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Author Topic: Danley Review  (Read 30420 times)

leon garrity

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Danley Review
« on: July 03, 2010, 08:26:34 pm »

Well first weekend for the Danley SH100/SM60F/TH115 set up....

The first night i used the system was not very good as i used a main Left Right/Aux Sub mix and if im honest it sounded not very good,it was quite a hash but not of the boxes sounding bad but down to the fact i didn,t do a proper set up.More of a rush job.
I set the
tops to a 65hz 24db BW/20kHz 6 db BW
subs to a 25hz 24db BW/75 hz 24db BW

the tops sounded not very full and quite harsh,the subs sounded a little mushy,not the boxes but due to to user set up more so i think.

Tonight was a different matter i used a full stereo mix with the same settings as above also with the SH100 being brought into play as a side fill as it was an awkward shaped venue,i have to say i think this is an amazing box and if im honest it sounds a little sweeter than the SM60 but thats my opinion,although albeit not as loud but it is an amazing box.

When my Bass player sang i went around the room to listen i was amazed how the sound was even throughout,very full and no holes in the sound,it projected very well but with a smoothness all round,in comparison to my old EAW rig it sounds just as fullif not fuller but with more coverage,Even though EAW states that the KF695 is 133 db max i think that the SM60 is a louder box but nicer on the ear,when i used the Gunness focusing from the UX8800 on the EAW it sounded sweet but IMO it lost feel.The Danleys did not and that had no processing apart from the simple BW slopes applied.

I know this is my first 2 days using the rig and once set up properly it is going to be everything i thought it would be,all in all im really happy with what i have heard so far.My next thing to do is another 2 SH100 to use as extra coverage and also the Danley processor rather than the UX8800.

If anyone has any advice for me then please feel free to offer as i just want the best from the rig,whether im using the correct crossover setting's etc.

Leon
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Reggie Kendrick

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2010, 11:58:21 am »

leon garrity wrote on Sat, 03 July 2010 20:26

Well first weekend for the Danley SH100/SM60F/TH115 set up....


I set the
tops to a 65hz 24db BW/20kHz 6 db BW
subs to a 25hz 24db BW/75 hz 24db BW

the tops sounded not very full and quite harsh,the subs sounded a little mushy,not the boxes but due to to user set up more so i think...

Leon


Hey Leon,

If I'm not mistaken, I believe part of your issue is having your tops conflict in the 65Hz-75Hz range with the sub.  I would think you should have your tops start at 85Hz-90Hz with a longer slope since your subs end at 75Hz.  The way you have it set up would yield a muddy/mushy sound in that frequency area.

Langston Holland

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2010, 07:43:12 pm »

Leon wrote:

My next thing to do is another 2 SH100 to use as extra coverage and also the Danley processor rather than the UX8800.

If anyone has any advice for me then please feel free to offer as i just want the best from the rig,whether im using the correct crossover setting's etc.


Hi Leon:

Both the UX8800 and Danley processors have more than enough power to address anything you'll need to do with your new loudspeakers. You do not need to buy a Danley processor to optimize the performance of your Danley loudspeakers, but if you need another processor it's a good choice.
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2010, 08:03:38 pm »

Langston Holland wrote on Sun, 04 July 2010 19:43

Leon wrote:

My next thing to do is another 2 SH100 to use as extra coverage and also the Danley processor rather than the UX8800.

If anyone has any advice for me then please feel free to offer as i just want the best from the rig,whether im using the correct crossover setting's etc.


Hi Leon:

Both the UX8800 and Danley processors have more than enough power to address anything you'll need to do with your new loudspeakers. You do not need to buy a Danley processor to optimize the performance of your Danley loudspeakers, but if you need another processor it's a good choice.

Agreed.  His money would be better spent on another loudspeaker.

The Danley processor does not have any "presets" in it.  So there is no advantage there.

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For every complicated question-there is a simple- easy to understand WRONG answer.

Can I have some more talent in the monitors--PLEASE?

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Danley Sound Labs

leon garrity

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2010, 09:23:25 pm »

Hi Langston,

I dont know if im using the UX8800 correctly?????

I will explain how i have got it set up.
Output 1 & 2 tops   from input A & B
Output 3 & 4 subs     "" "" "" ""
output 5 centre speaker from input D

Now on the X OVER function i dont know if i have set it wrong?

where it says frequency, there is an upper and lower frequency
is the top one the LPF say from where you want it to start and the bottom one the HPF where you dont want it to go above? or have i got them wrong?
i have set on outputs  1 & 2 top frequency setting at 65 hz 24db bw,bottom frequency set at 20 khz 24 db bw.
i have set  on outputs 3 & 4 top frequency set to 25 hz 24db bw
bottom frequency set at 85hz 24db bw.But i am having to add 8db of gain just for it to match or it gives very little to the amp?????

Im not familiar in using the UX8800 as a system processor?????????



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Langston Holland

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #5 on: July 04, 2010, 10:17:55 pm »

Hi Leon:

I own a couple of UX's and can help you figure out how to set it up, but I need to understand what your goal is first.

Three questions:

1. Do you want to have independent control over sub volume from your console by using another output in addition to the two you'll be using for the left and right mains?

2. Do you want the center loudspeaker to have a different mix in it than the left and right mains, or a summation of the two?

3. Do you want to have independent control over center loudspeaker volume from your console?

If you want independent volume control from your console of all of the above, you'll need (4) outputs on your console with the ability to send what you want to each of them. You can achieve an excellent result just using the left and right outputs and have the processor route things as needed. It just depends on your taste and console's ability.

I'm going to have both SM60F's and TH115's at my disposal later this week, but I'm slammed with shows through the 11th. If you can give me clear answers to the above I'd be glad to develop a preset that you can load, study, then try out.
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leon garrity

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #6 on: July 05, 2010, 02:01:22 am »

Hi Langston,

many thanks for your reply,im going to set different settings so to speak,i will explain then you can grasp my goal.

The console i use for my shows is the Presonus Studiolive 16,4,2
the reason beingits got everything in one console,comps,gates etc....
it has main left/right and a mono sum but not independent on a slider it works in conjuction with the main slider but there is a gain pot on the back to level up with which goes from -80 to +6db of gain.....

My options are this.
Main Left/Right tops SM60f
Aux Sub TH115
Mono summed centre SH100, now i tried this way and to be honest even setting the SM60 to 65hz at the low end they didnt give much in the way of bottom end vocal,unlike the KF695z did.They sounded very bright too bright really for my liking also the SH100 sounded beautiful from the mono sum output and that had a 160Hz crossover applied,but whether that was because it was recieving both left and right i dont know?
The subs were a little mushy on an Aux send,i couldnt really find how to blend them effectivly enough for my liking.
Also because the centre was summed and the mains were split left and right the SH100 shone out and seemed louder with less power and less sensitivity so whether that would cause problems i dont know,just for curiosity after last nights gig i sent the mono sum through all the UX8800 inputs and it sounded the same across the front of house very full and even in tone, i know some people dont like using full stereo ,but we use Backing tracks created in stereo and i like to keep it that way as i was told mono summing a stereo track can cause phase problems??????
so i have three ways of doing it.

1. Stereo mains and subs/mono sum centre.
2. Stereo mains and aux sub/mono sum centre.
3. All mono sum.

but then does the 3 different ways need to be given different crossover points.Also the UX8800 imports i think a factory set limiting/compression when you set your map.Does this work for Danley boxes even in system processing mode? or does that need to be turned off?
The thing which puzzled me the most when i did a full stereo mix for the tops and subs i had to apply a 10 db gain to the subs on outputs 3/4 to bring it back in line?????????

I hope all what i have written makes sense,thankyou for your advice.kindest reguards Leon
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #7 on: July 05, 2010, 09:52:03 am »

A couple of thoughts.

Are you absolutly sure that your wiring to the SM60's doesn't have a polarity reversal somewhere?  It could be in the signal or speaker cables or in a bridge setting on an amp or possibly an output polarity setting on the DSP.  It sounds like you may be getting a LF cancellation.

Try this.  Just using the Sm60's (no subs or Sh100)put them side by side-hardpacked angled sides together-not both facing forward.

Now in the DSP make sure both output channels are identical.  If there is a copy/paste function that copies the whole output channel-then use that.

Now listen to some material that has a good amount of low freq.

In the DSP flip the polarity of ONE of the outputs (not both).  Did you get more bass or less-ignore what happens to the mid/highs?  If you got more bass-then you have a polarity reversal somewhere.  If you got less-then your wiring etc is correct.

Regarding the sub output, adding level is normal-for a couple of reasons.  There is loss associated with the crossover filters.  Also typically our ears "want" the bass to be louder-so it sounds even with the higher freq.
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For every complicated question-there is a simple- easy to understand WRONG answer.

Can I have some more talent in the monitors--PLEASE?

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dB Audio & Video Inc.
Danley Sound Labs

Tim McCulloch

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #8 on: July 05, 2010, 12:25:08 pm »

Specifically addressing the issue of added gain to the subwoofer band pass, it's fairly typical.

In the VerTec v.4 presets, the 4889/4880 preset increases the sub output by 10dB relative to the LF band pass.

While you might have some other things going on (and it sounds like you need some time to sort through stuff), adding gain to the subs isn't unusual.

Have fun, good luck.

Tim Mc
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Danley Review
« Reply #9 on: July 05, 2010, 05:51:10 pm »

Tim McCulloch wrote on Mon, 05 July 2010 12:25

Specifically addressing the issue of added gain to the subwoofer band pass, it's fairly typical.

In the VerTec v.4 presets, the 4889/4880 preset increases the sub output by 10dB relative to the LF band pass.

While you might have some other things going on (and it sounds like you need some time to sort through stuff), adding gain to the subs isn't unusual.

Have fun, good luck.

Tim Mc


And you typically don't run into any overload issues as the level has been reduced through the crossover "action" and the gain is just to get it back up.
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For every complicated question-there is a simple- easy to understand WRONG answer.

Can I have some more talent in the monitors--PLEASE?

Ivan Beaver
dB Audio & Video Inc.
Danley Sound Labs
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