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Author Topic: Blu ray players  (Read 4564 times)

Carl Wetter

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Blu ray players
« on: December 21, 2011, 02:13:03 pm »

Hey everybody!

I work in a theatre/concert hall where we show movies as well as do corporate presentations and any other event you can think of. We are getting a new projector (Digital Projection Titan 1080) and I am looking at picking up High Def video players, which means getting a Blu-ray or two. So I am looking for recommendations. It will be moved frequently, so being rack mountable would be nice, but otherwise it would not really need any home features, like streaming from the internet or multiple audio outputs.

Just a sturdy standalone type unit. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Carl
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Brad Weber

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Re: Blu ray players
« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2011, 05:14:11 am »

D&M Pro DBP-1611UDP/DBP-2012UDCIP or the Pioneer BDP-V6000.  Lots of other options out there but most either limit or void any warranty for professional/commercial (i.e. non-residential) use.
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Carl Wetter

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Re: Blu ray players
« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2011, 04:01:09 pm »

Thanks, Brad! Do you know if these read NTSC and PAL formats? Or does that not apply to Blu-Ray?
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Hayden J. Nebus

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Re: Blu ray players
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2012, 09:23:54 am »

Thanks, Brad! Do you know if these read NTSC and PAL formats? Or does that not apply to Blu-Ray?

Blu Ray discs are region encoded like DVDs. There are region free decks available. I'm not hip with the details, so I'll not pretend to know more.
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Clayton Ganzer

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Re: Blu ray players
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2012, 10:48:30 am »

Hey everybody!

I work in a theatre/concert hall where we show movies as well as do corporate presentations and any other event you can think of. We are getting a new projector (Digital Projection Titan 1080) and I am looking at picking up High Def video players, which means getting a Blu-ray or two. So I am looking for recommendations. It will be moved frequently, so being rack mountable would be nice, but otherwise it would not really need any home features, like streaming from the internet or multiple audio outputs.

Just a sturdy standalone type unit. Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Carl

Denon DBP-1611UD all the way. And save yourself some trouble, use the analog component out, yes it is just as good of quality.
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Brad Weber

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Re: Blu ray players
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2012, 11:52:59 am »

Denon DBP-1611UD all the way. And save yourself some trouble, use the analog component out, yes it is just as good of quality.
Yes, the component output can be high res, but related to this you might want to read http://media.extron.com/download/files/whitepaper/analog_sunset.pdf. The Analog Sunset requires that any Blu-Ray player manufactured after 12/31/2010 must limit any analog output to 480i/576i and any Blu-Ray player manufactured after 12/31/2013 must provide no analog output.  A few specifics:
  • This applies only to Blu-Ray, either standalone or in computers, as it is part of the Blu-Ray standard.  It does not apply to cable or satellite receivers, DVD players, computer graphics, etc.
  • The Analog Sunset applies only to AACS encrypted content, it does not apply to unencrypted content.  That would typically relate to commercially available discs with content protection.  However, while it may not make any sense to do so, the standards do not prohibit manufacturers from applying the output limitations to all content and at least for consumer/prosumer units, you may find Blu-Ray players that do not even have any analog outputs.
  • The dates listed are mandatory, however many products manufactured before those dates may comply with the provisions, i.e. a Blu-Ray player purchased now may provide no analog output for encrypted content starting 01/01/2014.
So the Analog Sunset is not an issue for many people playing back only Blu-Ray content they create, but it can be a factor where encrypted/protected content may be involved.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2012, 11:56:17 am by Brad Weber »
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Clayton Ganzer

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Re: Blu ray players
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2012, 12:17:28 pm »

Yes, the component output can be high res, but related to this you might want to read http://media.extron.com/download/files/whitepaper/analog_sunset.pdf. The Analog Sunset requires that any Blu-Ray player manufactured after 12/31/2010 must limit any analog output to 480i/576i and any Blu-Ray player manufactured after 12/31/2013 must provide no analog output.  A few specifics:
  • This applies only to Blu-Ray, either standalone or in computers, as it is part of the Blu-Ray standard.  It does not apply to cable or satellite receivers, DVD players, computer graphics, etc.
  • The Analog Sunset applies only to AACS encrypted content, it does not apply to unencrypted content.  That would typically relate to commercially available discs with content protection.  However, while it may not make any sense to do so, the standards do not prohibit manufacturers from applying the output limitations to all content and at least for consumer/prosumer units, you may find Blu-Ray players that do not even have any analog outputs.
  • The dates listed are mandatory, however many products manufactured before those dates may comply with the provisions, i.e. a Blu-Ray player purchased now may provide no analog output for encrypted content starting 01/01/2014.
So the Analog Sunset is not an issue for many people playing back only Blu-Ray content they create, but it can be a factor where encrypted/protected content may be involved.

Page 11 of the Manual states "This unit's component video output supports 480i/576i/480p/576p/720p/1080i output."

I have read many an article about this issue, thanks for you input. Good thing it's not 2013 or 2014 yet. I would implore you to read that article again yourself. Expect to see many more Blu-Ray players with analog component output after 2014. These regulations apply only to Decrypted AACS Content. There are many loopholes within these regulations and I have had manufacture representatives tell me they already have plans in place to circumvent these regulations. It is 2012 and the player I recommended is a great unit that will do everything you need it to do, as well as play analog HD over Component. Last point, this unit is VERY popular and you will still be able to obtain one on the used market will after 2020.
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Brad Weber

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Re: Blu ray players
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2012, 11:42:28 pm »

Page 11 of the Manual states "This unit's component video output supports 480i/576i/480p/576p/720p/1080i output."
However, the same page just below that also states "Copyright protected DVD is output in 480i/576i or 480p/576p."  So the analog component outputs do not support 720p/1080i for protected content or 1080p for any content, those require using the HDMI output.

I have read many an article about this issue, thanks for you input. Good thing it's not 2013 or 2014 yet. I would implore you to read that article again yourself. Expect to see many more Blu-Ray players with analog component output after 2014. These regulations apply only to Decrypted AACS Content. There are many loopholes within these regulations and I have had manufacture representatives tell me they already have plans in place to circumvent these regulations. It is 2012 and the player I recommended is a great unit that will do everything you need it to do, as well as play analog HD over Component. Last point, this unit is VERY popular and you will still be able to obtain one on the used market will after 2020.
  • It is after 12/31/2010, so the first element of restricting the analog output resolution for protected content has already been in effect for over a year, as exhibited by the DBP-1611UD.
  • As I understand it, non-compliant models introduced before 12/31/2010 could continue to be sold until 12/31/2011 and after that date they would have to either be discontinued or incorporate a software upgrade that would make them compliant.  We are now past that date, thus any Blu-Ray products being sold now or in the future would apparently be 'Analog Sunset' compliant.
  • It had already been noted that the resolution restriction applies to AACS encrypted, not decrypted, Blu-Ray content (although it apparently may also be applied to upscaling protected DVD content).  However, I also believe that per the Blu-Ray standards, Blu-Ray players have never supported 1080p for the component analog outputs even for non-encrypted content, as the DBP-1611UD reflects.
  • I know there are some other content protection schemes for professional equipment being discussed, however I'm not sure how the manufacturers would circumvent something that is part of the Blu-Ray standard and that they have agreed to follow, not to mention that is already implemented.
  • From what I can gather, manufacturers seem to be looking at digital outputs as the best option to address high resolution outputs, including encrypted/protected content.  Supporting both analog and digital outputs increases the component cost and physical connectivity required, so with HDMI, DVI, DisplayPort, etc. becoming commonplace it may become a simple manufacturing and cost decision to eliminate analog outputs.  I have already seen some laptops that have only digital video and audio outputs for pretty much those very reasons.
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Clayton Ganzer

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Re: Blu ray players
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2012, 12:04:50 am »

However, the same page just below that also states "Copyright protected DVD is output in 480i/576i or 480p/576p."  So the analog component outputs do not support 720p/1080i for protected content or 1080p for any content, those require using the HDMI output.
  • It is after 12/31/2010, so the first element of restricting the analog output resolution for protected content has already been in effect for over a year, as exhibited by the DBP-1611UD.
  • As I understand it, non-compliant models introduced before 12/31/2010 could continue to be sold until 12/31/2011 and after that date they would have to either be discontinued or incorporate a software upgrade that would make them compliant.  We are now past that date, thus any Blu-Ray products being sold now or in the future would apparently be 'Analog Sunset' compliant.
  • It had already been noted that the resolution restriction applies to AACS encrypted, not decrypted, Blu-Ray content (although it apparently may also be applied to upscaling protected DVD content).  However, I also believe that per the Blu-Ray standards, Blu-Ray players have never supported 1080p for the component analog outputs even for non-encrypted content, as the DBP-1611UD reflects.
  • I know there are some other content protection schemes for professional equipment being discussed, however I'm not sure how the manufacturers would circumvent something that is part of the Blu-Ray standard and that they have agreed to follow, not to mention that is already implemented.
  • From what I can gather, manufacturers seem to be looking at digital outputs as the best option to address high resolution outputs, including encrypted/protected content.  Supporting both analog and digital outputs increases the component cost and physical connectivity required, so with HDMI, DVI, DisplayPort, etc. becoming commonplace it may become a simple manufacturing and cost decision to eliminate analog outputs.  I have already seen some laptops that have only digital video and audio outputs for pretty much those very reasons.

DVD content is always 480i/576i or 480p/576p, regardless if itís Copyright protected or not. So both of our comments are correct. You didnít disprove that the analog output send HD signal. So the unit sends HD content out of analog from Blu-Ray disks and it sends out SD signal from DVD disk, that matches exactly what is on the disk. Thatís perfect considering you canít get HD content from a DVD disk.
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Re: Blu ray players
¬ę Reply #8 on: February 14, 2012, 12:04:50 am ¬Ľ


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