I tried both the wiggle stuff and whack it methods...  :'(  no luck
What is odd though is I brought the cans inside and hooked just the 2 cans up to a simple 6 channel controller by themselves on channel 1 (after pushing around on the connectors, etc.) and they both worked fine... take them back to the garage and put them in the rig... they come on for about 3 secs then fade to off. back inside they work, and so forth...  I changed the location in the DMX chain and same results... tried putting them on channel 1 which is what worked on the little board, but nope...

I was thinking that maybe they just wont push the DMX on down the line... isn't DMX 24 volts on the line? And actually with them firs in the chain the rest of the lights still function properly.
Well, I think I just have to resolve to the fact they are now static up-lights, heh :-\

Now I have to replace them with probably more of the same since all my programs and chases are utilizing 4 ch cans.  I suppose I could replace with cans that are 3 ch and just skip the channels 1, 5, and 9 in their addressing if I can find some like that but they have to be ch 1=level, ch 2=R, ch 3=G, ch 4=B......  cant bear to reprogram 20 chases of 50 -100 steps each  :-[


Yep, "wiggle stuff" is right up there with "whack it a few times" on my methodology.
Logged

duane massey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1727
Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2012, 12:14:24 AM »

Yep, that's one of my biggest complaints about the industry in general. Very few manufacturers use the same channel line-up, even with 3-channel fixtures. One way or the other you will probably have to reprogram everything eventually.
DMX is just data, no voltage involved. I'm at a loss to explain what is going on with your fixtures, as DMX is just numbers, and the fading out just doesn't make sense. Unfortunately, goofy things happen, even with "name-brand" fixtures. I've discovered problems that the service dept said (literally) "That can't happen, it's not possible", and this includes High End, Martin, Chauvet, ADJ, Elation, etc.
Logged
Duane Massey
Technician, musician, stubborn old guy
Houston, Texas

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Problem with LED Par64's
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2012, 12:14:24 AM »


Pages: [1] 2 3  All   Go Up
 



Site Hosted By Ashdown Technologies, Inc.

Page created in 0.037 seconds with 22 queries.