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[Jim Kingsnorth]

I recently purchased a Mackie ProFX16 board for my ministry. It has built in effects, but I really want to use an effects processor with more to offer on the system. I have read the instruction manual and checked on the Mackie forum but cannot find out an answer to a question. The Mackie has a button to turn off the onboard effects. It has an effects loop for external effects but I am not sure if muting the onboard effects would also mute the external. Does anyone have one of these boards?

[Jay Barracato]

I recently purchased a Mackie ProFX16 board for my ministry. It has built in effects, but I really want to use an effects processor with more to offer on the system. I have read the instruction manual and checked on the Mackie forum but cannot find out an answer to a question. The Mackie has a button to turn off the onboard effects. It has an effects loop for external effects but I am not sure if muting the onboard effects would also mute the external. Does anyone have one of these boards?

It appears from the block diagram that the mute on the internal effects does not affect the output to the FX sends. Muting the external effects would depend on where yopu return the signal to the board.

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

I recently purchased a Mackie ProFX16 board for my ministry. It has built in effects, but I really want to use an effects processor with more to offer on the system. I have read the instruction manual and checked on the Mackie forum but cannot find out an answer to a question. The Mackie has a button to turn off the onboard effects. It has an effects loop for external effects but I am not sure if muting the onboard effects would also mute the external. Does anyone have one of these boards?

As Jay said, the "effects loop" is independent of the onboard FX mute. 

I'm a bit curious as to why you'd buy a "bargain" level board and not just use whatever comes built in.  The only reason to get such a unit would seem to be that it is very compact to use with the built-ins.  Otherwise, you're ending up replacing the "selling point features" with better quality stuff and having to live with fewer overall channels, a very limited 3-band channel strip EQ and such.  The USB thing is OK in principle, but unless you're using it in a rehearsal situation is probably more of an idea than a reality. 

I guess I'm in the "look for a good, used MixWizard" camp when it comes to bang-for-the-buck.  But that's just me and I'm sure you'll make very good use of what you've gotten.

Good luck.   

[Jim Kingsnorth]

As Jay said, the "effects loop" is independent of the onboard FX mute. 

I'm a bit curious as to why you'd buy a "bargain" level board and not just use whatever comes built in.  The only reason to get such a unit would seem to be that it is very compact to use with the built-ins.  Otherwise, you're ending up replacing the "selling point features" with better quality stuff and having to live with fewer overall channels, a very limited 3-band channel strip EQ and such.  The USB thing is OK in principle, but unless you're using it in a rehearsal situation is probably more of an idea than a reality. 

I guess I'm in the "look for a good, used MixWizard" camp when it comes to bang-for-the-buck.  But that's just me and I'm sure you'll make very good use of what you've gotten.

Good luck.

I plan on using the onboard effects most of the time, however there are going to be songs that I need more than what is built in. I don't need a ton of channels because the sound system is only for vocals. As for the USB, I will be using that for recording mini-sermons for my internet based radio station. The board fits all my needs, thats what matters. As for quality, I think Mackie makes a good quality mixer. But that is just me.

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

I plan on using the onboard effects most of the time, however there are going to be songs that I need more than what is built in. I don't need a ton of channels because the sound system is only for vocals. As for the USB, I will be using that for recording mini-sermons for my internet based radio station. The board fits all my needs, thats what matters. As for quality, I think Mackie makes a good quality mixer. But that is just me.

Sounds like it works for you.  I just have an aversion to 3-band EQ, but if you're not mixing more than a couple of sources you'll probably be OK.  And if you need more than that, you can always put a nice PEQ in the case with the outboard FX and insert it when and where it's needed.

[Jonathan Johnson]

As for the USB, I will be using that for recording mini-sermons for my internet based radio station.

Judging from your posts, it doesn't sound like you're doing any video, but for anyone reading this who IS planning to do video, there's a gotcha to watch out for: timing.

You can end up with timing issues when you record longer sessions and have one device recording digital video and other device recording digital audio, with the plan of joining them in post production. Mixing the two later on in the computer can result in synchronization problems (as the audio appears to speed up or slow down in relation to the video). This happens because the recording devices are not using the same time source, and their internal clocks have different rates of drift.

The only solution to this is wordclock synchronization, and pretty much only professional gear has wordclock capability, where all devices use the same time source.

Found this with a quick Google search: http://www.studiodaily.com/2009/09/keeping-audio-in-sync-wordclock-solutions/

[brian maddox]

Judging from your posts, it doesn't sound like you're doing any video, but for anyone reading this who IS planning to do video, there's a gotcha to watch out for: timing.

You can end up with timing issues when you record longer sessions and have one device recording digital video and other device recording digital audio, with the plan of joining them in post production. Mixing the two later on in the computer can result in synchronization problems (as the audio appears to speed up or slow down in relation to the video). This happens because the recording devices are not using the same time source, and their internal clocks have different rates of drift.

The only solution to this is wordclock synchronization, and pretty much only professional gear has wordclock capability, where all devices use the same time source.

Found this with a quick Google search: http://www.studiodaily.com/2009/09/keeping-audio-in-sync-wordclock-solutions/

well, this is correct.  but...

my experience has been that, unlike the old tape days, modern gear is capable of running very very close to in sync for significant periods of time even when free running during record.  i regularly resync audio and video sources that have been recorded on very different machines with little to no issues.  granted most of the time i'm syncing 5-10 minutes pieces, so a whole sermon might have an issue.  but i've done sermon audio resyncing successfully as well.

in short, your point is well taken, but i wouldn't go rushing out to buy all new genlocked gear unless you are experiencing an issue.  or you've got the budget to do it. 

[TJ (Tom) Cornish]

well, this is correct.  but...

my experience has been that, unlike the old tape days, modern gear is capable of running very very close to in sync for significant periods of time even when free running during record.  i regularly resync audio and video sources that have been recorded on very different machines with little to no issues.  granted most of the time i'm syncing 5-10 minutes pieces, so a whole sermon might have an issue.  but i've done sermon audio resyncing successfully as well.

in short, your point is well taken, but i wouldn't go rushing out to buy all new genlocked gear unless you are experiencing an issue.  or you've got the budget to do it. 

+1.  I had this problem a lot with my old Canon GL2, much less so with more current gear.  Even if there are sync issues, they're easy to fix for content like a sermon, as there are enough pauses in the audio where you can split the file and scooch it a bit to gain/lose time.

[g'bye, Dick Rees]

+1.  I had this problem a lot with my old Canon GL2, much less so with more current gear.  Even if there are sync issues, they're easy to fix for content like a sermon, as there are enough pauses in the audio where you can split the file and scooch it a bit to gain/lose time.

+1 again.  The videographer with whom I work most just says "no problem" if for some reason we have to use the CD backup audio.  It's a totally easy fix if needed.

[Jonathan Johnson]

+1 again.  The videographer with whom I work most just says "no problem" if for some reason we have to use the CD backup audio.  It's a totally easy fix if needed.

I agree, fixing sync in post-production is not technically challenging and for short content, not a big hassle. It can, however, be very time consuming, especially for a 45 minute sermon or an hour long lecture. For most people, the expense of gear that can automatically sync is out of the question.

(IME, I have an Alesis MultiMix 4 USB mixer. A friend who borrowed it to record some lectures found that he had significant sync problems in post-production when he tried to join the audio with video. I don't recall what camera he used, but previously he had used the same camera with audio recorded using a Marantz Pro CD recorder with no problems. My guess is that the MultiMix, being a $79 mixer, uses a quartz crystal for its internal clock that is quite a ways off of spec; perhaps the  manufacturer specified a very high tolerance.)

My aim was to make those who might be planning such a task aware of the issue (and the cause of it). I'm sorry if I've created any unnecessary FUD.

[ProSoundWeb Community]