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Author Topic: Danley Sound Labs SM96 1st gig  (Read 18123 times)

John Halliburton

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Re: Danley Sound Labs SM96 1st gig
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2012, 07:07:31 pm »

Just a quick point of reference for the JTR T-8s - just did did an open barn type biker bar -> B-I-K-E-R <- bar and was asked to turn it D-O-W-N down. The T8s do Ok for themselves.

Wish they weren't 90s though.

I agree. For what they are, a really good product, along with the Triple 12. 

Best regards,

John
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Matt Pea

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Re: Danley Sound Labs SM96 1st gig
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2012, 09:17:53 pm »

I think you could do rock shows up to a point, and with subs.  The SM96 is pretty loud, puts more articulate full range sound in the pattern-certainly better than the typical two way trap up on sticks.

As always, it depends.

Attached is a shot of a show handled by Pinnacle Audio up in central Wisconsin.  Matt, the owner, has a pair of SM60's, which you can hopefully just make out up on stands on either side of the stage.  He's used this setup for about two years, with some TH115(IIRC) subs.  I'll shoot him a message, and ask him to comment.

Best regards,

John


Hey there,

(sorry about the length ::))

My system consists of two SM60Fs and 2 TH-118s, one per side. In some places I'll center cluster the subs - depends what sounds better in that room. In most circumstances, at least for me, it covers the room. The picture that John posted was a large ballroom and was the first show I used the Danley stuff on (it showed up the day before  :)). The SM60s covered the majority of the audience, but I added in some small center fills for up front. FOH was set up just shy of 100ft. out from the stage and I think I was mixing around 95-98dBC. The ceiling were pretty high, maybe 30ft. They were expecting a larger crowd then they got, so I could have been 15ft or so closer, but it worked out. The audience loved it!  Since it was the first day I didn't have system architect running - as that was new to me - so I'm not sure how the levels were looking with respect to the limiters that I set in the iTechs. The lighting tech was amazed at the sound from those little boxes. This is the smallest show he does every year and is used to listening to much larger setups. Before this point, I had never heard a Danley box. They definitely put a smile on my face  :D Crowd size: ~350

I did a show for the same group this past January, but in a smaller, odd shaped venue. FOH was somewhere in the 50ft range from stage with levels ranging (on average) from 98-108dBc, tickling the limiters on the louder transients. Here, I had an engineer from the audience come up and comment on how much he liked it: it was clean, intelligible and not overwhelming on the ears. Crowd Size: ~300

For outdoor gigs it has been hit or miss. There have been a few that went well, but I think it's because the 'stage' was significantly higher than the audience and I was able to place the stands at that level, pushing them higher in the air than usual. The subs have always given me enough juice, but the SM60s - even though it sounds clean - can lack outdoors (IMHO). The one thing I noticed outdoors though, is that you can walk a few hundred feet back and still understand everything that's being said. I've never been able to test that with the other rig I use, as the show is so involved, so I have nothing to compare it to aside from listening to others mix.

I did rent the subs to a group I tour with during the summer months for an outdoor show in Fond du Lac, WI to fill in the bottom end a bit. Their rig has four EAW SB-600e subs and four KF650e tops (2 each per side). On average, 2,000 people show up to this concert every summer. I ran my TH-118s on a separate send from the EAW subs and during sound check, I played around with the two brands a little. The 2 TH-118s (1 in each stack) were able fill the area with higher quality bass at the same SPL as the 4 SB600s. I didn't run like that for the show - as I'd never pushed them that hard before - but they did it. I'm assuming they had some headroom yet as they were getting 2kW each at 4ohms, and are rated higher. FOH was ~180ft from stage and around 25ft higher than the stage.

My favorite show, by far, that I used my Danley rig for was a group traveling through Madison called Jaron and the Long Road to Love. This system was perfect for the country music they played. This was in a square room with two ceiling heights: the high portion was around 25ft with the shorter area coming in around 15. I was about 30ft out averaging 105dBC at FOH. Here, the audience size was around 100. The band loved it and commented on how great it sounded.

I set the SM60s on Global Truss st-132 stands at whatever height I can get them at. Once they get above 8ft, I start using a couple tilters to aim them down slightly, usually only a few degrees. The SM60s and TH-118s are powered by iTech 4000s (1 per channel) with peak limiters set at 1600w and 2000w respectively. The tops are rolled off at 100Hz and the subs come in at 90Hz with a HPF at 30Hz.

This stuff works for what I do, but if I mixed much louder groups, I'd need some stuff with more horsepower. With my experiences with Danley, I'd probably go with the SH-46s with a pair on a side, using the SM60s as fills. Since I tour with a group all summer, using their system, I don't have a use for a large outdoor system, so what I have definitely does the job. The music the legends group does is stuff from Buddy Holly, Neil Diamond, the Blues Brothers, Elvis, Rod Stewart, Tom Jones, and the like. I've also mixed country and some harder rock on these. I'm thinking metal bands are probably out of the question for my rig, but that's okay ::)

One last thing (take this as you may): I mix the summer shows on the EAW system with a peak around 98-100dBC (average 90-92) and usually get a couple people complaining. I have never had a complaint using the Danley rig :)
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Rick Powell

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Re: Danley Sound Labs SM96 1st gig
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2012, 08:55:54 am »

Thanks, John, Ivan, Mike and Matt for your detailed information and insights.  Our choices in lightweight, high quality full-range boxes that can cover a variety of situations have certainly expanded in the last several years, with more to come.
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John Halliburton

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Re: Danley Sound Labs SM96 1st gig-update from 2nd gig
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2012, 05:59:28 pm »

I used the pair of SM96 cabinets last weekend, stacked on top of my JTR Orbit Shifters, in place of the Triks over Growlers shown in this older picture.  Everything else in the system was the same, so technically all the FOH speakers are "underpowered". ;>) Theater space seats 640.

I got to sit around for an hour playing music through the system, tweaking settings, checking coverage, etc.  I wound up with a crossover of 80hz/LR24 LPF for the subs, 90hz/LR24 HPF on the SM96's.  I didn't officially get to time align them, so went with the Smaart derived figure we measured when using Runts on top of the Orbit Shifters, app. 14ms. if I recall correctly.

As I'd estimated, the 90x60 coverage of the SM96's is almost perfect in this room deployed on either side of the stage.  I toed in the tops about 5 degrees, and pretty much had nice hf coverage across the whole front row, which is about eight feet back from the stage front.  The SM96's are roughly 80" above the main floor.

Balcony coverage was fine, and perhaps the first few rows up there in the middle are the best sounding seats in the house.

Now, the Triks won't win any efficiency contests on paper, they're rated at 95db @2.83volt/1m half space ground plane, vs. the SM96 which are 98db @2.83volt/1m whole space, PLUS the wider horizontal coverage. 

So one of the first things observed during soundcheck was how much more of the bandwidth was "in your face", and I mean that in a good way.  I was providing sound for the Makem/Spain Brothers, four very strong mature male singers-two tenor, two baritone, and Rory can push it down a bit into bass range.  They also play guitars, mandolin, banjo, bouzuki, concertina, whistle, and acoustic guitar style bass.

Typically, I was -7 to -10 db down on my main faders compared to similar concerts in there.  An added benefit was a cleaner stage sound, as the much larger horn in the SM96 reduces spill onstage.

A very cool design, and it only weighs 75lbs. too.

Oh, they loved the BMS wedges Curtis, Jack, and I designed.  Even got a testimonial from Connor to the crowd at the end of the show.  Very nice.

Best regards,

John
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Rick Powell

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Re: Danley Sound Labs SM96 1st gig-update from 2nd gig
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2012, 07:49:20 pm »

So you stacked them height-wise instead of width-wise to get a 90 deg vertical and a 60 deg horizontal, for main floor-to-balcony coverage?  Sounds like it was a cool gig.
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John Halliburton

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Re: Danley Sound Labs SM96 1st gig-update from 2nd gig
« Reply #15 on: May 03, 2012, 11:20:03 pm »

So you stacked them height-wise instead of width-wise to get a 90 deg vertical and a 60 deg horizontal, for main floor-to-balcony coverage?  Sounds like it was a cool gig.

No they were stacked in the 90deg horizontal position.  The photo shows my other speakers at an older show.  The Triks are 60x60, but the low freq section is not loaded into the horn, they're direct radiating.  The 60 degree vertical part of the pattern is plenty to hit the balcony in this venue.

Best regards,

John
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