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Author Topic: Wireless Volume Control  (Read 13727 times)

Karl Bader

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Wireless Volume Control
« on: December 05, 2011, 05:53:41 pm »

Hey All!

First wanted to say thank you in advance for your replies! It is much appreciated!

I am having a problem finding a solution for a low budget install we are doing. Basically it's a weight room sound system, blast music that can pump you up! The problem we are having is finding a solution to having wireless volume control of the system. That's all we need! A very simple RF remote would work great! We can't find anything like that! A simple plug in before it signal hits the amp and done would be fine. Ipod or Iphone control is an option but not ideal... Crestron or AMX is a bit budget breaking we believe.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Karl
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Scott Carneval

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2011, 06:33:04 pm »

Hey All!

First wanted to say thank you in advance for your replies! It is much appreciated!

I am having a problem finding a solution for a low budget install we are doing. Basically it's a weight room sound system, blast music that can pump you up! The problem we are having is finding a solution to having wireless volume control of the system. That's all we need! A very simple RF remote would work great! We can't find anything like that! A simple plug in before it signal hits the amp and done would be fine. Ipod or Iphone control is an option but not ideal... Crestron or AMX is a bit budget breaking we believe.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Karl

It's impossible to give any useful suggestions without more information about the existing system.
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Karl Bader

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2011, 06:41:33 pm »

It's impossible to give any useful suggestions without more information about the existing system.

Crown CTS amp, Rane 2 channel mixer, JBL Control speakers, Middle Atlantic Rack, Belden Wire... Rack in a back closet which is why the RF solution...

Thanks,

Karl
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Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2011, 10:38:12 pm »

Why does it have to be wireless? I also think that a wireless remote in a situation like that is going to walk or get lost.
 
-Hal
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Aaron Bott

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2011, 05:33:26 am »

Why not an IR kit and put the receiver in the room? Yes you still have to aim it at the nearest wall to the rack's closet but it's cheaper.
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Aaron Bott
Untouchable Productions

Please excuse any typos, abbreviations, or brevity as I frequently utilize my iPad to access PSW.

Brad Weber

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2011, 07:20:29 am »

Why not an IR kit and put the receiver in the room? Yes you still have to aim it at the nearest wall to the rack's closet but it's cheaper.
What would the distance be from the transmitter to the IR receiver and what would you actually be controlling?

I'm with Hal on this, a wireless remote seems likely to get lost, go dead, get stepped on (or have a weight dropped on it), etc.  If you can get cabling out to an IR receiver or anything like that then it seems likely that you could get a low voltage control cable out to a small wall plate volume control that controls a two channel VCA back at the rack, maybe something like http://www.rdlnet.com/product.php?page=169 and http://www.rdlnet.com/product.php?page=13.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2011, 07:40:14 am »

What would the distance be from the transmitter to the IR receiver and what would you actually be controlling?

I'm with Hal on this, a wireless remote seems likely to get lost, go dead, get stepped on (or have a weight dropped on it), etc.  If you can get cabling out to an IR receiver or anything like that then it seems likely that you could get a low voltage control cable out to a small wall plate volume control that controls a two channel VCA back at the rack, maybe something like http://www.rdlnet.com/product.php?page=169 and http://www.rdlnet.com/product.php?page=13.
ANd just to add-are you actually adjusting the volume that often?  Isn't the whole idea of an exercise/workout room to get exercise?

Then why not get up and WALK to the amp rack or a simple wall mounted volume control? 

If you go wall mounted there are much cheaper options.
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Ivan Beaver
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Karl Bader

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2011, 12:54:27 pm »

Really simple, we give the client what they want... This was the key that they wanted for the install...

Also I'm not sure that there is a pro-amp with IR capabilities... I know the CTS does not, which confuses me on your response. Also this is a college, things get stolen...

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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2011, 01:09:50 pm »

Really simple, we give the client what they want... This was the key that they wanted for the install...

If it was me-I would have checked out a solution before promising them anything.  So what sort of budget do you have for this?  I assume the customer is already OK with the budget?
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Ivan Beaver
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Brad Weber

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2011, 02:14:16 pm »

Really simple, we give the client what they want... This was the key that they wanted for the install...

Also I'm not sure that there is a pro-amp with IR capabilities... I know the CTS does not, which confuses me on your response. Also this is a college, things get stolen...
Okay, now I'm confused, are you looking for a handheld wireless remote that you know will likely be stolen, a permanently mounted wireless remote or some simple and inexpensive way to control the volume from out in the room?
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Karl Bader

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2011, 03:07:25 pm »

Okay, now I'm confused, are you looking for a handheld wireless remote that you know will likely be stolen, a permanently mounted wireless remote or some simple and inexpensive way to control the volume from out in the room?

The client simple wants to be able to adjust volume up and down on the system from in the room and doesn't want to be hassled with walking to a wall panel, I know doesn't make sense to me either... Also not sure why I am being ridiculed... the question is simply what product would work for wirelessly controlling the up and down volume on a sound system. RF preferred. something to go inline before the amp, or whatever, it should be affordable as this is a weight room, not a smart classroom.

Sorry if I sound frustrated... I asked the width of the window and I'm getting the length of the door reply!

Thanks,

Karl
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David Buckley

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2011, 04:14:15 pm »

If you get stuck you could always do a little system integration, a quick google found this kit on eBay...
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Brad Weber

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2011, 04:55:14 pm »

The client simple wants to be able to adjust volume up and down on the system from in the room and doesn't want to be hassled with walking to a wall panel, I know doesn't make sense to me either... Also not sure why I am being ridiculed... the question is simply what product would work for wirelessly controlling the up and down volume on a sound system. RF preferred. something to go inline before the amp, or whatever, it should be affordable as this is a weight room, not a smart classroom.

Sorry if I sound frustrated... I asked the width of the window and I'm getting the length of the door reply!
I understand your frustration but the fact that I cannot find a low cost line level audio volume control with a RF wireless remote may be one reason you are not getting simple answers.  Adding to that, although you can't always be successful at it, some probably believe that it is part of the job to help clients make smart decisions rather than to simply do what they want and want to make sure they are aware of the options available and the tradeoffs they represent. 

If you get stuck you could always do a little system integration, a quick google found this kit on eBay...
That may be the only way to do something like what is wanted without spending a lot but I see several concerns with that kit in this type of application.  It only handles unbalanced audio.  The remote is labeled A and B rather than up and down or something that would makes sense to any users.  And you are sticking a hobby electronics kit into an installed system so you would probably want to be very sure it is reliable and not going to end up eventually costing you time and/or money or even the client.
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Karl Bader

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2011, 06:39:34 pm »

If you get stuck you could always do a little system integration, a quick google found this kit on eBay...

That's what we were looking for! We bought one to test and see if this would work for us... Thanks for the link! We were doing a bunch of different searches with no competent results.
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Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #14 on: December 06, 2011, 06:41:13 pm »

Quote
The client simple wants to be able to adjust volume up and down on the system from in the room and doesn't want to be hassled with walking to a wall panel...

I'm at a loss to even understand how a wireless remote would be used in a weight room. Where would it be? Is there a trainer or other staff that would keep it in their pocket?
 
Quote
... some probably believe that it is part of the job to help clients make smart decisions rather than to simply do what they want...

I happen to be one of them and that's probably why you think you are being ridiculed.
 
-Hal
 
 
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Karl Bader

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #15 on: December 06, 2011, 06:52:59 pm »

I understand your frustration but the fact that I cannot find a low cost line level audio volume control with a RF wireless remote may be one reason you are not getting simple answers.  Adding to that, although you can't always be successful at it, some probably believe that it is part of the job to help clients make smart decisions rather than to simply do what they want and want to make sure they are aware of the options available and the tradeoffs they represent. 
That may be the only way to do something like what is wanted without spending a lot but I see several concerns with that kit in this type of application.  It only handles unbalanced audio.  The remote is labeled A and B rather than up and down or something that would makes sense to any users.  And you are sticking a hobby electronics kit into an installed system so you would probably want to be very sure it is reliable and not going to end up eventually costing you time and/or money or even the client.

Brad,

I appreciate your post, I really do, but that's honestly not what we were looking for. The company I work for has been in this area for 30 years. Aot of our clients we too have had that long. In the past 13 years we haven't had to do any marketing for our business, and it has continually grown through word of mouth... I came to this company over others in the area because of its ethics and values... Just to give you an idea, we own speaker boxes that are about 20 years old and have never been repainted... Myself, I've done high end installs that I'm not even aloud to tell you about. If we can't walk away from something without feeling good about it, we won't do it.

This post didn't need this whole explanation, I thought. We were looking for a simple solution. The major reason I don't frequent the forums here is egos and politics... I'll only come on when I have a question that needs answering...

Thanks,

Karl
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Karl Bader

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #16 on: December 06, 2011, 07:01:09 pm »


I'm at a loss to even understand how a wireless remote would be used in a weight room. Where would it be? Is there a trainer or other staff that would keep it in their pocket?
 
I happen to be one of them and that's probably why you think you are being ridiculed.
 
-Hal
[/quote

I am too... I was asked a simple task, to find a device to control volume wirelessly. We wanted rf because we didn't want a you have to point it here solution. I didn't sell the job, or do client relations for it. Heck I didn't even do the design. I was asked to help find a solution.... We often get unique requests where we need to do out of norm things. I just put in vca control for a cd player in a rack. You might say we needed to put in a knob mixer before the rpm-88. Nope, a simple volume pot on a rack panel to a vca control before the input.. We have a strong belief in creating less control for a client who doesn't need it...
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2011, 08:13:42 pm »


This post didn't need this whole explanation, I thought. We were looking for a simple solution. The major reason I don't frequent the forums here is egos and politics... I'll only come on when I have a question that needs answering...

Thanks,

Karl
One thing you have to remember is that lots of people come here and ask questions and have no idea what they are asking for-or what the repercussions of what they are asking might be.

THAT is why people are second guessing what the intentions might be.  If it doesn't make sense, then people wonder why.
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Ivan Beaver
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Tom Young

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2011, 07:53:08 am »

This post didn't need this whole explanation, I thought. We were looking for a simple solution. The major reason I don't frequent the forums here is egos and politics... I'll only come on when I have a question that needs answering...

And I can promise you that we will be just as cautious and skeptical as you find us to be now.

Make sure you buy a dozen or so extra remote controls. You're going to need them.
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Tom Young
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John Livings

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2011, 04:13:36 pm »

May I suggest the Bose X-10 as it comes with a remote.

You could actually drive two of them with a splitter.

In a small weight room, it would be "loud".

And as Tom stated, you can buy extra remotes.

Regards,  John
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Tom Young

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2011, 06:05:13 pm »

May I suggest the Bose X-10 as it comes with a remote.

You could actually drive two of them with a splitter.

In a small weight room, it would be "loud".

And as Tom stated, you can buy extra remotes.

Regards,  John

I should elaborate, as the reasons behind my comment about the remote control were not clear.

As shown on the Ebay page, the remote control kit has small plastic remote control (transmitter) which is somewhat akin to a remote starter for your car. Based on its size, apparent construction and the price of this kit, my intuition is that this is fragile. It also has a telescoping antenna. Although it obviously has a battery, there is no mention of what model battery is used. So here's what I expect will happen:

It'll get trashed by feet or barbells.

The antenna will eventually break.

The battery will die and it may die often.

Replacing the battery may, or may not, not result in the housing being put back together properly. Screws will get lost in the process.

If worn by an employee, there may be "sweat out" which will render the transmitter useless.

If worn by an employee, it will end up in their locker or at home.

Summary: this is not a good solution for the client.

I don't expect the OP to agree with this (hell, he may not even come back to read it) and state it solely for those who want to at least consider what we all have been cautioning about.
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Tom Young
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John Livings

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Re: Wireless Volume Control
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2011, 08:25:48 pm »

I should elaborate, as the reasons behind my comment about the remote control were not clear.

As shown on the Ebay page, the remote control kit has small plastic remote control (transmitter) which is somewhat akin to a remote starter for your car. Based on its size, apparent construction and the price of this kit, my intuition is that this is fragile. It also has a telescoping antenna. Although it obviously has a battery, there is no mention of what model battery is used. So here's what I expect will happen:

It'll get trashed by feet or barbells.

The antenna will eventually break.

The battery will die and it may die often.

Replacing the battery may, or may not, not result in the housing being put back together properly. Screws will get lost in the process.

If worn by an employee, there may be "sweat out" which will render the transmitter useless.

If worn by an employee, it will end up in their locker or at home.

Summary: this is not a good solution for the client.

I don't expect the OP to agree with this (hell, he may not even come back to read it) and state it solely for those who want to at least consider what we all have been cautioning about.

With everything considered wouldn't it simpler to have each member use their own iphone/ipod/MP-3 player with ear buds and turn it up and select songs themselves.

Kind of like what millions of people now already do.

I agree with all the posts questioning the wisdom of doing something like this in the first place.

In reality, who would want an Amped up Ape touching someone else's equipment?

Even worse if the area is shared, I could see an incident of "Roid Rage" happening in a weight room no less.

Regards,  John
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